Being a socialist, a radical, or an anarchist is not the same as 'bitching loudly on the internet every day'.

YES IT IS

no gods no posters

whynotboth.gif

for tons of ppl bitching loudly on the internet is how they perform their politics so esby otm?

And for other people it isn't so esby not otm?

yeah but consider the audience

I am.

I guess centrists can perform their politics "in the real world" by doing nothing and not caring "like grown ups"

as one of ilxs centrists, or right wing cunts, depending on yknow, whatever, statement is otm

yeah true maybe they should roll up into state capitols heavily armed

Good summary of centrist foreign policy positions

yelling at the kids is not burning and raving at close of day

burning and raving at close of day is bewailing one's own mortality and how just as you're closing in on the wisdom and vision you sought, your time starts to run out, and your energy flags no matter how jealously you've guarded your powers, and besides the futility of the whole enterprise becomes more transparent and it doesn't seem fair because seen from the right angle it all seems so beautiful but the clarity of your aging eyes forces to you see both that beauty and its pointlessness

being mad at williamsburg is basically going gentle, because it's what all the olds do when they run out of the power to be properly mad

― The Complainte of Ray Tabano, Saturday, November 29, 2014 1:37 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

does being a socialist, a radical, and/or an anarchist necessitate actual activism?

if "activism" means engaging in some kind of related activity, then I'd say yes.

Like voting.

does being a socialist, a radical, and/or an anarchist necessitate actual activism?

Oh boy, ILX! That's where I'm a political activist!

https://media.vlipsy.com/vlips/AibjjLYi/preview.jpg

Does this also work for fascists. Like if you spend all day on nazi websites making racist posts in favour of totalitarian regimes this isn't proactive enough to qualify you as a fascist? Asking for a friend.

It only appears to apply to the left.

Does this also work for fascists. Like if you spend all day on nazi websites making racist posts in favour of totalitarian regimes this isn't proactive enough to qualify you as a fascist? Asking for a friend.

Lock thread. Turn out the lights when you leave.

if the nazis were as inneffectual at achieving their goals as the internet left????? oh my god dude if only

sounds like literal utopia to this jew but i guess you thought you were making some other point

good job responding to this thread guys, rather than leaving in its "one and done" state with just j's reply

w/ his fascism comment plax seems to have come around to esby's point which is that bitching on the internet is the same as performing politics

Of course bitching on the internet is performing politics. Of course there are many other ways that politics get enacted. This is all very easy.

define your terms people idk wth you mean. who are leftists? what is activism? ineffectual at/for what, to whom, etc

who are leftists?
*comedy answer redacted*

what is activism?
seems p self evident: posting on the internet, voting for a 90 yr old white guy, standing in the lobby of a bank 7 years ago

ineffectual at/for what, to whom, etc
i personally think the leftism project is going fine but the participants themselves don't seem to think so, cf. 20000000000 posts on this website

I doubt the question was directed at you tbh.

leftism

It was a great album at the time, not sure how I'd feel about it today.

are y'all motherfuckers just mad that we've quarantined the existing political threads, so you've taken to starting new political threads in a desperate attempt to get people to engage with your bullshit?

there is only one functioning politics thread on ilx, dealing with the politics of a functioning country strangely enough

and we havent even sorted out our election results from several months ago

Canada begs to differ.

it may beg away it lives in a semi d

my impression is that when the demographics of voting shift (and they will, unless ~changes in mechanics~), there will be little mercy, because none was shown, and the people thus in power are therefore kinda...merciless assholes.

The likes of Corbyn and Sanders were the compromise solution. Should demographics take over => guillotine time!

the anger of the toiling masses is as nothing compared to insatiable bloodthirst of the parlor radical

wouldn't count on demographics for another decade at least, probably more like 15 years

Demographics aren't going to combat contemporary capitalism. Jeff Bezos's zillions aren't going to disappear when he finally eats it.

idk if he eats his money it will quite literally disappear

https://communemag.com/

Esby is a VL

and you sir are an R lmao

Folks, you know what to do

https://i.ibb.co/QD8C8QQ/rolleyes7cm.gif

i don't understand VL and R and what any of that is ... just that commune mag is shutting down partly because one of its (former) editors was called out as a rapist

I mean,you could guess what he means by R. Pretty obvious

esby ist eine verbotene Liebe.

R Kelly?

mein geist ist sagen mir NEIIIIIIINNNNN

i personally think the leftism project is going fine

probably should be letting this thread sink down the page into oblivian but I just wanted to thank you for this, I have had an especially miserable day but for real snarfed my beer when I read this and feel better now

whatever happened to the Oblivians?

oh like earth xp

Not if you don't feel safe enough to do that! Or even confident enough, or hell, motivated enough.

On a completely different note, I find it weird that I've just incorporated "leftist" into my vocabulary.

xxxp

xp - given the direction this conversation has gone I have zero confidence in my "causing a fuss about the culture" doing anything but getting mocked

thanks for sharing your experience milo

serious qualms about shitty endemic behaviour should and I hope will always be taken seriously in any leftist organisation worth the name

have there been recent DSA sexism dustups? I don't hear about this stuff anymore since I quit twitter

I should say 'sexism/harrassment/assault/etc'

it’s fine to dismiss an entire org because of shit experiences esp when the reaction to raising them is this kind of thing

except the part where I said I wasn't doing that? jesus christ

i don't read it as sarcastic.

xp I was going off the suggestion from another post above. I’m sorry if I implied it was your position. it’s not sarcastic though

got it, apologeis

*apologies

but surely the solution is to join and cause a fuss about the culture, that's how things improve

― imago, Friday, November 13, 2020 1:40 PM (yesterday)

hahaha that is the classic hetero cis-white guy response! ... this is why the term "emotional labor" is so common in the QTPOC left, as well as the focus on organizing amongst themselves where they are at the front, as opposed to waiting for the cis-white men (and women sometimes) to STFU.

not saying anyone has to, but wouldn't you have to join first to know?

You don't need to join a group to anticipate how its culture will be affecting you, especially in cases like the very vocal and very web-present dirtbag left.

web-present would be the important part, no?

ie

it’s fine to dismiss an entire org because of shit experiences esp when the reaction to raising them is this kind of thing

No one has described "shit experiences" with their local DSA or any related organization, AFAICT? There's an assumption that these bad people online would be pervasive in this entirely unconnected organization.

You don't need to join a group to anticipate how its culture will be affecting you, especially in cases like the very vocal and very web-present dirtbag left.

― Van Horn Street, Saturday, 14 November 2020 23:21 (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

it seems a bit far to literally say that this organisation specifically is unsafe though don't you think?

Arguing that a very vocal online presence associated with a political persuasion wouldn't necessarily be present at IRL meetings associated with that political persuasion is more of a stretch, IMHO.

Like if some DSA dude harassed my friend online, I'd be pretty loathe to go to my local DSA for the first time. Don't really understand why that's so hard to grasp.

and there are plenty of progressive / left groups and causes to participate in that aren't the DSA. Like ... this argument just feels kinda absurd to me at this point.

but surely those would also be unsafe?

associated with a political persuasion

some DSA dude harassed my friend online

This is the assumption that I'm referring to. There hasn't even been an accusation that "DSA dudes" harassed anyone's friends, but that's the thread being run with?

Like if some DSA dude harassed my friend online, I'd be pretty loathe to go to my local DSA for the first time. Don't really understand why that's so hard to grasp.

― healthy cocaine off perfect butts (the table is the table), Sunday, 15 November 2020 00:20 (twenty minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

but all that was claimed was that people, who might be the kind of people to go to a dsa meeting because they have leftist opinions, would be there and subsequently it was implied that it was unsafe.

I guess I didn't take it that way. I took it as 'some DSA-associated people harassed my friend, and I don't feel good going to a DSA meeting as a result.'

but surely those would also be unsafe?

― plax (ico), Saturday, November 14, 2020 4:35 PM (thirty-eight minutes ago)

not necessarily, there are plenty of groups that don't have "those dudes" in them because they were formed by people who didn't want to have to deal with "those dudes"

but how can you be sure?

they restrict membership to womxn and non-binary ppl?

like one way to not have to deal with "those dudes" is to not allow dudes in yr group?

so the "specific category" is men or leftist men?

it seems a bit far to literally say that this organisation specifically is unsafe though don't you think?

I will leave it to each individual what they deem safe or unsafe for themselves.

so would i. but there is a difference between saying something would make you feel unsafe and something is unsafe

why on earth would you think I'm saying that someone is not entitled to feel how they feel?

dsa guy and his twitter gf pic.twitter.com/Rn4FnSUqTZ

— the once again welfare king (@singlepayertom) November 14, 2020

Pretty incredible how a bunch of dudes keep questioning the logic and making fun of a woman who noted that there are a ton of really abusive assholes associated with the DSA online, and that she thus didn't feel safe going to meetings of the DSA. Really beginning to understand more and more why ILX is such a boys club.

I don't see anybody making fun of anyone or questioning the logic of not wanting to go

in fact as far as I can see every poster has affirmed the idea that if one feels uncomfortable for whatever reason then one is being perfectly reasonable in declining to go

how about joining the group, expressing your concerns about the individual in question to the individual in question, and then if the issue is not settled to your satisfaction, expressing your concerns about the individual in question privately to the leader(s) of the group, and then if the issue is still not settled to your satisfaction, expressing your concerns to the entire group?

Yesterday @nycDSA endorsed 6 *amazing* candidates for City Council.

It's been one of the joys of our lives to be a part of the @DSAForTheMany slate & so @JabariBrisport and I wanted to properly pass the baton on to our new brothers & sisters in #DSAfortheCity.

📸: @karakul pic.twitter.com/KDuIfMg89V

— Zohran Kwame Mamdani (@ZohranKMamdani) November 15, 2020

lol they gave them roses like in The Bachelor, drove around the city to all 3 candidates they're endorsing and took pics for the soc media. Genius! That was yesterday--today they're doing the Brooklyn ones apparently. I love to see it <3

We started the day with @tiffany_caban.

A career public defender, Tiffany's running in District 22 - my home district!

When she ran for DA, she radically redefined safety so that it leaves none of us behind. Her fight continues this year & she won't stop until justice is won. pic.twitter.com/nDEXZgMGWO

— Zohran Kwame Mamdani (@ZohranKMamdani) November 15, 2020

how about joining the group, expressing your concerns about the individual in question to the individual in question, and then if the issue is not settled to your satisfaction, expressing your concerns about the individual in question privately to the leader(s) of the group, and then if the issue is still not settled to your satisfaction, expressing your concerns to the entire group?

tbf, though it's been a while since I've personally heard of such cases (again, off twitter), there were definitely some instances where the formal group/chapter mechanisms for dealing with abusers/offenders were clearly not adequate

zohran rocks

assholes associated with the DSA online

We just cleared that up but you decided to dip back to it for some reason, that's not a claim anyone has made.

Your local DSA chapter pic.twitter.com/ZsdNukqDKs

— Voodoo Pork (@Voodoo_Pork) February 18, 2020

lol

The next Obama is in DSA right now trying to score

— Khaled 🚌 (@kboulos79) November 18, 2020

yeah true maybe they should roll up into state capitols heavily armed

― A-B-C. A-Always, B-Be, C-Chooglin (will), Saturday, 16 May 2020 18:13 (eight months ago) bookmarkflaglink

Woahhhh hang on a sec what did this guy know

Hey guy, same thing as anyone else I guess. maga idiots were rolling up into state capitols heavily armed last spring while everyone shrugged. and that if anyone left of David Frum were to do anything but bitch on the internet they’d be mowed down in a matter of minutes

never 4get

https://storage.googleapis.com/afs-prod/media/99f19f62d9ed48a084b4c5928d3aa98d/2400.jpeg