Mick McCarthy goes - are you happy or sad?

MM seems to *want* to go to the premiership more than he wants to weather the storm and I suspect that he's also had enough of the pressure of the Keane thing. Can't blame him.

Bring back Roy - in what way exactly do the Irish have sympathy for this twat? To do what he did on the eve of a world cup was unforgiveable and he should never be picked again.

Roy Keane = Psychotic cockfarmer
Eamon Dunphy = Gobshiting cockfarmer

The Irish have had this bullshit that we will never make any real progress in the world cup, so why bother organising proper facilities? pushed down our throats for long enough. Roy demanded professionalism, good facilities, so he could do physically harder training. It wasn't like he was demanding some superstar perks, like a bigger tv screen in his hotel room, or a jacuzzi, so I don't understand prima-donna accusations. Look at it this way: the other players are out there drinking themselves silly a few days before a key game, the kits haven't arrived on time, the training pitch is rock hard. Roy demands better than this, and somehow he is the traitor to the cause? McCarthy pulled Roy Keane into a room and interrogated him about an interview he did (in which everything he said was 100% accurate) in front of the other players. It doesn't surprise me that he freaked out, and any manager with half a brain would have realised this. Don't the Irish public, many of whom have paid thousands to come out to Japan to see the team, have a right to know how shoddily they are being prepared for one of the biggest events in Irish sporting history? Roy was speaking his mind, and McCarthy and the FAI shouldn't have given him reason to complain in the first plays by preparing so badly for a major tournament.

Ironically, Ireland exited from the world cup, not because we were outclassed technically on the football field, but because of poor foresight on McCarthy's part (he didn't prepare them for a penalty shoot-out, he didn't realise Spain had 10 men on the pitch). Seems Roy was talking sense after all. If we went to the World Cup with the intention of doing a proper job, like Roy demanded, we'd have been better equipped for this situation.

The Irish have had this bullshit that we will never make any real progress in the world cup, so why bother organising proper facilities? pushed down our throats for long enough. Roy demanded professionalism, good facilities, so he could do physically harder training. It wasn't like he was demanding some superstar perks, like a bigger tv screen in his hotel room, or a jacuzzi, so I don't understand prima-donna accusations. Look at it this way: the other players are out there drinking themselves silly a few days before a key game, the kits haven't arrived on time, the training pitch is rock hard. Roy demands better than this, and somehow he is the traitor to the cause? McCarthy pulled Roy Keane into a room and interrogated him about an interview he did (in which everything he said was 100% accurate) in front of the other players. It doesn't surprise me that he freaked out, and any manager with half a brain would have realised this. Don't the Irish public, many of whom have paid thousands to come out to Japan to see the team, have a right to know how shoddily they are being prepared for one of the biggest events in Irish sporting history? Roy was speaking his mind, and McCarthy and the FAI shouldn't have given him reason to complain in the first plays by preparing so badly for a major tournament.

Ironically, Ireland exited from the world cup, not because we were outclassed technically on the football field, but because of poor foresight on McCarthy's part (he didn't prepare them for a penalty shoot-out, he didn't realise Spain had 10 men on the pitch). Seems Roy was talking sense after all. If we went to the World Cup with the intention of doing a proper job, like Roy demanded, we'd have been better equipped for this situation.

I'd be very interested to see how Toshack did, I've got a soft spot for him.

He did great things at wimbledon, which is a similar kind of job (getting great things out of a mixture of class players, veterans, and tireless workhorses). Former Ireland international, too. Problem is, he hasn't done anything of note for a while. Toshack would be cool, though. He managed Madrid, so he'd definitely do a PROPER job, none of the half-assed preparation that characterised McCarthy.

OK, fair enough.

Beg to differ. Roy is a devoted family man, doesn't enjoy being away from his family for long periods. I'm sure if everyone around him was putting in proper effort in Japan, he'd have happily put up with it, but Christ, we were never going to make SERIOUS headway with that attitude. I'm sure lots of people COULD put up with that sort of thing, but I wouldn't blame him because he doesn't tolerate shoddy preparation. It'll have positive long term repercussions for Irish football too - next time all eyes will be on the FAI's preparation, and they'll have to make sure there's no more fuck-ups.

still, teamworks overrated anyway, thats for the lesser lights, right?

There's no way Kinnear should get the job, to be honest I'm not sure about Toshack either.

Anyway despite my above comments I'm glad to see McCarthy resign, there was too much bad blood and he's better off leaving now and allowing someone new to have a totally clean slate by the time the next campaign comes along. (we'll see what happens with this one)

Gareth I liked the parts where he criticised the other players for not caring while admitting to being out getting hammered all the time.

My last post was a bit too emphatic, I do agree with you a tiny bit Bob, part of me just wishes he had bitten his lip and held out a couple more days. But I still think that the situation arose because of huge errors made by others, and they should take 99% of the blame.

Sorry, but to claim that Keane has higher professional standards than say, Niall Quinn or Steve Staunton is bullshit. He might be a *better* player, but so what? To imply that the other players are Sunday morning piss-artists straight out of the Killarney Sunday League Div 3 is ridiculous. They're mainly premiership players after all. Also isn't Keane a drinker?

Granted the training facilities or whatever may not have been up to scratch, BUT in that situation you get together as a team, try to improve it and if it doesn't you stick together and make the best of it AS A TEAM. England's training pitch was shit too.

I don't disagree that the FAI are hopeless, but it's well known that they always have been. Keane should have voiced this at the start of the campaign , not on the eve of the finals. Or given it his best shot and then complained AFTER.

I would agree, if I thought the player had seriously stepped out of line. In this instance, all Roy had done was demand good facilities and hard work.

"The post of manager is the post of manager, Roy Keane should have known this"

The post of manager also comes with responsiblities to prepare the team properly, which McCarthy didn't. I know Roy ruled himself out once he ranted at McCarthy, but how did it come to that in the first place?

Then don't go at all. Say you're unavailable.

He did. He's been complaining about the shoddy work the FAI do for years, and they've brought in lots of positive changes as a result. But obviously they weren't listening carefully enough.

Mick and keane had a meeting in Roy's house at the start of the campaign, and Mick assured him that we would do things properly from now on. He didn't, thus failing in his responsibility as manager yet again.

In the rest of my post, I said that he would be keen to stay if we were going to make a proper effort in the World Cup. He left when he saw that it was going to be 3 weeks of the usual bullshit.

Come on! By then it didn't matter. What's the right thing to do Kilian? Choose a) or b)

a) Say 'we're ill-prepared, the facilities stink and I'm off'

b)Say ' 'we're ill-prepared, the facilities stink but it's too late to do anything about it so I'll give it my best shot for the team and my country'

Have you ever played a team sport, Kilian?

If you read Quinn's book, you'll hear about he and several other players sneaked out well past their curfew for late night drinking binges. And about how this state of affairs had been going on for years. Quinn wouldn't even argue himself that he has the same professional standards as Keane (and doesn't).

But what bullshit exactly? As I said, if Quinn, Duff, Given, Robbie Keane, Staunton et al can prepare, why not Roy?

Yes, but I don't see what that has to do with anything.

"a) Say 'we're ill-prepared, the facilities stink and I'm off'

b)Say ' 'we're ill-prepared, the facilities stink but it's too late to do anything about it so I'll give it my best shot for the team and my country'"

Bearing in mind his distance from his family, I think it's pretty understandable that he'd go home. B!

And do you think Mick and the FAI gave it their best shot for team and country?

The crap facilities, as outlined above.

"As I said, if Quinn, Duff, Given, Robbie Keane, Staunton et al can prepare, why not Roy?"

Just because others can tolerate something doesn't mean Roy is wrong for taking a stand against it.

sometimes the immediate win isn't the most important thing, surely?

(clearly i am playing he-cares-not-a-fig-for-football advocate)

I don't think we'll ever agree on this one! In some respects, I wish he'd bitten his lip, in that I'd like to have seen him play in Japan. But in the sense of changing Irish football in the long-term, it was the ideal time to take a stand. The next manager, and the FAI, will be SOOOO careful not to let this happen next time out.

I captained a school team (ok, badminton, but so what?!), and I was the polar opposite to the Roy Keane style captain. I was meek, didn't train very hard, and wouldn't have bothered raising complaints about poor facilities. Doesn't mean that if someone on the team raised valid objections, and walked out because of them, I'd have thought they were a wanker.

Ireland were unbeaten in a qualifying group which included Holland and Portugal last time out (with Roy)

Now without him, and with a team full of what you define as "team players" we have lost to Russia and Switzerland.

And if demanding better facilities, and that everyone gives 100%, means you are not a team player, I'll forgive him this.

a big mouth may be forgivable, but what when it all happens again?

Kevin Keegan for Ireland manager!

But it has everything to do with the facilities. The situation escalated to that level because of the bad facilities. Even if you think Roy handled that situation the wrong way, don't you think Mick should take some blame for the crap facilities? He didn't just attack Mick randomly, the verbal slaughter was the last in a line of a series of events, many of which were McCarthy mistakes.

"yes kilian roy keane fucked off home for the good of the future of irish football. what a brave selfless martyr"

I have to admit I was pushing it here, though. I know that wasn't what was in Roy's head at the time. But you also have to look at the chain of events which led to him flipping out.

I hear a certain N.Whiteside is looking for a job as well.

oh how i pine for james richardson and his team of punsters