Long Boom or Short Blip?

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In sunny July of sunny 1997 Wired magazine ran a cover story entitled http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/5.07/longboom_pr.html>The Long Boom. It predicted 25 years of tech-led economic expansion, increasingly inclusive and ethical global trade, an end to environmental problems, to disease and poverty.

Well, we now know something else went boom. But is the article totally wrong about the way the world is going? Was that optimism a blip, or is the current bust-cycle of war, insecurity and terror the blip? And are you nostalgic for the 90s, when 'the world wasn't such a dangerous place' and 'irrational exuberance' was the order of the day?

Momus (Momus), Thursday, 6 February 2003 17:22 (twenty-three years ago)

(HTML tagging always worked back then too!)

http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/5.07/longboom_pr.html

Wired Magazine: The Long Boom.

Momus (Momus), Thursday, 6 February 2003 17:24 (twenty-three years ago)

are you nostalgic for the 90s

Dangerous to make a claim like this depending on where you were at -- I doubt many Rwandans are nostalgic for 1994, or anyone in Yugoslavia for most of the whole decade.

But speaking from a well-off-enough American context, sure was nice to not have the Cold War around.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 6 February 2003 17:28 (twenty-three years ago)

Who the fuck knows?
Only time will tell, eh?

Oops (Oops), Thursday, 6 February 2003 17:29 (twenty-three years ago)

I read some stuff about stock market crashes before the tech stocks crash.

Apparently just before a stock crash people start going on about how technology or something has led to a new paradigm of permanent economic expansion and rising stock prices.

DV (dirtyvicar), Thursday, 6 February 2003 17:32 (twenty-three years ago)

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Aaron Grossman (aajjgg), Thursday, 6 February 2003 17:37 (twenty-three years ago)

The two peters do see some dark stuff in their 1997 crystal ball:

'Will a rise in terrorism cause the world to pull back in constant fear?'

and

'The Middle East, meanwhile, enters crisis. Two main factors drive the region's problems. One, the fundamentalist Muslim mind-set is particularly unsuited to the fluid demands of the digital age. The new economy rewards experimentation, constant innovation, and challenging the status quo - these attributes, however, are shunned in many countries throughout the Middle East. Many actually get more traditional in response to the furious pace of change. The other factor driving the crisis is outside their control. The advent of hydrogen power clearly undermines the centrality of oil in the world economy. By 2008, with the auto industry in a mad dash to convert, the bottom falls out of the oil market. The Middle Eastern crisis comes to a head. Some of the old monarchies and religious regimes begin to topple.'

...or were they pushed?

Momus (Momus), Thursday, 6 February 2003 17:41 (twenty-three years ago)

From that New York Times article: 'Government agencies have been among the few employers that continue to expand'

Nice to see lots of jobs as spies, baggage checkers, Arabic translators etc, bucking the trend.

Momus (Momus), Thursday, 6 February 2003 17:48 (twenty-three years ago)

Generally speaking it seems like things are getting better. The peace dividend from the end of the cold war has turned out to be a myth, though generally we all feel safer, unless the thought of terrorism causes you some distress (can't see how it could versus nuclear annihilation, but...). As far as the stock market problems go, we (irritating) accountants knew it wasn't going to last by taking one look at the P/E (price/earnings - a measure of how many times the stock price is over the earnings per share) ratios of top companies, esp. tech companies. It used to be that if a company had a P/E ratio over 10 or 15 was considered too high. Investors were going nuts over companies with P/E ratios of up to 200 or more! It was almost starting to look like we might have had to change some fundamental assumptions about investing, and maybe we do. The whole topic is fraught with moral ambiguity (whatever that means!).

Bryan (Bryan), Thursday, 6 February 2003 17:50 (twenty-three years ago)

So far most of the hydrogen powered vehicles use hydrogen derived from hydrocarbons, so it hasn't become a problem for those folks yet!

Bryan (Bryan), Thursday, 6 February 2003 17:52 (twenty-three years ago)

The 90's did feel "safe" didn't they. Or maybe I was too busy getting drunk to watch the news.

Lynskey (Lynskey), Thursday, 6 February 2003 19:08 (twenty-three years ago)

Yeah, I'm not so sure how anyone can precede into this discussion when its premises are so sweepingly vast as "90s were fun for everyone and now things suck."

nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 6 February 2003 19:19 (twenty-three years ago)

The boom and bust in high tech stocks is wholly unrelated to the benefits of high technology. Well, if not wholly, then almost so. Investment bubbles are always based on a fairly sound idea.

For example, the Florida land boom of the mid-1920s was based on the idea that wealthy New Yorkers and other northerners would use Florida as a vacation spot and retirement paradise, completely transforming the state's economy. That idea was totally OTM.

What happened was that this totally sound idea was planted in the minds of hundreds of thousands of investors who began to bid up prices on prime land in a short period of time. As the same pieces of land changed hands several times, each time for a more-inflated price, the speculation began to take on a life of its own. It looked like all you had to do to make a fortune overnight was to "buy some land in Florida" and sell it again a few months later. After all, thousands upon thousands of people had done so, and that proved it.

As a result, a lot of hapless suckers bought a lot of swampland for a lot of money. Some of them even hit it rich by buying and selling totally worthless land. Some of the lucky ones were utterly clueless, too. In a bubble, you don't have to have a clue to make money. Or to lose it. Easy money is so addictive that few investors will get out of a bubble market, including the 'smart' ones. But the bottom has to drop out some time.

When that happens, if the bubble was big enough, the whole economy suffers. See the Great Depression. The problem is that bubbles inspire tons of misinvestment and outright fraud. If a society spends enough of its resources on useless, unwise or unnecessary junk, then a lot of it will have to be abandoned later on. It can be almost as destructive as a war.

Aimless, Thursday, 6 February 2003 19:49 (twenty-three years ago)

Similarly, tulips aren't actually unpleasant or anything, just not worth that much trouble.

The nineties were great. I was rich, and had a lustrous head of non-graying hair.

Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Thursday, 6 February 2003 19:52 (twenty-three years ago)

Remember how we all laughed and patronised when the Albanians when they all went bankrupt after their pyramid selling fever collapsed? I suppose 'legitimate' market bubbles aren't really much different. Not that I bought dotcom stocks. Though if I had, I would have sold them at the peak of the market and be laughing at you all now, obv.

I think there's a kind of beauty in the peak of the FTSE (and Dow Jones I think) being on the 31st Dec 1999. Actually, it might have been the 30th, but still.

N. (nickdastoor), Thursday, 6 February 2003 21:31 (twenty-three years ago)

it is a matter of fact moore's law didn't went boom.
Other exponential growth trends that are still rising like a spike on a graph:

decrease in dna sequencing cost
increase in human genes mapped per year
increase in genomes sequenced per year
increase in ram
increase of magnetic data storage capacities
decrease in isp cost for higher performance
decrease in modem cost for higher performance
increase in internet backbone bandwidth
increase in fastest possible data transmission speed
increase in the growth of the internet
decrease in the price for higher performance of wireless devices
decrease in transistor size
decrease in costs of brain scan
decrease in size of computers
decrease of the size of mechanical devices
increase in parecon-like businesses (ok, this one is a fake)
increase in u.s. patents granted
increase in u.s. education expenditures
increase in human life expectancy

there is no bubble bust there.
such an abundance of richness can't but help to decrease disease and poverty around the world isn'it?

On the state of "inclusive and ethical global trade" it looks like the friggin libertarians are otm for all I know.

to end the environmental problems we don't need less technology we need smarter technology.

Right now is where it's at and looking at exponential growth trends, it is a safe bet to say that tomorrow is going to be even better. (note to self: don't make it an excuse to slack off).

the hegemon, Friday, 7 February 2003 05:55 (twenty-three years ago)


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