Let's bitch about our stupid, annoying co-workers

Minor complaint because he's an otherwise great guy so far, but a relatively new person in our office is the sloooooooooooooooooooowest talker.

oh geeeeeez, there was a guy like that who was the property manager/super at one of our client sites (he still is, I think, but I am not involved in that project in the same capacity as I was 2 years ago) ... between him and my extremely verbose co-worker, every conversation took way longer than I felt necessary.

Yeah, every time he comes over to ask a question I know there's 15 minutes of my day gone.

meanwhile, at another job, they received grant funding so that they can pay volunteers to staff/manage events at the space, which is good because they've always had trouble retaining good volunteers. Paying people helps with retention.

One of the volunteers who was feeling burnt out suddenly, with the promise of pay, is more enthusiastic to work on events. I'll call this volunteer, Volunteer A.
When news circulated about this grant funding and event volunteers getting paid, a volunteer who had quit last fall, Volunteer B, suddenly resurfaces and says, "I would be willing to come back and work events if I got paid." ... Volunteer B had been paid last summer for some events work.

And of course, the reason for posting this, is that Volunteer A and Volunteer B don't get along ... or if they do, it's totally surface-level, because they shit-talk one another to me. Volunteer B believes that Volunteer A is incompetent and irresponsible. Volunteer A believes that Volunteer B is "not all that" and exaggerates their degree of skill and value, and is also mean.

They are both adults. It reminds me that adults often exhibit "childish" behavior.

Yeah, while I've always encountered adults that act like children over the years, I've run into a significantly higher number of them since working in an academia adjacent job.

Meanwhile, I've now had the same coworker twice call me when I'm in a meeting, leave no voicemail and immediately text me to call him "as soon as I possibly can". Both times when I've called him back, it was to tell me that he is about to send me an email.

Good grief, just send me the damned email.

it makes me wonder how they have been trained/cultured to communicate like that? As in, why don't they just send the email? Is it a weird thing about this one person or is there some culture where their behavior is the norm?

Volunteer A will text me asking for my advice about what to say in emails to other people about things that I am not actually involved in and aren't really "my problem" ... and I'm nice about it, like, I don't want to be an asshole, but ... unless it's some highly fraught issue or something technical or legal where specific wording and phrasing are actually crucial? ... Why can't people just write their own damn emails and send them like nbd ... idgi

It's certainly not a cultural thing that I've encountered here, maybe he brought it from an old job. And neither time was like he was trying to give me a heads up about bad news, both times they were just informational emails. It's weird.

it would drive me up the wall ... i would end up doing the thing where i would ignore communication from this person except for the actual emails, and then only respond to those. ... as in, if that was my preferred mode of communication and the most productive form of communication.

that call to alert a forthcoming (?!) email thing is insane

I learned that some coworkers prefer if you mention you're going to invite them to a meeting and that's a new one to me? Just schedule it at a sane time and put enough info in the invite for me to draw a conclusion of why I'm being invited and what's going to be discussed

unless they are asking you if you'd prefer not to be invited? otherwise, yeah ... though, my co-worker has his google calendar set up so that he automatically accepts all invitations to meetings ... and my view of his calendar doesn't show what the meetings are ... it just shows the times and "busy" ... so in reality, I have no idea whether he is actually attending a meeting, only that someone invited him to something that it is highly possible he didn't even look at because of the automation.

he also has "recurring meetings" that actually don't happen, which I have to cognitively pretend aren't on the calendar ... like he had a recurring weekly meeting with a city official who was fired about a year ago ... he does not have a recurring meeting with the current person in that position ... the meeting is still on his calendar!

at that point, yeah, just contact him any time

it's more like, someone will ask me if he is available to do something at a specific time and I will have to honestly say I have no fucking idea what his schedule is!

Things had been fine for awhile with this relatively recent hire (for the record, she is exactly the same position and title as me), but lately she's been back to her method of firing off directives to me as if she's my boss. Never framed as a question or a conversation, just emails where she directs me to meet with people (on her behalf, for her projects, because she can't for one reason or another) and copies in a ton of people, including my actual boss. It's not that I mind helping her out and often times I'm able to step in to offer some assistance, but her tone and commands are pissing me the fuck off.

Today's specific example was an email, sent to me, copied to fifteen other people saying, essentially, "since you will be in this building on your project, I need you to stop by and walk this other area and report back to me on the scope". No ask, no framing it as a question, just a command.

I'm torn on how to deal with this without coming across as whining about it. Had this been delivered to me as an in person, friendly ask, it's not a completely unreasonable request to the point where my boss would object to the use of my time. It's just the tone that really pisses me off, it feels really belittling and disrespectful.

so ... wait ... is this her job that she is asking you to do for her ... ?

Essentially, yes. In this case an issue popped up related to one of the projects she is managing. Since I'm going to be in the area of her project tomorrow, for a completely unrelated project of my own, she sent an email telling me (and copying in all of our outside contractors involved in her project) to meet with her team, walk the project and get back to her with the scope of the issue.

Obviously you need to tit-for-tat this shit ASAP. Find something you can shove onto her plate and do it.

Don't be petty about it — do it in the exact same tone she uses with you, like "OK, if this is how things work now, here's one for you."

I like that idea, but she's kind of got me stuck on this one. I could just send something to her to do, but I'm nearly 100% certain she would just sit on it to make me look bad. To make the tit-for-tat have any teeth, I'd have to copy in several of the same people she copied on her email to me and I fear that would just come across as petty (especially to my actual boss).

Check and mate.

Just say "since this is your project, that is outside the scope of my position."

then fart on her

Probably email her and your boss back and say that you are occupied with what’s on your plate (if you can get away with the embellishment) and ask that going forward, next time she needs you doing her job for her that she request your assistance directly instead of a mass email.

To go back to the question, I would just tell her that you find her tone belittling and disrespectful. I did this recently with a colleague who felt justified in cussing me out. He apologized--sincerely, I think--and we moved on.

i actually found it fairly shocking how effective the direct approach can be when I did so in similar circumstances (well, in MY situation - mileage may vary). mostly because in this day and age people are used to people just taking whatever is flung at them without resistance, so they thrive on people not standing up and saying "no!".

Nowhere in anyone's job description does it say "taking abuse."

ot-fucking-m

Essentially, yes. In this case an issue popped up related to one of the projects she is managing. Since I'm going to be in the area of her project tomorrow, for a completely unrelated project of my own, she sent an email telling me (and copying in all of our outside contractors involved in her project) to meet with her team, walk the project and get back to her with the scope of the issue.

― Maxmillion D. Boosted (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Tuesday, June 27, 2023 12:46 PM (nine hours ago)

the pass-agg way would be to say: You know, as I am not the lead on this project, I worry that my sense of the scope (and any changes that might be required based on my walkthrough) would not be as useful as if you were to do this yourself. As I, too, have a lot of projects to manager, I am concerned that I don't have time to do a comprehensive read of what has already been planned/done on this project, and might miss some key detail.

personally a mail to your manager and hers just checking whether or not your work/time was to be directed by this person or whether you were to continue on as planned with your own manager

then ignore the multi cc mail

Thanks, I think I might try the direct approach with her, or at least give it a run. A mutual coworker allegedly approached her about a similar thing earlier this year (though I wasn't around to know what was said/expressed) and apparently her response was along the lines of, "I don't care how other people receive my tone, I'm here to do my job".

For some added context, she has, on multiple occasions, self-described as "a climber" and frequently leads off conversations with, "when I lead this department". Fwiw, she's been here for just over a year and there have been zero indications that she is soon in line for any sort of management position, I think she is just one of those people that views every single interaction through the lens of, "how do I use this person to forward my career?". Unfortunately my recently departed boss thought intra-office strife was funny and "good for getting results" so he never spoke up when she said things like this. So far I get the vibe that my new boss isn't going to have the patience for that and might eventually tell her to curb it, but we're still in early days.

Ultimately, I'm also just here to do my job, but I don't need to deal with someone whose approach is "act like you've already got the job you want" and doesn't really care about the people she's pissing off along the way.

in that case, I would approach her in a more straightforward "realpolitik" way ... obv I am me, and you are not me, but, if it were me (and I've honestly been in this situation before) I would say (maybe have a one on one with her) --

Look, I am willing to have your back and cover for you because in order for things to work well (which I am committed to), we have to work together. But the thing is, I am more willing to go out of my way for you, if you acknowledge that I am, in fact, going out of my way for you. I could be passive-aggressive and throw you under the bus, and ask for authorization from my supervisor to take on your workload, which will definitely delay you getting what you need, right? And more than that, this could make it look like you aren't capable of doing your job. I don't think you want people to think you aren't capable of doing your job. But I don't want to be an asshole and do that. I really don't. I want to see you move up the ladder, as it seems like you want to do, right? And, if you are willing to be respectful of me, and acknowledge when I'm doing you a solid, then I will totally support you moving forward.

xp Such people are generally a cancer and more often than not will self-sabotage.

I would probably spend a lot of time plotting how to sink said colleague. You absolutely should not stand for that and make it as spectacular a bomb drop as possible.

Unfortunately my recently departed boss thought intra-office strife was funny and "good for getting results"

four of us are working on making revisions to our instructor introduction guide to ensure it's accurate for 2023 and make it more palatable for new instructors.

we were all asked to give our written feedback, which we did. Assumed that person leading this project would read all the feedback, make updates they understood/agreed with, and set a follow-up meeting to go over any feedback they were on the fence about or don't understand.

No, instead, he didn't read it at all, and we're going item by item and discussing them in real time, and then waiting while he makes the adjustments in the doc in real time.

Sooooo boring. hence why I'm reading here in the truckloads of space between items

Unfortunately my recently departed boss thought intra-office strife was funny and "good for getting results"

This has to be among the top three Bad Boss Types.

"anger = passion!!!111!!"

Eugh definitely seems like this person wouldn’t have been hired if non-toxic work culture was a concern with management

Absolutely. Another one of the "lasting legacies" he's left us with on his way out.

No, instead, he didn't read it at all, and we're going item by item and discussing them in real time, and then waiting while he makes the adjustments in the doc in real time.

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahah = one "ha" for each hour I have wasted in similar situations in the recent past

it's just like....about as much fun as standing behind someone else as they play a video game that you've already beaten

totally! two days ago I spent several hours holding my co-worker's hand while he made a billing statement for a client because he needed to understand it himself

Any other teachers here actively avoid co-workers at all costs? I have to engage with some as a special education instructor, but my god do I try to get away from these immature, cliquey brats. Some people unfortunately get into this field because they have messianic complexes and think they’re capable of “saving” kids

dude goes to my manager asking why training invites for next Tuesday's class haven't gone out yet, saying he has people signed up who work atypical shifts so they can make arrangements with their families.

The time of training is always 9:00 am - 5:30 pm ET, has been for over a decade, and in addition to the fact that he's been signing people up for this class for years, the exact time of the class is listed explicitly at the top of the sign-up sheet, right below the dates of training. we never send invites further out than two days in advance because the roster changes so significantly in the week leading up.

our invites aren't supposed to be the first time the attendees learn of the dates/time, he himself was supposed to tell them after signing them up weeks ago. This is why people fail to show up on Day 1 sometimes.

I avoided my usual snark though so score one for me not being a dick like usual

AND (hilariously) one of our partner sites apparently has continued to connect to VPN with Citrix, which we phased out months ago for AWS Appstream. It hasn't been fully decommissioned yet, because there are other things besides VPN that it's used for which haven't transitioned yet, which explains why they can still get onto it, but 11 days from now, it will no longer be available.

kind of sad that we discovered this now because the hilarity of nobody being able to get online at this site in 11 days would have been a great popcorn moment.

One constant, in every single job I've had throughout my career, is that poor managers really cannot handle being asked for clarification of task priorities. Every single directive they come up with is a "A1 main priority" and you can consistently see their brain start to break down if you directly ask them which of the sixteen A1 priorities should be done first.

"buh buh buh buh all of them buh buh"

Case in point, since last Wednesday I've been handed six new "high priority" tasks to get done "ASAP" (naturally all of these on top of my normal workload). When being given the most recent this morning, I reminded the head of our department about the other five she had already put on my plate. I asked if there was a priority order within these six and was greeted by a blank stare for a good twenty seconds, as if I'd asked her to fly to Mars. Her ultimate response was, "all of them".

Gee, I can't fathom why people feel stretched too thin with low morale.

my manager's all over the place attention-wise, which I can relate to, but he's also relatively new to managing people so I can mention after (or during!) a meeting that he's said coworker A can work on three different things, and perhaps we should line those up in a backlog because none of them are fires needing fought and perhaps the large important task should get done first

xp - you should propose that they come up with a new priority category - "A1!" for things that are even bigger priorities than A1 priorities. You should send many emails regarding this new categorization system.

running out of patience for people who both don't turn banner notifications off in MS Teams and don't turn off email notifications in Outlook before leading a class. so I send them an email or a private message and inadvertently see it beamed in front of the entire class and have to ask them/show them how to turn them off during a break, and until I can do that, hold off sending PMs or emails until they're not screensharing.