the level of sexiness in 39 Steps is off the chart for a Brit flick of its era
― Let's talk about local tomatoes (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 27 July 2023 10:21 (eleven months ago) link
What a weird opinion, especially considering how much, as Camaraderie mentioned, this is a blueprint for NBNW. What do these people dislike in the American work, not enough location shooting?
― Daniel_Rf,
Residual snobbery for Hitch's crossing the pond.
― the dreaded dependent claus (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 27 July 2023 12:20 (eleven months ago) link
Well the egg's certainly on his face leaving the powerhouse of creativity that was the British film industry of the 1930's.
― Daniel_Rf, Thursday, 27 July 2023 14:41 (eleven months ago) link
Why do some people like Buñuel’s Mexican films more than his French films?
― Live and Left Eye (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 27 July 2023 15:09 (eleven months ago) link
Have you seen Simon of the Desert? There's your answer
― fair but so uncool beliefs here (Eric H.), Thursday, 27 July 2023 15:10 (eleven months ago) link
Simon is the best
― Let's talk about local tomatoes (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 27 July 2023 16:11 (eleven months ago) link
It really is. I like a lot of his Mexican films but I love neo-realism so..
Wouldn't say I prefer them to his French stuff though.
― Toshirō Nofune (The Seventh ILXorai), Friday, 28 July 2023 09:58 (eleven months ago) link
― Live and Left Eye (James Redd and the Blecchs)
I'm not seeing this? He made more Mexican than French films, of variable quality.
― the dreaded dependent claus (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 28 July 2023 12:12 (eleven months ago) link
Add another "some" if that works for you.
― Live and Left Eye (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 28 July 2023 13:21 (eleven months ago) link
My question was kind of just really trying to make some kind of anology between Mexican Buñuel and British Hitchock, what was done with less gloss on a more limited budget in the native tongue.
― Live and Left Eye (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 28 July 2023 13:23 (eleven months ago) link
Next you're going to point out that British and American English are the same language and Buñuel was Spanish, not Mexican.
― Live and Left Eye (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 28 July 2023 13:24 (eleven months ago) link
I think my position that 80-90% of the best stuff of Hitchcock's career came from his American period is probably a minority one
― fair but so uncool beliefs here (Eric H.), Friday, 28 July 2023 13:25 (eleven months ago) link
I dunno, took a quick glance at the s&s 250 and all 4 Hitchocks I saw are US productions.
I think The Lady Vanishes, 39 Steps and The Lodger are highly rated but pitting the whole of the UK work vs the US stuff saying UK is superior feels like contrarianism.
Aside from anything else the UK stuff doesn't have Cary Grant or James Srewart!
― Daniel_Rf, Friday, 28 July 2023 13:47 (eleven months ago) link
― fair but so uncool beliefs here (Eric H.)
An opinion.
― the dreaded dependent claus (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 28 July 2023 13:52 (eleven months ago) link
When Robin Wood published Hitchcock's Films in 1965, he was working against what he saw as the elevation of the UK films over the American. Of course, he was in the UK at the time, where that opinion may have been more prevalent. Nowadays, I'd say the US films are much more widely acclaimed (as is Hitchcock's work in general).
― Halfway there but for you, Friday, 28 July 2023 17:35 (eleven months ago) link
39 Steps and the o.g. Man Who Knew Too Much are maybe the only two of his pre-US films i love as much as the later stuff
― Let's talk about local tomatoes (Noodle Vague), Friday, 28 July 2023 17:37 (eleven months ago) link
Add The Lodger.
― the dreaded dependent claus (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 28 July 2023 17:39 (eleven months ago) link
haven't watched that in an age and i probably should
― Let's talk about local tomatoes (Noodle Vague), Friday, 28 July 2023 17:42 (eleven months ago) link
To repeat what a couple of others point out, I think that's been far and away the common view for at least a couple of decades. To the point that his best British films probably get overlooked. I loved The Lady Vanishes the one time I saw it, probably as much as anything except Rear Window and Psycho.
― clemenza, Saturday, 29 July 2023 22:05 (eleven months ago) link
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/36/Modern_Times_poster.jpgModern Times, Charles Chaplin, 1936 Morbsies #239 Sight & Sound Critics #78Sight & Sound Directors #72
― the world is your octopus (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Monday, 31 July 2023 09:09 (eleven months ago) link
only clips available on youtube, open to suggestions about where it's available to watch, apart from torrents
― the world is your octopus (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Monday, 31 July 2023 09:12 (eleven months ago) link
Criterion do a UK regioned blu-ray of Modern Times.
xpost
The proposition that American Hitchcock was superior to English Hitchcock first pushed by French critics in the 1950s? Wood's first piece of film criticism, an essay on Psycho, rejected by Penelope Houston for Sight and Sound (because Wood hadn't acknowledged that Psycho was a 'comedy') but accepted by Cahiers du Cinema.
For at least the last thirty years, certain British critics - led by Charles Barr - have argued in favour of the English films, and it's quite an industry now. A former ILXOR published a good book-length study of The Lodger a year or so ago.
― Ward Fowler, Monday, 31 July 2023 09:26 (eleven months ago) link
That former ilxor was often pushing against the notion that Brit cinema was bad when posting here. I guess being told Godard was god when you think it's juvenalia gets old.
I am not as negative as some (though I started like that), but I am not fully sold on the glories of it either. Saying the UK channeled a lot of those energies on making often excellent TV is hardly a disaster for culture.
― xyzzzz__, Monday, 31 July 2023 09:59 (eleven months ago) link
Well, not in the 1930's tho!
I do remember a post by the poster who shall not be named saying Hitchcock was "miles ahead of everyone else in Britain" circa The Lodger.
― Daniel_Rf, Monday, 31 July 2023 10:01 (eleven months ago) link
I wanted to re-watch Goodbye, Dragon Inn (Tsai, 2003) after it topped the mini-poll we ran a couple of months ago...and as I watched the first five mins it turned out I had never seen it lol.
What a film though. Just about perfect.
― xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 2 August 2023 22:23 (eleven months ago) link
Always with Tsai in this period is to talent to assemble the right composition to convey sadness and hilarity.
― the dreaded dependent claus (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 2 August 2023 22:25 (eleven months ago) link
Very much a film that will make you laugh and cry.
― xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 2 August 2023 22:34 (eleven months ago) link
So, Modern Times then.Definitely a big step up from City Lights I'd say, mostly appreciate it for the set design and cinematography, both of which are all-time, to the extent that it felt like The Tramp just got in the way from time to time. Once again the plot is just an excuse for a series of set pieces, which must be amazing if you are a fan of Chaplin and find him hilarious and adorable, but I have to conclude at this point that I just don't, sorry. Paulette Goddard is just wonderful though, such a modern actor, and much better than the simpering Virginia Cherrill. Doesn't have a great deal of chemistry with Chaplin, which is odd considering they married this year. The shot of them walking away together at the end is perfectly done, couldn't have imagined better. So I'm not in love with this, but it's such a beautiful film that I don't really care.
― the world is your octopus (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Saturday, 5 August 2023 13:16 (eleven months ago) link
39 steps on tptv this afternoon for the Britishers
― koogs, Saturday, 5 August 2023 13:41 (eleven months ago) link
oh no, that was the 59 version with Kenneth More
― koogs, Saturday, 5 August 2023 18:22 (eleven months ago) link
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/51/Make_Way_for_Tomorrow_%281937_poster%29.jpgMake Way for Tomorrow, Leo McCarey, 1937Morbsies #723
― the world is your octopus (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Monday, 7 August 2023 18:47 (ten months ago) link
And devastating as any Ozu.
― the dreaded dependent claus (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 7 August 2023 18:56 (ten months ago) link
*as
Looks really good.
― xyzzzz__, Monday, 7 August 2023 19:20 (ten months ago) link
xyzzzz, am I wrong in remarking that you haven't seen much older Hollywood fare? (Not a dis at all, btw, just an observation).
― the dreaded dependent claus (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 7 August 2023 19:32 (ten months ago) link
No problem. I'd say that's correct, yes. Silents is a massive gap overall.
Only classic US mini-genre I've seen quite a lot of is noir.
― xyzzzz__, Monday, 7 August 2023 20:04 (ten months ago) link
it is curious that what I think of as the typical examples of the golden age of Hollywood (basically MGM musical extravaganzas) are so underrepresented in this list
― the world is your octopus (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Monday, 7 August 2023 20:11 (ten months ago) link
fantastic film. rewatched it with my dad a while back and he loved it.
― Toshirō Nofune (The Seventh ILXorai), Monday, 7 August 2023 21:07 (ten months ago) link
Welles was right about Make Way. Pretty sure that, outside of Only Angels Have Wings, this is my favorite golden era Hollywood movie
― fair but so uncool beliefs here (Eric H.), Tuesday, 8 August 2023 01:40 (ten months ago) link
Saw it once ages ago, thought it was very good. Going My Way--the way it handles Barry Fitzgerald's character--is also an excellent film about getting old.
― clemenza, Tuesday, 8 August 2023 02:02 (ten months ago) link
In case Eve -- sorry, Eric -- doesn't know to which Welles quote he refers:
Orson Welles said of the film, "It would make a stone cry,"
― the dreaded dependent claus (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 8 August 2023 02:05 (ten months ago) link
It would.
― Toshirō Nofune (The Seventh ILXorai), Tuesday, 8 August 2023 08:08 (ten months ago) link
This is a good film, but I couldn’t help being frustrated by how useless the husband is and how his wife shelters him from the realities of their situation. In a way, it makes the film more potent, because we see her perspective and how she has to bear the burden of understanding the end of the relationship on her own. Still, it’s hard for me to embrace a film based around keeping someone ignorant of the truth of their prospects and fate.
― Halfway there but for you, Thursday, 10 August 2023 12:13 (ten months ago) link
Why not? The keeping up -- the shattering of -- illusions is in part what it's about. Many films have a similar theme.
― the dreaded dependent claus (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 10 August 2023 12:14 (ten months ago) link
It might make me heartless that I’d prefer to see the husband’s illusions broken.
― Halfway there but for you, Thursday, 10 August 2023 12:15 (ten months ago) link
Sure! But is that a reason to recoil? Sorry if I'm pressing.
― the dreaded dependent claus (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 10 August 2023 12:21 (ten months ago) link
I wouldn't say "recoil", just that the film didn't reach a potential level of dramatic tension; although I do feel for the wife having to protect a fool from the consequences of his actions. Maybe, in a way, it's cruel of her to allow him to keep his optimism, only for it to (presumably) be shattered, later, when he is alone?
― Halfway there but for you, Thursday, 10 August 2023 13:28 (ten months ago) link
I don't think it will be shattered, he'll keep on trying to find work, I think he knows too, deep down, but he just always tries to put a positive spin on things. Reminds me of my dad, and of me to a certain extent.
― the world is your octopus (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Friday, 11 August 2023 21:44 (ten months ago) link
Anyway, finally watched this this evening, agreed with Orson that it's very affecting stuff, all the more so because the children aren't monsters, they're just dealing with their own shit.
― the world is your octopus (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Friday, 11 August 2023 21:47 (ten months ago) link
It’s really close to Renoir, as Hollywood filmmaking goes
― fair but so uncool beliefs here (Eric H.), Friday, 11 August 2023 21:50 (ten months ago) link