fox has the shittiest cartoons in history this year.

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and it's the only channel i get.

seriously. like mid-80s "turbo teen", "paw paw bears", "pound puppies" bad.

jess (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 19 October 2002 14:49 (twenty-two years ago)

why am i tortured like this?

jess (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 19 October 2002 14:50 (twenty-two years ago)

isn't transformers on fox?

jel -- (jel), Saturday, 19 October 2002 14:50 (twenty-two years ago)

so far i've watched:

"fighting foodons": in which POKEMON is crossed with EMERIL LIVE (which seems like a brilliant idea but is let down by the fact that it's a twee hellhole.)

"kirby": yes, that lovable scamp from the nintendo game series. CARTOONS MADE AFTER PRODUCTS ALWAYS = DUD.

"ultraman tiga": yeah, him. 60 years or whatever later. live action shows on sat morning = dud. at least they left the japanese people in this one.

"ultimate muscle": farting wrestlers. those japanese are wits and wags!

jess (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 19 October 2002 14:53 (twenty-two years ago)

This is when I would turn off the TV.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 19 October 2002 14:54 (twenty-two years ago)

Strangely enough, I read an article in the wsj yesterday about this! Fox thinks boys need properly macho and violent cartoons. Here's the article:

Pow! Ka-Zam! Voom! 4Kids
Picks Fight With Nickelodeon

4Kids Turns to Action-Packed 'Toons
To Woo Boys Away From SpongeBob

NEW YORK -- Life-or-death suspense, grotesque supernatural villains, shoot-'em-up science fiction -- just another Saturday morning on Fox television for children.

Tune in to "Ultimate Muscle" and watch a gawky wrestler battle evil alien musclemen for intergalactic dominance. "Ultraman: Tiga" evokes the karate-chopping of the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. In "Stargate," human bounty hunters battle sinister aliens. Both "Fighting Foodons" and "Kirby" follow the adventures of monster-bashing heroes. Coming in January: the return of the "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles."


Behind all the action is 55-year-old Alfred Kahn, chief executive of 4Kids Entertainment Inc. and the merchandising wizard who introduced Cabbage Patch Kids and Pokemon to America. In January, his New York-based company agreed to pay $101 million to lease for four years the prime preteen time slot of Saturday morning, 8 to noon. As soon as his new lineup, dubbed FoxBox, made its debut last month on News Corp.'s Fox network, it was clear Mr. Kahn had a certain kind of youngster in mind: boys.

"When boys fantasize, they fantasize about power, strength and speed, so they need Pow!, Ka-zam! and Voom! in their stories," Mr. Kahn says. "Nickelodeon doesn't give them that."

FoxBox presents a direct challenge to Nickelodeon, the Viacom Inc. unit that dominates the under-11 TV market and Saturday mornings in particular with cartoons such as "SpongeBob Square Pants" and "Hey Arnold." These shows rely on wry humor, real-life dilemmas and generous helpings of gross-out gags.

Instead of emulating Nickelodeon, 4Kids is importing and Americanizing decidedly more-violent, more-action-packed Japanese cartoons to appeal to the boys who make up roughly half of Nickelodeon's two million Saturday-morning viewers. The goal isn't just advertising dollars. Mr. Kahn's 4Kids specializes in licensing Japanese creative properties in the U.S., and its hottest properties, especially Pokemon, are cooling off. The company is hoping it can woo boys to its shows and induce them to buy action figures, video games, game cards and other tie-ins to its new shows, yielding big royalties.

The formula is already producing good results on the WB Network, which runs 4Kids' English-language productions of the Japanese cartoons "Pokemon" and "Yu-Gi-Oh" on Saturday mornings. Though it started weak last season, "Yu-Gi-Oh," the tale of a boy who travels through an underworld of card sharks and monsters, has topped the ratings so far this year among boys under age 11. Boys are lining up at stores to buy Yu-Gi-Oh cards. Analysts expect retail sales of Yu-Gi-Oh products of as much as $400 million this year. As holder of U.S. rights to the property, 4Kids would take a slice of that.

Kirby, the monster-bashing hero of one of 4Kids Entertainment's programs


In its deal with Fox, 4Kids company similarly is banking on toys and other products to make the gamble pay off. Mr. Kahn says he already has more than $25 million in advertising commitments for the first year from food, toy and other vendors -- albeit with ratings-guarantee clauses for some. Profits, he says, will come from the product tie-ins.

Since the launch of FoxBox, 4Kids stock has climbed strongly, hitting a 52-week high this week of $27.74. Thursday, it closed at $27.45, up 50 cents, in 4 p.m. New York Stock Exchange composite trading, but that's a long way from the $90 high it reached in 1999 at the height of the Pokemon craze.

Peter Lynch, the former top stock picker for Fidelity Investments' Magellan Fund, says he has bought some shares for his personal account and is encouraged by "a small research group of 10-year-old boys" he knows who watch "Yu-Gi-Oh" and "just love the show."

At 4Kids' studio in midtown Manhattan, carpenters are connecting the 11th floors of three adjacent buildings to make space for some 90 sketch artists, music scorers and producers. Though the shows arrive from Japan, 4Kids still has to produce translations, dub the films and compose music that is better-suited to U.S. tastes.

Lighter Touch

"We're soon going to a 24-hours-a-day-seven-days-a-week production schedule," says Norman Grossfeld, president of 4Kids Productions Inc., the unit that is producing the shows. He says production also involves exercising a bit of creative latitude. The U.S. versions of Japanese shows, he says, sometimes need a lighter touch.

In "Kirby" for instance, King Dedede, the villain, is mean and dumb in the Japanese version. For the U.S., Mr. Grossfeld gave the character a Louisiana drawl and got someone who sounds like the late comedian Paul Lynde to provide the voice of his sidekick, who loves bossing the peasants around.

But the action of the Japanese cartoons stays. In "Ultraman: Tiga," the eponymous hero destroys enemy monsters with laser beams that emanate from energy sources hidden in his body. The action is laced with campy humor. During a break in a battle scene in one recent episode, a warrior says the monster "is uglier than my mother-in-law." A comrade responds: "Yes, but her nose is bigger." The climax generally entails the monster villain exploding into bits.

In "Ultimate Muscle," Earth is threatened by a band of intergalactic wrestling types. Kinnikuman is a cowardly and rather homely hero who uses flatulence to fly. Reluctantly, he takes on the space villains in the ring and dispatches them into space with head locks, body slams and other wrestling maneuvers.

Compare that to Nickelodeon's Saturday-morning anchor, "SpongeBob Square Pants," about the mild misadventures of a sea sponge and an ensemble of supporting aquatic characters. In "Jimmy Neutron," the 10-year-old hero is a genius who sports Elvis-style hair and creates mayhem with his own grandiose experiments. The animated sitcom "Hey Arnold" focuses on a racially diverse group of earnest adolescents coping with everything from romantic crushes to sinister developers threatening their inner-city neighborhood.

Mr. Kahn says he may hear from some parents who deplore the violence in the FoxBox shows. The father of four says his shows don't abet violent behavior, and he argues that family has greater impact than television programming on a child's psyche. "Kids watch their parents smoke and they go out and buy bubble-gum cigarettes," he says. "I find that more disconcerting than watching superhero cartoons."

Mr. Kahn looks like the personification of a cartoon action hero, with a weightlifter's 6-foot-1, 280-pound frame. "The only real thing I take seriously is the gym," he says. "You'll find me every morning at 5:30 lifting weights. I can bench press 500 pounds." He is the oldest among the 160 employees of 4Kids, "but I'm the strongest."

He wears an electronic police beeper -- a gift, he says, from some well-placed friends in law enforcement -- on his belt at all times. The vibrating device alerts him to high-speed chases, major crimes and the like around New York City. He uses it to avoid traffic snarls, but there's also the fact that as a child, he says, "I always wanted to be a cop."

He first started working his merchandising magic at Coleco Enterprises. While head of the company's marketing and development, Mr. Kahn read an article in The Wall Street Journal about someone who ran a make-believe hospital for toy babies and sold them through an adoption agency. Xavier Roberts, the Atlanta businessman who owned the rights to the dolls, was having a hard time persuading major toy companies to pick up on the downbeat idea.

Mr. Kahn showed up to seal a deal for Coleco to market the dolls, and thus began the Cabbage Patch Kids craze. That lasted about three years, and after it ended, so did Coleco, which folded in 1989.

Mr. Kahn then bought Leisure Concepts Inc., the predecessor to 4Kids, and struck an alliance with Nintendo Ltd. to become a licensing agent, selling the merchandise rights to such big video-game properties as Donkey Kong and Mario Brothers to U.S. companies. In the mid-1990s, he negotiated toy and video-game deals for the Worldwide Wrestling Federation.

During a visit to Japan in the fall of 1998, he saw Japanese children lined up outside toy stores awaiting the next shipment of little dolls called Pocket Monsters. Nintendo feared that they were too Japanese for Western tastes. Mr. Kahn convinced his old ally otherwise and then secured Hasbro Inc. to make a line of Pokemon toys for the U.S.

"American and Japanese boys have similar appetites for action-oriented shows," he says. "In many ways, we in the U.S. have this big focus group in Japan."

Since the rechristened Pokemon charter line of 150 little monsters came out in the fall of 1998, Americans have plunked down more than $15 billion for Pokemon stuff -- sneakers and party goods, breakfast cereals and vitamins, trading cards and video games. With a piece of just about all of it except video games, 4Kids has taken in about $140 million in Pokemon revenue.

But sales of Pokemon products, the company's main source of licensing revenue, have been declining, to about $30 million last year from $85 million in 2000. That's why the Saturday-morning TV gamble is critical to 4Kids.

The company made the leap into children's television at a time when Nickelodeon's pre-eminence was reducing the segment's appeal for other broadcasters. Though annual spending on child-oriented television advertising has increased to $950 million from $700 million over the past six years, about 55% of it has gone to Nickelodeon, which regularly draws more than half of the nation's 48 million children.

Ad Prices Slip

Over the same six years, the price the broadcast networks charge advertisers for a 30-second commercial has slipped to $17 per 1,000 children viewers from $27, says Sheldon Hirsch, chief executive of Summit Media Group Inc., a 4Kids subsidiary that buys TV advertising time for toy, food and video-game companies.

CBS, Nickelodeon's sister network under the Viacom umbrella, has given up airing its own shows during the Saturday-morning time slot and is instead airing Nickelodeon programs, including "Hey Arnold," and "The Wild Thornberrys." Fox was No. 1 in the ratings for children's entertainment prior to Nickelodeon's ascent to the top in 1996, then began a downward slide. Last year, it ranked in the middle among major networks in the ratings for children's programming.

So late last year, Fox decided to focus on adult programming and put its Saturday-morning time slot on the auction block. Mr. Kahn received word that 4Kids had submitted the winning bid on Jan. 18, the day he turned 55. "One of the best birthday presents I ever got," he says.

The $101 million that 4Kids agreed to pay Fox over the next four years exceeded by $37 million the next-highest bid on the table, say people familiar with the matter.

The company has struck license agreements with Japanese rights owners covering U.S. sales of video games, toys, cards and other merchandise tied to FoxBox shows. People familiar with the matter say that 4Kids can expect between 4% and 6% of the wholesale value of all U.S. sales.

Now, 4Kids is lining up licensees to make the merchandise. Japan's Bandai Ltd. is close to an agreement with 4Kids to produce Ultimate Muscle action figures and trading cards for the U.S. market. The company is also in talks with Hasbro on an Ultraman toy-licensing agreement.

Nickelodeon says that the storylines of its shows, not tie-ins, are its chief concern and that it doesn't license its shows for merchandising until they have been on the air for several seasons. Still, many Nick shows throw off massive ancillary sales. "SpongeBob," now in its fifth season, is expected to generate $600 million in sales of show-themed merchandise this year. "Rugrats" and "Blues Clues," both of them longer-running shows, will each do $1 billion in tie-ins, says Nickelodeon's Mr. Scannell.

"Boys and girls like most of the same stuff," says Cyma Zarghami, Nickelodeon's programming head. "But we've discovered in the last five years that while Nick goes to the heart of kids, there are some things that boys like better."

Translate that to mean action. Three years ago, Nickelodeon came out with "Rocket Power," in which a group of three boys and a girl skateboard and snowboard their merry way through the plot. It typically finishes several slots behind "Yu-Gi-Oh" in the Saturday-morning ratings. And this summer, "Robot Wars," a British import about the lives of families that build robots and compete against each other in contests, made its debut on Nickelodeon.

After the Sept. 14 fall premiere of "Yu-Gi-Oh" led all shows in the boys six-to-11 audience, Nickelodeon the following week aired brand-new episodes of "SpongeBob" and "Jimmy Neutron." Instead of the regular 30-minute segments, each show was an hour long. WB executives believe that the move was made in reaction to WB's good ratings.

A Nickelodeon spokesman says that it doesn't target boys exclusively and that the high ratings for "Yu-Gi-Oh" had nothing to do with the decision to air the hourlong shows. Says Ms. Zarghami: "Kids watch us because they've fallen in love with our characters."

Nicole (Nicole), Saturday, 19 October 2002 15:04 (twenty-two years ago)

fox has always had traditionally horrible cartoons though. having bman the animated series was their annus mirrorballus.

my god this just horrible. why is nancy making me watch all these?!

jess (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 19 October 2002 15:08 (twenty-two years ago)

Sorry for all the full text but I couldn't link because it's on a part of their site where you have to pay.

Nicole (Nicole), Saturday, 19 October 2002 15:09 (twenty-two years ago)

Fox thinks boys need properly macho and violent cartoons.

Talk about sewing up all the markets; it's internal Simpsons counterprogramming.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 19 October 2002 15:34 (twenty-two years ago)

"Kids watch their parents smoke and they go out and buy bubble-gum cigarettes,"
Do they even sell candy cigarettes anymore?

rosemary (rosemary), Saturday, 19 October 2002 16:02 (twenty-two years ago)

there was a pound puppies cartoon?

dave k, Saturday, 19 October 2002 16:33 (twenty-two years ago)

It's all about Kids WB, anyway.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Saturday, 19 October 2002 16:38 (twenty-two years ago)

okay if i remember right paw paw bears is fucking cool, i may be wrong in the names in english but i have a feeling its a cool cartoon

vic (vicc13), Saturday, 19 October 2002 16:44 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, nancy got on me for that too. you're all insane.

jess (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 19 October 2002 16:45 (twenty-two years ago)

>>>fox has always had traditionally horrible cartoons though.<<<

Yes, but "Eek The Cat!" was far ahead of its time. Never was it respected during its run. Some of the WB based cartoons that left around '99 or whatever were quality too.

-
Alan

Alan Conceicao, Saturday, 19 October 2002 16:46 (twenty-two years ago)

Yugi-Oh? YUGI-OH?

That's popular?

Maybe this was why I was such a weirdo in primary school...

Mr Swygart (mrswygart), Saturday, 19 October 2002 16:48 (twenty-two years ago)

Eek The Cat is the best cartoon evah man

vic (vicc13), Saturday, 19 October 2002 16:50 (twenty-two years ago)

Eek! ruled majorly. Always seemed to get pissed on by the BBC over here, too. Think it might have got attached to Fully Booked or something - "Hmm, what's the problem with this show? Eek The Cat, or Tim Vincent?" "Well, obviously it's the cartoon. Let's bring back Potsworth & Co!"

Mr Swygart (mrswygart), Saturday, 19 October 2002 16:54 (twenty-two years ago)

It's all about Cartoon Network, even tho Cow And Chicken is the most cynical show in creation. What was the name of the cartoon that they would show wit Eek The Cat wit 15 mins of each per episode? I remember liking that.

naked as sin (naked as sin), Saturday, 19 October 2002 19:59 (twenty-two years ago)

Do they still have that Ghostbusters cartoon?

James Blount (James Blount), Saturday, 19 October 2002 20:09 (twenty-two years ago)

talking abt TV my brother discovered we can receive a music channel which we don't even pay for. its called hits and it means I'll be able to follow all the pop fluff like everyone else since i can't stand these DJs (and the videos are good material if you see what i'm getting at).

OK back to the cartoon talk now.

Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 19 October 2002 20:13 (twenty-two years ago)

I wish I had Cartoon Network. I keep hearing how great adult swim is.

brg30 (brg30), Saturday, 19 October 2002 20:56 (twenty-two years ago)

Adult Swim is a merriment. :-) And last night I caught Voltaire's "BRAINS!" used in an episode of Grim and Evil, which pleased my soul.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 19 October 2002 20:58 (twenty-two years ago)

All I know is that Home Movies is genius and Jason is undoubtedly jesus christ.

naked as sin (naked as sin), Saturday, 19 October 2002 23:01 (twenty-two years ago)

And goddamnit that was such an archetypal Ragget post it's not even funny.

naked as sin (naked as sin), Saturday, 19 October 2002 23:06 (twenty-two years ago)

+t

naked as sin (naked as sin), Saturday, 19 October 2002 23:07 (twenty-two years ago)

I try to live up to my image.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 20 October 2002 00:32 (twenty-two years ago)

What was the name of the cartoon that they would show wit Eek The Cat wit 15 mins of each per episode? I remember liking that.

I think it was Terrible Thunder Lizards, or something like that. Yes, that show was amazing too! 'Course, I still stand by my position of Ren and Stimpy being the greatest cartoon ever...

Adam Bruneau, Sunday, 20 October 2002 18:01 (twenty-two years ago)

Greatest childrens show not directly for children: Sifl and Olly - not strictly Sat-morn or cartoon viewing, but very much in the spirit. I just have to represent for tha sockheads.

Adam Bruneau, Sunday, 20 October 2002 18:03 (twenty-two years ago)

Yugi-Oh is great because it makes geeks such as myself feel better about themselves since we know that, no matter how low we sink, we'll never be as pathetic as whoever invented this thing. "You cannot expect to instantly be a master at this! It takes months of rigorous training!"....and they're talking about a FUCKING COLLECTABLE CARD GAME!!

"Home Movies" is very cool too- I'm sad that Cartoon Network Europe doesn't show "Space Ghost Coast To Coast" tho.

Coming in January: the return of the "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles."

YEEEEEESSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!

Daniel_Rf, Sunday, 20 October 2002 22:06 (twenty-two years ago)

Terrible Thunder Lizards

And there was two main characters; one happy guy and one who was like Peter Puppy in the "I yearn for the sweet embrace of the grave" type way.

naked as sin (naked as sin), Monday, 21 October 2002 09:06 (twenty-two years ago)

Oh man Home movies and Space Ghost make me want to get sky installed so I can watch cartoon network like at Ess Kay's.

Elisabeth (Elisabeth), Monday, 21 October 2002 09:14 (twenty-two years ago)

"Grim and Evil" is one of the worst shows ever conceived. It's just DUMM. Yugi-oh is awful, too, but Kid's WB has Static Shock and X-Men:Evolution, both of which rule majorly.

I hate our cable company because it is somehow fucking up the signal for The Cartoon Network, even though I'm paying for it. Fuckers.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Monday, 21 October 2002 11:21 (twenty-two years ago)

"Grim and Evil" is one of the worst shows ever conceived. It's just DUMM.

Hey, I just saw it for the Voltaire bit. And since Voltaire is brilliant, rah. :-)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 21 October 2002 15:31 (twenty-two years ago)

J.--do you mean Ghostbusters or do you mean The Real Ghostbusters?

M Matos (M Matos), Monday, 21 October 2002 16:09 (twenty-two years ago)

when do they show these cartoons? Saturday AM? You are getting up too early probably.

g (graysonlane), Monday, 21 October 2002 16:19 (twenty-two years ago)

Fox had Eek The Cat and The Tick on at one time didn't they? And they also showed old Spiderman 10 million part series such as Sins of The Father almost exactly as the comic book. The X Men show was just getting good when they pulled the plug on that one.

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Monday, 21 October 2002 17:01 (twenty-two years ago)


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