feel like both of those things are different kinds of suck
― more polls about food and reactionary art (Noodle Vague), Monday, 3 July 2017 23:15 (seven years ago) link
"rock star" is now established corporate lingo indicating nothing in particular
― qualx, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 02:21 (seven years ago) link
Had a polite discussion with a female editor co-worker of mine over the phrase "girl boss".
As in "Check Out These 7 'Girl Bosses' Leading the Pack" for a profile compendium of women executives in our metro.
She was in favor, I was against, but the last thing I want to be accused of is mansplaining the phrase "girl boss" to a female compatriot of mine.
― pplains, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 03:19 (seven years ago) link
^different generations seem to think differently about stuff like that
― A is for (Aimless), Tuesday, 4 July 2017 03:26 (seven years ago) link
You would know, I guess.
― pplains, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 03:27 (seven years ago) link
I've seen more than a few generations so far. My grandparents were all born in the 19th century. Seen at least on generation coming up after me born in the 21st century. So, yeah, I've got anecdotal ground to stand on.
― A is for (Aimless), Tuesday, 4 July 2017 03:32 (seven years ago) link
Gransplaining
― quet inn tarnation (darraghmac), Tuesday, 4 July 2017 11:59 (seven years ago) link
Re: PoC
I just use non-white. It's the clearest you can get. Some non-white people from countries where they are the majority hate the term PoC and think it should only be used in places where they are minorities.
― Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 12:29 (seven years ago) link
Really hating "big bad" for main villain.
― Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 12:30 (seven years ago) link
"Non-white" is problematic because it centres whiteness, though.
― emil.y, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 15:10 (seven years ago) link
Isn't PoC still doing that but a bit less blatant?
― Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 15:18 (seven years ago) link
yes, it's implicit ('people without colour' has a nice, 'man without qualities' sort of ring to it). I lean towards 'ethnic minorities' when applicable, but it's not possible to have neatly unproblematic terms about an inherently problematic concept imo.
― ogmor, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 15:22 (seven years ago) link
^ this is so crucial to understand
― k3vin k., Tuesday, 4 July 2017 16:31 (seven years ago) link
Ogmor OTM.
― emil.y, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 16:32 (seven years ago) link
My answer is basically not to state that some terminology or other is somehow objectively best, but to keep my ears open and listen to what non-white/PoC/BAME voices ask to be identified as. Yes, that will change over time, and yes, groups and individuals may have conflicting desires, but it's actually not that hard to listen and change your vocabulary as necessary.
― emil.y, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 16:36 (seven years ago) link
I agree with emil.y
Also like to add that I think it's more important to be kind, respectful and understanding of others than to know a correct lexicon of terms < strikes me as a problem with current PC culture
― Unchanging Window (Ross), Tuesday, 4 July 2017 19:06 (seven years ago) link
Sure, as long as you are receptive enough to others' feelings to update your lexicon - you can only plead ignorance once
I really wish PoC wasn't the term most in vogue as it sounds awkward and silly to me, and I tend to use "non-white" when I want to refer to all people who aren't white as a single group because I think you might as well centre the (bad) construct of whiteness in that case, but I'm at the point that I would only really use threads like this where we get pissy about linguistic minutiae to say so
― blog haus aka the scene raver (wins), Tuesday, 4 July 2017 19:18 (seven years ago) link
This is a good piece that has a bunch of critiques of some of the current terms, including PoC.
http://vajra.me/2015/04/15/margin/
And yes, I get most of my race and lgbt reading through speculative fiction authors.
― Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 19:34 (seven years ago) link
Haha of course you do
― blog haus aka the scene raver (wins), Tuesday, 4 July 2017 19:36 (seven years ago) link
RAG against the machines
― quet inn tarnation (darraghmac), Tuesday, 4 July 2017 19:38 (seven years ago) link
But they are quite good at it (apart from the hard right), since they're always thinking about radical changes and different societies
― Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 19:45 (seven years ago) link
I wasn't having a go it was just a pvmic, I p much share your feelings here (and also re big bad, awful term)
― blog haus aka the scene raver (wins), Tuesday, 4 July 2017 19:49 (seven years ago) link
I feel kind of like a hypocrite using the term "people of colour" on ilx or twitter or wherever just because I can't imagine actually saying it in the presence of any of the people of colour/non-white people/etc that I know irl. (I guess this depends on what circles you move in? I feel like most of the ppl I interact with on a day to day basis would be weirded out by me using the term PoC in conversation, but maybe I'm wrong idk) (NB not that I'm going around constantly making explicit reference people's ethnicity or anything)
― soref, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 19:50 (seven years ago) link
I've never heard a uk person say it out loud, it's a US (& therefore internet) thing
― blog haus aka the scene raver (wins), Tuesday, 4 July 2017 19:58 (seven years ago) link
emil.y is correct and wise
darraghmac has caused me to laugh
that is all
― honda for the goyim (Ye Mad Puffin), Tuesday, 4 July 2017 20:59 (seven years ago) link
solitary posts
― blog haus aka the scene raver (wins), Tuesday, 4 July 2017 21:00 (seven years ago) link
i am really tired of this weird trend in mostly article writing of referring to any group of marginalized people as "folks" ie "black folks", "trans folks", "lgbt folks" even "folks of color" (???)
it seems like it's supposed to be careful wording but it always sticks out and i have no idea what the point of it is. just say people ??
― qualx, Tuesday, 4 July 2017 21:17 (seven years ago) link
haha I think that's not great but paradoxically I endorse "folks of colour"
― blog haus aka the scene raver (wins), Tuesday, 4 July 2017 21:19 (seven years ago) link
"Take"
― billstevejim, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 03:27 (seven years ago) link
referring to "take" as a noun used as a synonym for "opinion"
hot take bill
― Number None, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 06:34 (seven years ago) link
funny
― billstevejim, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 07:01 (seven years ago) link
'make' as a noun has always sounded clumsy to me, often should be brand instead, get rid
― ogmor, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 08:09 (seven years ago) link
Name is so much better than brand imo
― quet inn tarnation (darraghmac), Wednesday, 5 July 2017 08:39 (seven years ago) link
Autocorrect better than either obv
'make' is better than 'brand' because linkedin and twitter aren't besieged with 50 billion posts/articles about "make strategies" or "make awareness" or "your personal make"
― Autumn Almanac, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 08:45 (seven years ago) link
core make proposition
― President Keyes, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 13:01 (seven years ago) link
make thoughts
― quet inn tarnation (darraghmac), Wednesday, 5 July 2017 13:05 (seven years ago) link
"we tortured some folks"
― marcos, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 13:28 (seven years ago) link
"make and model" v common acceptable imo
― Mordy, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 14:14 (seven years ago) link
well if mordy thinks so I might have to reconsider
― ogmor, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 14:23 (seven years ago) link
I keep on thinking about Bryan Ferry.
― Mud... Jam... Failure... (aldo), Wednesday, 5 July 2017 14:30 (seven years ago) link
xp idk it maybe is more of an industry term of art? but ime it's super common esp regarding cars & industrial equipment
― Mordy, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 14:35 (seven years ago) link
punching up / punching down
get a new excuse for why it's ok for u to punch but not for someone else
― Mordy, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 14:38 (seven years ago) link
'make' as a noun was also rife at my high school but it didn't stop everyone sounding like non-native speakers
― ogmor, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 14:42 (seven years ago) link
lol telling someone to 'get' something and bad faith use of 'excuse' both strike me as much more heinous than fisticuffs as a shorthand for power dynamics
― ogmor, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 14:47 (seven years ago) link
i take exception to about 99% of that response
― Mordy, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 14:49 (seven years ago) link
"power dynamics" also a terrible terrible idiom tho
― Mordy, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 14:50 (seven years ago) link
ilx is the best place to take exception imo
― ogmor, Wednesday, 5 July 2017 14:53 (seven years ago) link
iirc I """"called"""" out pu/pd within about ten mins of first ilx use Mordy so you'll have to relinquish the rights to this one iirc
― quet inn tarnation (darraghmac), Wednesday, 5 July 2017 15:20 (seven years ago) link