France threatens eastern Europe

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http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=524&u=/ap/20030217/ap_wo_en_po/eu_gen_eu_chirac_eastern_europe_1&printer=1

― James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 03:42 (twenty-two years ago)

baguette prices soar

― James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 03:47 (twenty-two years ago)

seems fair enough to me. esp. since some of the eastern european nations' support has been bribed (coughbought) by Bush. why not condition their admission to the EU in such a way? i also wouldn't be surprised if Putin puts the screws to the Baltic nations and Bulgaria (as well he should IMHO).

i can understand eastern european reluctance to be overly deferential to the French and the Germans -- esp. the Poles, who have been fucked before by both of them. that principle would apply in normal times, however, these are not normal times and Bush is no more trustworthy (maybe less so) than Chirac, Schroeder, or Putin.

― Tad (llamasfur), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 03:58 (twenty-two years ago)

let's also hope that the people in charge in Poland, Hungary, the Czech Republic, etc., are smart and cool-headed/blooded enough to play Chirac/Schroeder off against Bush/Blair and get whatever they can for themselves. which might also be why the Poles, the Hungarians, the Czechs, etc. have taken the positions that they have.

(my gut tells me that whatever those governments might be saying, the Polish/Hungarian/Czech people are probably no more enthused about war with Iraq than anyone else in Europe. esp. the Poles, given the Catholic Church's stance on Iraq. i wish i had something more solid than my gut [or my relatives in Wroclaw] to back this up, though, so i admit i could be wrong here.)

― Tad (llamasfur), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 04:19 (twenty-two years ago)

I don't nec. have anything against Schroeder because he really is doing his bit bcz of democratic principles (his entire coalition will fall apart if he takes .de to war).

Chirac however is doing this strictly to prove that France still has influence in matters of global geopolitics and should get kicked, especially for this. This is worse politics than anything we've seen Bush do. I'd almost like to see the EU and NATO fall apart at the seams because of Chirac's stupidity just because otherwise France will be back in another 10-20 years pretending that they still matter as much as a country with a working Navy. Fsck Chirac and his posturing.

(I'm going to get hammered for this hee hee)

― Millar (Millar), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 04:21 (twenty-two years ago)

This is worse politics than anything we've seen Bush do
this is exactly the same politics we've been seeing bush doing.
it's politics period . nothing new or shocking really.

― dyson (dyson), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 04:53 (twenty-two years ago)

Well, BushCo really mean it when they say Iraq needs to taste rockets and can back up their threats/promises. The arrogance of Bush's foreign policy vs. the arrogance or Chirac's current stance are removed from one another by orders of magnitude.

― Millar (Millar), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 05:04 (twenty-two years ago)

yes, obv. what i was drawing parallels between was in regards to how bushie went about drumming up support from countries like say jordan, ect.

― dyson (dyson), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 05:22 (twenty-two years ago)

The arrogance of Bush's foreign policy vs. the arrogance or Chirac's current stance are removed from one another by orders of magnitude

Hmmmmm, don't think so. The consequences of this arrogance may be removed by an order of magnitude. The arrogance is exactly equal. Bush: you're either for us or against us. Chirac: France=Europe and we'll tell you how to think. Oh and by the way, get ready to subsidize our cheese, you mindless easterners. We have 4,000 kinds, you know, because we're very sophisticated. France is a very old culture, far more history than say...Turkey. "Que? Je sais...Je sais...Trois milles ans?...ohhh, merde."

Maybe the candidate states thought they were siding with Europe, i.e. Denmark, Spain, Portugal, G.B....

The political loser will be Schroeder. Count on the French to back the U.S. at the last minute, all the while saying that this was their policy to begin with.

― JeremyZag, Tuesday, 18 February 2003 05:47 (twenty-two years ago)

they do have a carrier group in the Gulf....

― James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 06:58 (twenty-two years ago)

you remember how on that other thread i said france hated america because france was the european country most like america?

― gareth (gareth), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 07:42 (twenty-two years ago)

america has 4003 kinds of cheese

― mark s (mark s), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 10:49 (twenty-two years ago)

mmmmm sixty four slices of american cheeeese

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 10:49 (twenty-two years ago)

They don't have a carrier group in the gulf. Their single carrier, the Charles de Gaulle, is still in the Mediterranean and is headed home on the 21st.

― Stuart, Tuesday, 18 February 2003 12:49 (twenty-two years ago)

and you know how i asked you to elaborate? please do. i think i get you but i want more detail.

― Mary (Mary), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 12:49 (twenty-two years ago)

france and america share self-importance, a desire to imprint outside of borders, haughty superiority, defensive woundedness when other countries disagree, toys out of pram tantrums, nasty goings on in 3rd world countries, stern defence of own culture, heavy conservatism (though in frances case, hiding behind image of contrarianism)

― gareth (gareth), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 14:15 (twenty-two years ago)

and strangely pushy and tetchy relationship with allies

― gareth (gareth), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 14:17 (twenty-two years ago)

as nations they also have the 2 biggest defence budgets

― dyson (dyson), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 17:14 (twenty-two years ago)

we also both have stinky breath

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 18:00 (twenty-two years ago)

Stuart - are you telling me the French are dumb enough to send a carrier out on its own?

― James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 20:48 (twenty-two years ago)

I think Stuart means he does not understand what a 'carrier group' is, James

A carrier group is One (1) acft carrier accompanied by a bunch of boats that are not quite as big - missile cruisers, destroyers and such - which surround and defend the carrier.

No the French are not that dumb. And that carrier group will stay in the Med until we go to war, at which point it will act like it matters. I'll put money on it.

― Millar (Millar), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 20:59 (twenty-two years ago)

this war is certainly bringing out the worst in gareth!

― Mary (Mary), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 21:23 (twenty-two years ago)

Stuart - are you telling me the French are dumb enough to send a carrier out on its own?

No, it's surrounded by 4,000 kinds of cheese.

― JeremyZag, Tuesday, 18 February 2003 21:27 (twenty-two years ago)

It's a bleu water navy.

― lawrence kansas (lawrence kansas), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 21:31 (twenty-two years ago)

Sailing the seas of cheese!

― o. nate (onate), Tuesday, 18 February 2003 21:39 (twenty-two years ago)

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