Israel/Palestine post 10/7 - follow-on events/thoughts as relate to other countries

As stated.

I guess this thread is the place for this — I got a press release from our local Sheriff's Office today saying they'd had many media queries about "anti-Jewish Rhetoric being distributed" being distributed in our county. (Apologies for the weird capitalized "rhetoric," our Sheriff's Office is only quasi-literate.) It just said that their major crimes and gang units were "looking into the matter," with no further detail.

I haven't seen examples of what this is referring to, and it struck me that it could be either our local Nazi/Proud Boy types out there distributing horrible leaflets, OR it could be student-led "Free Palestine" social media posts or something, and those things seem like they're increasingly being conflated.

Best piece I've read on literary culture at this time. Hard not to conclude the whole thing is a disgrace.

https://thebaffler.com/latest/at-the-threshold-of-humanity-kattan

Don't know much about this organization but this seems like one way to counteract those who try to stir hate:

The pro-Palestine protesters made it clear that the masked neo-Nazis were not welcome, chanting “Nazis Go Home,” and “show your faces, you fucking cowards,” the Daily Montanan reported.

That is just one of the tactics that organizers of pro-Palestine solidarity protests can use to make clear to neo-Nazis that they are not welcome in that movement, according to Ben Lorber, an extremism expert who is working on a book about antisemitism. “It is vital for Palestine liberation organizers and progressive activists to recognize and counter far-right actors who stand diametrically opposed to the movement’s principles and goals,” Lorber wrote in a recent guide for organizers.

https://www.vice.com/en/article/k7zx5a/neo-nazis-hijack-pro-palestine-protest-mike-enoch

Personally, I find it much better to see an effort to recognize and counteract this kind of thing, rather than dismissing or denying that it exists

that's encouraging

Black-Jewish Alliance ✊🏿✡
@BlackJewishA
Police are attempting to arrest Jews in prayer.

We shout “let us pray” for Palestine.

The police have confiscated copies of our speeches.

GET YOUR COP HANDS OFF OUR JEWISH COMRADES

Video of harassment within that tweet.

https://www.theartnewspaper.com/2023/11/02/frick-museum-in-pittsburgh-postpones-islamic-art-exhibition-over-fears-it-would-appear-insensitive-or-traumatic-amid-gaza-war

“When war broke out in the Middle East, we were as heartbroken as everyone, and we realised that we were about to open an exhibition that a forgiving person would call insensitive, but for many people, especially in our community, would be traumatic.”

it's so insensitive and traumatic that muslims exist

this whole thing is so devastating.

This is where stuff like "It would be insensitive to publish this book about Soviet dissidents at this time" leads to.

yeah that is obviously ridiculous

An Israeli air strike on the Bureij refugee camp today

https://x.com/ramabdu/status/1720067423238308122

If you use this thread on anything going on in Gaza or Israel.

Israel, Palestine & the Levant rolling events: Oct 23 on

The dissonance in reading about individuals expressing concerns about anti-Semitic violence rising in North America while 400 Arab children are dying every day in Gaza is, frankly, enraging

I have seen videos of anti-Semitic violence over the past week. These videos are exclusively Jewish peace protesters getting harassed by cops in North America, Orthodox Jewish peace protesters getting beaten by Israeli Police in Israel

My heart is ripped in two for my Jewish friends who are saying “not in my name” and being disowned, being called “self-hating Jews”, or— as the Times Of Jerusalem said in an op-ed two days ago: “anti-Zionists who claim to be Jewish are as Jewish as the Westboro Baptist Church that claimed to be Christian”

Jfc just because you’re saying “stop bombing Gaza” doesn’t make you “anti-Zionist”, to begin with

I was bothered by a now ex-friend who told me “how can you call it Gazan genocide when they (the Gazans) procreate so quickly”; fine, first I will block you and never speak to you again, second I will call it something else. What, tho? Israel already doesn’t acknowledge a nakba exists. Anti-war Jews are liberally calling it a holocaust, a shoah; those terms are not allowed to me as a non-Jew.

I feel like one can’t even call it “war” or “a conflict”; Gideon Levy argued that it is neither of these things, that it is a violent occupation, nothing more

Haaretz today reports Netanyahu’s latest speech: “nothing can stop us”.

Anyway, 9000 Gazans dead today, 3 hostages returned, congrats everyone

“anti-Zionists who claim to be Jewish are as Jewish as the Westboro Baptist Church that claimed to be Christian”

I mean ... fwiw, I do think a very not insignificant number of Christians are let's just say in Westboro's ballpark, if not on the same base

"I was bothered by a now ex-friend who told me “how can you call it Gazan genocide when they (the Gazans) procreate so quickly”"

So much hate.

(xp Not the point of the thread, I know, sorry)

"The dissonance in reading about individuals expressing concerns about anti-Semitic violence rising in North America while 400 Arab children are dying every day in Gaza is, frankly, enraging"

posters on this board are worried about their children being bullied at school for being Jewish

Sorry if my posts were emotional or “in the wrong thread” I shouldn’t post when I’m in a news consumption crying spiral, and I shouldn’t read pro-violence NYT articles (or the NYT at all), I am going to call a friend

I agree with everything else in your post, but you can be horrified by the massacre of innocents in Gaza (and the West Bank) while also being worried about anti-semitic violence

Tbh, the biggest “holy shit what are you guys doing” anti-Semitism concern over the past week has been seeing people on social media cheering on “Yemen declares war on Israel” when it’s the Houthis declaring war, not the Yemeni gvmt, and if anybody is cheering for Houthis then we have a big fucking problem

I have been seeing the odd report of AS attacks across Europe now, like this one.

A Moldovan couple arrested for allegedly spray-painting Stars of David on a Paris school last week reportedly told investigators they were acting on orders from an “individual in Russia.”https://t.co/VvJOmmoCAh

— The Daily Beast (@thedailybeast) November 2, 2023

in the larger world, the anti-semitism is probably largely being driven by people who care less about the plight of the Palestinian people and care more about being anti-semitic, and seeing an opportunity for an opening to be a bit more free with their bigotry.

"zionist jews" now trending on twitter, that's that shit i don't like

Caitlyn Jenner's dead name is also trending there today, which says it all

sorry meant to post on the "is this anti-semitism?" thread

I thought this was pretty good:

You are criticizing Israel wrong. Here’s how to do it correctly. pic.twitter.com/DiwBTJOuiG

— Matt Lieb?? (@mattlieb) October 28, 2023

nice to finally see a video of Van Horn Street

in the larger world, the anti-semitism is probably largely being driven by people who care less about the plight of the Palestinian people and care more about being anti-semitic, and seeing an opportunity for an opening to be a bit more free with their bigotry.

― omar little, Thursday, November 2, 2023 12:29 PM (ten minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

This is upsetting me a lot right now. I know it sounds naïve but I was genuinely surprised at how fast people seized the opportunity to be flat out anti-Semitic. I grew up spending 1/2 the year in a mostly Jewish community in NY where I as a gentile was often the odd one out. 3 of my 5 lifelong close friends are Jewish. I said to one of them yesterday that I think I grew up in this little bubble were I didn't realize how much anti-semitism there still was out there and he was like yeah no shit you're from NY. Anyway - there are a million upsetting things (upsetting isn't anywhere near strong enough) happening right now but I have been thinking a lot about exactly this, OL. :/

it's not good. i have a friend who was indulging in some "deep thoughts" about judaism around the time kanye was on one about jewish people, and i had an instagram convo w/him re: a couple of his posts. i don't know that i reached him, but i tried. another friend (no longer a friend) started to get very alt-right and was an associate of ow3n b3njamin for awhile, a podcast comedian type guy who started to get into some anti-semitic and racist stuff a few years ago. that particular friend is long gone. he was at my wedding. he probably helped hold me up high in my chair during the hora. he just wound up being a particularly "bad actor" in life. and a pernicious influence on others.

i live in a bubble in Los Angeles obv, but shit does happen here. threats against synagogues, anti-semitic graffiti on a famous local deli last night, etc...

the Poetry Foundation shelved a 3500-word review of a poetry book that discusses the book's criticisms of Israel...the poet author of the book is, of course, Jewish, and so is the reviewer.

The donor pocketbook is where artistic freedom hits a wall

This is where stuff like "It would be insensitive to publish this book about Soviet dissidents at this time" leads to.

― Beyond Goo and Evol (President Keyes)

yeah that is obviously ridiculous

― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive)

Reflexive censorship of art always seems to crop up when wars begin and wartime propaganda cranks up the red hot rhetoric. Even as recently as the invasion of Ukraine there were ridiculous people calling for cancellation of symphonies by Russian composers as a sign of solidarity with Ukrainians.

O rly

If a HAMAS sympathizer or a HAMAS-adjacent amateur lone wolf carries out a gun attack in the USA killing more than 10 people in the name is Palestine … this poll will flip like a flapjack. https://t.co/NkWdyaliV7

— Malcolm Nance (@MalcolmNance) November 2, 2023

and if my granny had wheels, she'd be a bicycle. I like the specificity of ten or more people, it shows a vigorous imagination.

Reflexive censorship of art always seems to crop up when wars begin and wartime propaganda cranks up the red hot rhetoric. Even as recently as the invasion of Ukraine there were ridiculous people calling for cancellation of symphonies by Russian composers as a sign of solidarity with Ukrainians.

― more difficult than I look (Aimless), Thursday, November 2, 2023 1:41 PM (five hours ago) bookmarkflaglink
My kid’s teacher canceled their Russia unit. Like I really don’t think it matters to Ukrainian lives whether our kids are learning about faberge eggs and Baryshnikov

re: that poll.. I'm not really sure that Israel needs much military support anyway... they're a major arms manufacturer/exporter, inventors of the Uzi submachine gun. And they seemed to have no issues selling arms to South Africa's white minority government

and yet the House just approved 14.5 billion in aide to Israel for some reason

$4 billion for the Iron Dome, which kind of seems like locking the gate after the dog gets out.

Wake Forest professor resigns after backlash due to tweet

https://journalnow.com/news/local/wake-professor-resigns-following-backlash-of-social-media-post-on-israeli-hamas-war/article_4e1022a4-78ea-11ee-a828-ffa8e334019a.html

(She’s a really good poet, fwiw!)

14.5 billion in aide to Israel for some reason

er, mm, by long tradition all those billions can only be spent on armaments produced by US-based death merchants military-industrial complex manufacturers.

And lots of defence contracting

Protests are being planned for Armistice Day. Looks like the match will be lit on the tiniest pretence

"They died for your freedom, but don't you dare think about exercising it." https://t.co/xyCICKV35j

— James B (@piercepenniless) November 3, 2023

Clare Hymer
@ClareHymer
HAPPENING NOW: Another peaceful sit-in calling for a ceasefire in Gaza, this time at Kings Cross Station.

the only additional freedoms that came because of GB participation in the world wars was the bankrupting and partial destruction of an evil global empire and the resultant decline arguably sped up the process of decolonisation that followed. "Protect our freedoms" my fucking arsehole, it was a warfare state that forced conscripts onto the battlefield, which is the absolute opposite of freedom.

David Adler
@davidrkadler
New bill in the French 🇫🇷 Senate : 'An insult committed against the State of Israel is punishable by two years of imprisonment and a fine of 75,000 euros.'

I don't even want to paste in what Germany are doing, just utterly disgusting

Belgian transport workers saved the lives of thousands of Jews in the 1940s by unlocking the doors of trains headed for the extermination camps. Now, they're refusing to load weapons onto ships headed to Israel. This is a meaningful & timeless solidarity with humanity. pic.twitter.com/kvcUMcnJd7

— Amro Ali (@_amroali) November 3, 2023

Excellent interview with Palestine action, who have taken to militant action to shut down these death factories.

https://newleftreview.org/sidecar/posts/tactics-of-disruption

Speaking of, the Ferranti 2 were given suspended sentences today - https://www.thecanary.co/uk/news/2025/04/23/palestine-actions-ferranti-2/

Destroy Yale:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/apr/23/israel-itamar-ben-gvir-yale

Kneecap 1 Sleaford Mods 0

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2025/apr/24/kneecap-say-statements-arent-aggressive-after-denouncing-israel-at-coachella

xp if you read the article, he spoke at a private lubavitch-run organization that is completely unaffiliated with yale but is cagey about that fact to trade on yale's rep.

not to say yale shouldn't be destroyed for plenty of other reasons

https://bsky.app/profile/eladn.bsky.social/post/3lno4f4x5bc2e

xp: Yes, and yet 30 faculty members attended, according to this.

https://yaledailynews.com/blog/2025/04/24/far-right-israeli-minister-ignites-protests-outside-of-shabtai/

Kehlani concern at Cornell cancelled due to her pro-Palestine stance

Cornell prez described Kehlani pro-Palestine stance and use of word intifada as "anti-Semitic"

Kneecap 1 Sleaford Mods 0

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2025/apr/24/kneecap-say-statements-arent-aggressive-after-denouncing-israel-at-coachella

― Nuts, whole hazelnuts (Tom D.), Thursday, 24 April 2025 bookmarkflaglink

I'm not listening to them even if they might be playing the good tunes these days.

BREAKING: Newly surfaced footage from Kneecap’s November concert shows him chanting “Up Hamas, Up Hezbollah.”

Let’s be clear: this isn’t “pro-Palestinian”—it’s pro-terrorism. Anyone claiming otherwise is lying. pic.twitter.com/jwP4ofEdcH

— Eyal Yakoby (@EYakoby) April 25, 2025

Up the 'RA

https://academeblog.org/2025/04/25/its-not-too-late-to-tell-the-truth-about-antisemitism-on-campus/

We are Jewish academics who have devoted our lives to teaching and research on college campuses. If there were a pervasive culture of antisemitism on campuses, we would know about it, and we would fight it. But we have observed no such thing. Instead, defenders of Israel have spread a lie to distract from and crush dissent over Israel’s genocide of Palestinians.

The “big lie” is a technique of political propaganda that involves repetition of extreme assertions that grossly distort the truth. The most infamous historical example is the Nazi Party’s propagation of a lie about an international Jewish conspiracy instigating World War I—a big lie that Nazi propagandists used to justify their extermination of Jewish people.

For generations, pro-Israel organizations have normalized the idea that the Palestine solidarity movement is antisemitic, calling criticism of Israel the “new antisemitism.” Since 1979, the Anti-Defamation League (ADL) has produced an annual Audit of Antisemitic Incidents, using a flawed methodology that includes criticisms of Israel, expressions of solidarity with Palestinians, and anti-Zionist Jewish rituals as antisemitic incidents. Since Israel’s assault on Gaza after October 7, 2023, the ADL and aligned organizations have used these inflated statistics to present a false narrative about increasing antisemitism, especially on college campuses. But criticism of the state of Israel is not antisemitic.

A report from the Cohen Center for Modern Jewish Studies at Brandeis University found that nearly half of Jewish students consider the phrase “Israel violates the human rights of the Palestinian people” to be antisemitic. But the fact that Israel has violated and continues to violate the human rights of the Palestinian people is undeniable. The state of Israel was born through a mass expulsion of Palestinians during the ethnic cleansing of 1948, known as the Nakba. This was followed by decades of military occupation and the imposition of apartheid and siege; now, in a genocidal assault, Israel has killed more than sixty thousand Palestinians and continues to starve two million people in Gaza. We should thus be asking ourselves which political forces have led so many Jewish students to misinterpret such factual and necessary criticisms of the Israeli state as antisemitism. As the 2023 documentary Israelism shows, this mischaracterization of political speech, especially by young Jewish people, is the intended outcome of Zionist organizations’ effort to manufacture consent for Israeli injustice.

I don't know if this is any particular cause for hope but I just came from a completely sold-out showing of No Other Land here in Knoxville, at our local independent theater. There was a moderated audience discussion afterward, including some quite moving reactions from local Palestianians.

Always knew kneecap were shit.

Novelty Rap Troupe Kneecap Have Completely Shit The Bed. pic.twitter.com/Ikh5e3M5A4

— Elvis Buñuelo (@Mr_Considerate) April 29, 2025

a banger from mondoweiss on the craven meekness of the biden admin in this

https://mondoweiss.net/2025/05/biden-staffers-admit-what-we-all-knew-white-house-lied-about-ceasefire-efforts/

Radiohead will always be cunts.

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2025/may/06/jonny-greenwood-and-israeli-musician-dudu-tassa-condemn-silencing-after-uk-concerts-pulled

BREAKING: Pro-Palestine protesters occupy the main reading room of Columbia University’s Butler Library - the university’s campus security is clearing the library right now.

Photos and videos to follow.

This photo courtesy: Johanna Hansel@DropSiteNews pic.twitter.com/LP6IoPX0a3

— Meghnad Bose (@MeghnadBose93) May 7, 2025

wow that's extraordinarily brave

Didn't Columbia U already sent in NYC police to drag folks out and arrest them

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2025/05/08/columbia-university-protest-trump-administration/

New York police arrested about 80 people after masked protesters rushed into the library, unfurling banners, shouting into megaphones and banging drums in the midst of a reading room full of people studying for final exams Wednesday. Nine-hundred students were forced out, and two campus public safety officers were injured in the chaos, according to the school’s acting president, Claire Shipman.

nypd fml

What a disgusting little shit.

Acting President Shipman describes the unacceptable disruption of Butler Library, the steps the University took to address it, and the strength and determination of Columbia not to let this moment define us. pic.twitter.com/rOSpeHyCkR

— Columbia University (@Columbia) May 8, 2025

welp i guess she doesn’t get it yet

And if she thinks that will get Trump admin off her university's back, she is naive

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/may/10/uk-lawyers-for-israel-condemned-over-claim-war-may-reduce-obesity-in-gaza

Trillions of dollars in deals, yet Arab regimes didn’t leverage even allowing food and water into Gaza.

— Hussein (@EyesOnSouth1) May 14, 2025

And get bombed as sympathizers of terrorist Hamas? Because that’s where we’re at

(Thinking of Syria here specifically)

Like the Saudis/Gulf States have ever given a flying fuck about Palestinians.

Their populations do, so to some extent they have to appear to do so. Qatar maybe a bit different with their bankrolling of Hamas, which goes a lot further than legitimising rhetoric for their domestic audiences (if you consider material support for Hamas to be support for the Palestinians, which I don't personally but I know others may)

Didn’t know Qatar bankrolls Hamas. Maybe if they give another lavish gift they’ll get Trump to chant “from the river to the sea”

Per Wikipedia:

The United States requested in 2011 that Qatar provide a base for the Hamas leadership to ease communications with the group.

Bankrolling was far too strong a word and I apologise, but in terms of material support provided I think Qatar isn't really in the same category as the other gulf states.

Oh, most supporters of Zionist, anti-Palestinian efforts are literal Christian Nazis, and the American wing of the Zionist movement has irrevocably tied itself to the very people who would have cheered the Shoah? You don’t say.

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/05/18/us/project-esther-heritage-foundation-palestine.html?unlocked_article_code=1.IE8.k2ka._0QTtJIs110L&smid=url-share

(gift link)

ha, I came here to post that link too

TIL:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/palestino-palestinian-soccer-chile-1.7536572

We are doubtful that our film investigating attacks on hospitals & medics in Gaza, produced with @BBCNews over 14 months, cleared multiple times at all levels, containing graphic footage of attacks & searing testimony of survivors of those attacks, will be released by @BBCNews

— basement films (@Basement_Films) May 16, 2025

Thought this was p good, as far s these things go.

The DC Shooter Elias Rodriguez’s neighbour speaks. He didn’t stutter and didn’t condemn. He used it to call for an end to the genocide: pic.twitter.com/20TNluErwn

— ashok | ಅಶೋಕ್ 🇵🇸 (@broseph_stalin) May 22, 2025

sorry but fuck off with that shit. "the shooter's neighbor," gives him some authority?
Everything he's saying is great but are we excusing a coldblooded terrorist murderer because he was doing it for a good cause

I think he is a crazy person who killed innocent people because he lives in the U.S.A., where it's easy to go crazy and buy a gun and kill innocent people. That he made himself crazy by consuming too much heartbreaking news about the war in Gaza doesn't make him a sympathetic figure, any more than a person who makes themself crazy watching 60 hours a week of "migrant crime" coverage on Fox News and shoots up a Home Depot. The cause and effect relationship between his political views and his actions simply does not exist in the way it does for an Aaron Bushnell, or even a Luigi Mangione.

I don't know if it rises to the level of "stochastic terrorism" for me personally; but if Jewish people are feeling less safe today because they think he targeted Jews for their Jewishness in order to terrorize Jews, I can't exactly say they are wrong can I? Nothing about what he did makes sense as an act of protest or a political assassination directed at either the state of Israel or the American foreign policy establishment.

otm

Yes.

thirded

Everything he's saying is great but are we excusing a coldblooded terrorist murderer because he was doing it for a good cause

― Lavator Shemmelpennick, Friday, 23 May 2025 bookmarkflaglink

I am posting someone saying some p good things when that's hard to come by.

I think he is a crazy person who killed innocent people because he lives in the U.S.A., where it's easy to go crazy and buy a gun and kill innocent people. That he made himself crazy by consuming too much heartbreaking news about the war in Gaza doesn't make him a sympathetic figure, any more than a person who makes themself crazy watching 60 hours a week of "migrant crime" coverage on Fox News and shoots up a Home Depot. The cause and effect relationship between his political views and his actions simply does not exist in the way it does for an Aaron Bushnell, or even a Luigi Mangione.

I don't know if it rises to the level of "stochastic terrorism" for me personally; but if Jewish people are feeling less safe today because they think he targeted Jews for their Jewishness in order to terrorize Jews, I can't exactly say they are wrong can I? Nothing about what he did makes sense as an act of protest or a political assassination directed at either the state of Israel or the American foreign policy establishment.

― You're supposed to go to Heaven, ideally not Las Vegas (bernard snowy), Friday, May 23, 2025 9:37 AM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

This is v well put, and it also raises an issue I have repeatedly brought up with the constant use of "zionism" and the painting of any prominent Jew or Jewish institution who isn't expressly anti-zionist (like in the sense of Israel should cease to exist) as therefore a "zionist" and therefore bloodthirsty and/or equivalent to Nazis (e.g. Dean Chemerinsky, trustees of the Brooklyn Museum, Hillel, mainstream synagogues, etc.).

xp sorry but no, he said "some p good things" at the beginning and then was also asked to describe the personality of the crazy murderer who killed 2 innocent people and responded "quiet and friendly," not going for that innocence/valor by association

Its how he found him, as a person who had interactions with hi, which is why anyone is talking to him.

No one is about to think any more of him because of that opinion, because we also know he murdered people.

ok

There is way too much “I disagree with his tactics but I’m glad this raises the profile of what’s happening in Gaza” on this board. Fuck off with that shit.

TBF this board is a lot better than a lot of comment sections and subreddits that seem to virtually justify the murders