the least worst of the (major-ish) moderate 2020 democratic presidential candidates

Buttigieg, easily, imo. Can form a coherent thought, not known to be an abusive boss.

yeah buttigieg. but i also hate him more just for being the best of this dismal crowd

Buttigieg seems like a clown rather than a douche so

Buttigieg.

As much as I've incessantly railed about Trump as the end of American democracy (such as it were), the world where Bloomberg buys the democratic nomination would be a generous sprinkling of salt to ensure that nothing ever again sprouted from that fallow ground.

I have yet to hear Buttigieg from a coherent thought that actually means anything

Biden seems at least like a human person.

Only a human person would call someone a 'lying, dog-faced pony soldier' to their face.

I was going to vote for the without racist baggage in their past but...

I'm not sure I can even bring myself to vote in this poll

There's nothing particularly good about Biden, so I guess that makes Biden the least worst

fuck it I’m riding w Klobs. her brain isn’t melting and she’s probably the most honest about her intentions—which are largely bad, but no worse than Pete or Mike.

biden definitely the least-worst, but now his brain is mush. so that is bad.

some part of me still thinks a lot of what Pete's been saying lately is just positioning to give himself the best chance to win. not that he'd turn into Bernie if he did win, but idk, I just don't think even he believes his own bullshit as much as someone like Biden does. certainly the range of possible outcomes of a Buttigieg presidency is wider than Biden's, for better and worse.

going with Klobuchar just to counter how much this country hates women

not voting till i see how they handle being brought a salad but no implement to eat it with

I spent some time torn between Buttigieg and Klobuchar but then realized that the real answer to this is Elizabeth Warren.

she's not a moderate

kloobs

Which is supremely fucked up. If this country was anything approaching normal she would be

xpost

I know Warren is a moderate because I'm a moderate and she's my favorite. Her platform is progressive capitalism. That's the very definition of moderate liberalism!

Maybe a better way to say it is that Warren is the candidate in the race whose politics are closest to Obama's, so for people who see Obama as a moderate (much of this board), she's a moderate.

For people who see Obama as a leftist (i.e. not this board) I don't see how any of these folks besides Bloomberg is a "moderate."

butti is the worst because he has, i think, the least impressive experience in the area he is seeking, and possibly the worst record even there, and based in his comments on several topics, ZERO credibility. And his charm eludes me, tho i think he is likely the smartest of these.

biden is the next worst as one who has no clue or will to do what needs done to actually improve things, and is far in his dotage.

bloomberg is next better but fuck him his billions and the continued perversion of process. he is at least, i presume, still competent.

my winner is then this person of whom i have little real knowledge by which to judge.

xp

she's significantly more liberal (left, whatever) than obama and nearly every democratic senator, not to mention every single presidential candidate except for one

But if I have to choose between these four and I get to choose one to be President, not to be Trump's GE opponent, I choose Klobuchar. Her politics and Buttigieg's don't seem wildly different to me, and I think it would be a positive good for the US to have a woman as President. I imagine it's true that she's a crap boss, but I'm gonna be honest, I think anyone in politics at this level has serious personality deformations and I don't believe that "shitty to her assistants" bleeds out into her role as President in the same way that "record of sexual harrassment and/or assault" does.

it’s like the only trait of hers that springs to my mind! but i think youre not wrong, eephus

If I have to choose Trump's GE opponent rather than just installing my pick in the ellipsoidal conference room I do have serious worries about how sexist the electorate is and that pushes me towards the Mayor.

Klobuchar is the least worst, though this might be because I've seen the least coverage other than when she threw a fork on a plane or something

Klobuchar, heaven forgive me.

Here's hoping she throws a stapler at Donald Trump.

Klobuchar or Bloomberg

I was thinking about comments re who is similar to Obama. and also about why I was not initially hostile but optimistic about butti.

i was mostly feelin “here’s a dude who was a social minority outlier as a gay in the military and very smart and competent.“ I hoped he would be a bit like Obama outta that- that he was aware of his opposition and core-dedicated to change, tho aware (and post-obama, HYPERaware), that the opposition is implacable and needs to be handled directly for credibility.

but afaict butti shows none of that. If anything it is as if he concludes that knuckling under or allying to inadequate status quo is the best course for all. It’s gross.

bloomps

Bloomberg

gotta say the only two who remain that know that some core changes are needed and that the opposition is implacable are bernie and warren. i just think the one who knows really knows how to do those changes is warren, and that’s one reason finance and countryclub gop fear her.

also, i legit fear bernie won’t make the end of his term for age.

gah sorry thread derail

least worst to worst:

1. Klobuchar - honestly don't have a sense of what her presidency would actually look like so she wins by default
2. Biden - would not actively try to make the world too much worse than it was under Obama, would still be a disaster, not actually worried about his mushy brain
3. Buttigieg - cynical campaign for a lifelong careerist, no reason to believe he has any convictions about anything he talks about, strikes me as a future CEO who is constantly apologizing for controversies occurring beneath him that he secretly had full knowledge of and approved, decent chance he opens the doors to his McKinsey friends and somehow Enrons the presidency
4. Bloomberg - an actual nevertrump republican by 2020 standards, only an accelerationist can see upside here

Didn't Warren half define herself by fighting Obama? How is she the most Obama-like?

for me i dont think of her as obama-like. her own recognition of implacability of gop came from working on the inside long enough not as an organizer. though both found avenues in academia.

Biden seems at least like a human person.

Not a human I would want running anything, though.

I could see Buttigieg's vagueness working in his favour as a competent centrist.

Obama was a neolib, Warren is a lib

Judy is a punk

Sheena: hold my docs

Bloomberg - stop and frisk, billionaire vampire, trying to buy an election
Buttigieg - complete zero, McKinsey, resume building via imperialism
Klobuchar - bad record as prosecutor, throws binders at peoples' heads
Biden - generally amiable but creepy, long record of shitty positions

I guess I'd vote Klobuchar out of those four.

I don't have to work for her and odds are good that the people who want to work in her Senate office deserve to have things thrown at them.

i'm leaning klobuchar bc her throwing shit at ppl is lbj-esque

biden probably the least worst as a president, buttigieg the least worst in terms of not getting his ass kicked in the general

few things on earth irritate me more than a shitty boss but...odds are good that the people who want to work in her Senate office deserve to have things thrown at them is probably not out of bounds

just personally I am going to take the stance that no worker deserves their boss throwing shit at them

(this is irrational, I realize, but klobuchar is the only candidate in my lifetime where I actually understood the “there’s just something I don’t like about her” thing)

she was my OG #1 most hated but i think maybe her inability (thus far) to be an actual threat has made me view her more favorably than the others.

my mom was (is?) leaning towards her bc she's a boomer afraid of lefties getting owned

Voting Bloomberg as least worst because of climate and guns. Klobuchar has gone (for me) from nonentity to hate-object just because Chuck Todd et al. are trying so hard to make her happen.

impossible poll, would be klob on vague/unknown grounds but katherine otm, i'm not ticking the box for an abusive boss.

all bad

Either Biden or Klobuchar for me, I guess

https://graneyandthepig.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/joebidenwash.jpg

Biden would give the farm away for some magic beans. Buttigeig is a honey trap for white middle class voters to fall into, but a third of the Democratic coalition would view him with extreme distrust, depressing turnout. Klobuchar is just weak sauce, even compared to HRC, and she won't get within sniffing distance of the nomination, no matter what Chuck Todd says. Bloomberg is a strutting, self-regarding billionaire who would replicate some of Trump's awfulness, only in some other direction.

I'm supposed to choose one of these? Nope. Sure, I might have one of them forced on me by forces beyond my control, but I won't choose any of them.

she was my OG #1 most hated but i think maybe her inability (thus far) to be an actual threat has made me view her more favorably than the others.

― A-B-C. A-Always, B-Be, C-Chooglin (will), Tuesday, February 11, 2020 7:31 PM (fifty-two minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

look what you've done

of these klobuchar seems the least like a shell of a human being

Hey I wish like hell she’d beat Pete in NH. I suspect she’ll fizzle in SC and NV but I’d love to have seen her deny him a “victory” lap.

xp: By voting record and platform, Warren is more progressive than Sanders. Not a moderate by any stretch. But also not someone poisoning their chances in the general espousing socialism.

Uh, your second link actually says that Sanders has a more progressive platform. The difference is in their "day one democracy agenda" whatever that actually means.

klob. the mean boss stuff is mb bad but otoh it would be like veep

that scorecard's not great. looking into it the difference in "day one democracy agenda" is just sanders isn't in favour of removing the filibuster, instead aiming to get things through the senate through some budget reconciliation loophole which would have basically the same effect if it works but they don't talk about that and just dink him points. they give buttigieg points for "court reform" but his plan is terrible and unworkable since it would require a constitutional amendment. they also give sanders & warren the same score on foreign policy which is one of the clearest differences between the two! hard to understand how warren has been better at building grassroots power either

ive decided my ranking is

1) klob
2) butt
3) bide
4) yikes bloomberg

Bloomberg was a divisive, Robert Moses-like mayor who gave the city away to his real estate buddies and served (bought) an illegal third term. He recently went on PBS saying he doesn't believe in term limits, flaunting his elitist attitude. One really gets the impression he regards democracy or egalitarianism as something of a nuisance. Disturbed that several people on here think he's the "least bad".

honestly outside of (maaaaaybe) Joe I think that applies to everyone here. But yeah, Bloomberg is probably the worst.

I lol voted Klobs but the pro-life Democrat bs can fuck off into the ocean

“applies to everyone” re One really gets the impression he regards democracy or egalitarianism as something of a nuisance that is

Y'know, I'm just thankful for the moment that the viable dem candidates aren't limited to just this pack of clowns and nonentities this time around.

Yet, anyway.

Klobuchar is an abusive asshole who doesn't want to do anything for anybody and yet somehow less repellent on a gut level than Buttigieg. She also can't stand him, which is another point for her. Biden may be "harmless" now but in the way Junior Soprano was harmless toward the end. Bloomberg is as close to an actual monster as you can get.

going to be real bummed out if Warren saddles up w Klobuchar

Klobuchar's instinct to court every possible vote from every possible voter, including anti-abortion voters, would seem to make internal sense to a politician who before all else wants to be elected. The problem is that anti-abortion voters tend to be single-issue voters and the Republicans have courted them for decades through strong and consistent support for anti-abortion policies, so there's no reason on earth to think that, given a choice between strong, guaranteed anti-abortion policies and wishy-washy 'open-mindedness', an anti-abortion voter would choose wishy-washy. Ever.

So, what on earth is going on in Klobuchar's head to think otherwise?

I just assume it's a Cenobite dance party 24/7

everyone listed here is a lying dog-faced pony soldier

staplerhead xp

I believe I prefer Hillary Clinton to all of them.

lock board

ilx is complete

looooool

the Dems can always get worse, and do

NV culinary union declines to endorse anyone, imagine this is probably the end for biden

I imagine there is probably some potential middle ground on abortion between “all abortion is murder” and “any abortion restriction is patriarchal hegemony”. You’re not going to win over the single issue voters but there could be some folks out there who are sympathetic to restricting abortion but would like an excuse to vote Democratic.

oops sorry for wrong thread

I imagine there is probably some potential middle ground on abortion between “all abortion is murder” and “any abortion restriction is patriarchal hegemony”.

― o. nate, Thursday, February 13, 2020 1:53 PM (one minute ago)

nah

yeah absolutely not

otm

all abortion is the business of the woman having the abortion and any person she chooses to involve in her decision

that's it

I was speculating on the existence of political middle ground not on the actual morality of the issue.

at this point tho anybody who views this as a real right worth protecting also surely realizes that all the "middle ground" stuff works to enable the ongoing bit-by-bit nationwide onslaught against that right by a thousand cuts. and those who view abortion as an evil aren't going to vote for anyone who recognizes it as a right.

i wasnt really clued into klobey’s environmental record
https://centeractionfund.org/environmental-report-card/?fbclid=IwAR1jIGzvJnQOltGmTKY3axHmWNXpQ3Y1bG9CTHmNlYyyngF-PdP8ftQz8O8#Methodology
I tried to figure out if that was reliable info, the “methodology” was pretty general.

fbclid=IwAR1jIGzvJnQOltGmTKY3axHmWNXpQ3Y1bG9CTHmNlYyyngF-PdP8ftQz8O8#Methodology

the middle ground is that if you are personally anti-abortion don't get one

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

Buttigieg has been really rubbing me the wrong way since I voted. I guess Biden then?

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

On a pure stylistic level Klobuchar appeals to me the most out of this crowd, but I'm not sure her kind of snarky, back-of-the-classroom persona would translate well to a national stage that likes passion and the "vision thing". Whatever his other flaws, Buttigieg at least gets that, and he's not a million years old or a billionaire, so I guess I probably should have voted for him.

too late amy’s the new president now

pete
amy
biden

bloomberg

gabbard.

bloomberg worse than gabbard imo

i agree but that might be influenced by the fact that bloomberg is much more likely to become president than gabbard is

“Back-of-the-classroom persona” is so on point from casual obv