POX: Professional Wrestlers, Dead or Alive.

Yeah okay the last two were gimmes.

Oh, where is the Sheik when you need him most??

Flair
Kawada
Great Muta/Mutoh
Rey Mysterio Jr.
Jushin "Thunder" Liger
Great Sasuke
Vader (The Ric Flair of super heavies)
Dynamite Kid
Benoit
Steamboat

just missing the cut:

Bret and Owen Hart
Misawa
Hase
Kobiashi
Hayabusa
Ultimo Dragon
Angle
Jericho
Hennig
Arn Anderson
Savage

10: "Love Machine" Art Barr
9: Yuji Nagata
8: Ricky Steamboat
7: Steve Austin (as a WCW tag wrestler and in the WWF January-October 2001)
6: Toshiaki Kawada
5: Eddy Guerrero
4: El Santo*
3: Chris Benoit
2: Ric Flair
1: Kurt Angle

*I haven't seen any of his matches, and little footage actually exists, but he's El Motherfucking Santo. If his son's any indication, he must've been a blast to watch.

Art Barr: An American who was a hugely successful heel in Mexican wrestling in the early-mid '90s, he boasted a frog splash that made the Superfly Splash look like a stumble over a curb. Tag partner of Eddy Guerrero, participant in the AAA "When Worlds Collide" hair-vs-mask match against El Hijo Del Santo and Octagon, widely regarded as one of the best lucha tag matches of all time. Would have easily been propelled to stardom by the match, but he died less than three weeks later of unknown causes at his home at age 28.

Yuji Nagata: Currently one of if not the top superstar in New Japan Pro Wrestling. Renowned for his skills in legit amateur wrestling. Kicks like a bastard and likes to salute the crowd before dropping down into his figure-four variation "Nagata Lock".

Toshiaki Kawada:
http://www.quebrada.net/multimedia/Kawada2.jpg

Kurt Angle: Where are your gold medals?

"From the Winter Gardens Skegness, Ladies and Gentlemen it's Tag Team Time grapple fans"

"In the blue corner, from Briiixtoooon Lon-don, ladies and gentlemen I-RON MAAAN, STEEEEEEEVE LO-GAN"

Anyway POX :

1. Jackie "Mr. TV" Pallo (wierd ponytailed veteran)
2. Mark "Rollerball" Rocco (psychotic mancunian with 'tache)
3. "Cyanide" Sid Cooper (bad guy with beergut - from Halifax)
4. Kendo Nagasaki (masked man of mystery from the east [of Wolverhampton])
5. Mick McManus (watch those cauliflower ears, Mick!)
6. Les Kellett(crackpot Bradford pig farmer - aged about 60)
7. Big Bad Bobby Barnes (camp quasi-glam hardman - looked like Brian Connelly)
8. Mel "Kojak" Kirk - (former Rugby League pro who weighed about 30 stone. Always lost)
9. "Bomber" Pat Roache (of Auf Wiedersein pet fame. Best move was the Brummyjum Bump!)
10. "Iron Man" Steeeeve Logan (fearsome Brixton scrap dealer with long greasy hair and warts)

Are we judging this on the best wrestler or best at entertaining or best all rounder? This is the ten I've most enjoyed watching over the years:

1) Shawn Michaels (fiercly politcal and a real bastard, but a great star - anyone remember his speech on RAW while stoned: "Unless it's one hot muther HBK aint lying down for no one". Unplanned wrestling at it's best)
2) Ric Flair (in his prime one of the best)
3) Bret 'Hitman' Hart (riveting performer, but could be dragged down by sloppy opponents unfamiliar with his style - i.e. Sid or Nash)
4) The Rock (now destined for bigger things, but still a great)
5) Steve Austin (great character, good brawler)
6) Randy Savage (in his prime - 1984 - 1992 put in some great matches, his Wrestlemania 3 against Steambout is a killer).
7) Mick Foley (for being a nutter)
8) Jake 'The Snake' Roberts (never the best athlete, but great at telling a story in-ring)
9) Taka Michinoku (don't know where it all went wrong for Taka, but always found him a great light heavy weight and more enjoyable to watch than the equally talented Mysterio and Guerrero)
10) Kurt Angle (has come on leaps and bounds as a character).

Oh yeah, wrestling wimmin - are they any good? I always liked Elizabeth the best, but thought Sunny and Rena 'Sable' Mero were hot. Never sure about their actual 'talent' though in the ring. But Trish, Jazz and Victoria seem to be doing okay.

Now back in wrestling, of course, working in a commisioner's role for the world's best current fed, FWA.

I think I like the lightweights best, with the flying style they have. I like rope-work. Of course I also like to see faces raked across chain-link fencing.

Actually, they're the only two I've ever really liked.

WHAT? Dude, he has amazing PPV matches against Shawn Michaels and wears Nigel Tufnel checkered pants! He yells "YOU SONOFABITCH!" during matches all the time (though I admit it's not as cool as his "c'mon motherfucker!" aimed at Chris Benoit during J-Cup '95)! He hangs out with Christian, who is what I'd be as a professional wrestler only even more of a dork!

1. Benoit
2. Spurt Angle
3. HHH (I don't care, grebt heel, works a crowd whether face/heel, and the Fatal 4way where Mick quit, I don't care, it was drama packed.)
4. Bret
5. RVD
6. Eddie G
7. Mysterio
8. hbk
9. Jake the Snake
10. Steve Blackman (he's one fast kat!)
nb. all that I can remember of wrestling is WWF for the past few years. Therefore, no legends.

And an addendum:
POIII Valets
1. Molly
2. Stacy Kiebler
3. Trish

1. jim "the anvil" neidhart
2. big bossman
3. akeem
4. steve austin
5. rick martel [where can i get his cologne at?]
6. the genius
7. million dollar man
8. ricky the dragon steamboat
9. ddp
10. the iron sheik

i still can't believe there's a pro wrestler named booker t....

10. Big Van Vader - most impressive huge bad guy.
9. George The Animal Steele - always top entertainment.
8. Adorable Adrian Adonis - a really great wrestler, despite any contrary impression that the fat and gay image might have given.
7. Les Kellett - Dr C, Flair would beat him easily in 30 seconds - but if Ric decided to waltz him around for five minutes first for show, Flair could find himself badly injured. A genuine maniac who scared everyone (no one wanted to train with him), but also a physical comedian of the highest order.
6. Rowdy Roddy Piper - few people have understood better how to entertain, whether in the ring or talking.
5. Road Warriors - one of the best things you can be in wrestling is awesome, and these two were absolutely the fucking awesomest.
4. Kane - as some sort of heir of the Warriors. His leaps from the turnbuckle are great moments, as is the fireworks bit.
3. Rock - about as electrifying as they say in the ring, and peerless at insulting and arguing outside it.
2. Triple H - I'm not watching now when he's getting stick, but a while ago he was one of the best wrestlers I'd ever seen, and the best dramatic actor I'd ever seen in the WWF.
1. Ric Flair - a genuinely brilliant wrestler, a master showman and still has more charisma than anyone else.

Nothing about managers here yet? Bobby 'the Brain' Heenan was truly a font of wisdom. Classy Freddie Blassie the Hollywood Fashion Plate (who called everyone a 'pencil-neck geek') was always fun. Jimmy 'The Mouth of the South' Hart always had the best outfits. Kind of dying tradition now though as one of the few that's left is Paul E. Dangerously.

I'm sure a lot of people know about the Cyndi Lauper connection here but did you know that these folks are wrestling fans too: Jad Fair (mentions them in several songs), La Monte Young, Sabir Mateen (who proudly sports a WWE t-shirt), William Parker (Matthew Shipp too I think). A lot of rappers name check wrestlers in their songs too.

Rowdy Roddy Piper is making a comeback!

Goldberg's comeback on RAW has made me love wrestling again for the first time in ages!

9. Mr Perfect. Because he had the Perfect-plex and I'm a sucker for suplex-based finishing moves. Looking so smug there, and you're in a leotard. Not to be confused with Lyotard (or Derrida) who are both Shawn's friends.

8. The Undertaker - the start of the 'special entrance' meme. He'd been billed (haha, pun) for ages for entry into that year's Survivor Series as part of Ted "The Million Dollar Man" Dibiase, Virgil, and Macho's team. When he came, we weren't left asking. Classic alone for being nothing but a shadow in the match listings right up until Survivor Series.

7. Bret "The Hitman" Hart - perennial of the Intercontinental "Proving Ground" Belt. Looks great in pink. Sharpshooter: skillz.

6. Rey Mysterio Jr. - In time with some aerial order and his own private rhythms this guy rules the air. He should be called Slider, or Striker, or Ace in real life and "Take My Breath Away" should play whenever he opens a door.

5. Brutus "The Barber" Beefcake. Really dull, boring wrestling (his finisher was the sleeper ferchrissake!!!) only made interesting and thus great by the fact that he was out for ages due to getting hacked up by a motor-boat after falling in the water. In fact, I think he came back and Michaels beat him thus entering his post-Modern phase but I'd have to consult my meta-narrative fact-checker.

4. Hulk Hogan - you can't keep a "good" man down.

3. Goldberg - 5 words: the spear + the jackhammer. Dude can't wrestle, in fact he just takes lots of punishment then spears you a coupla times, so hard you brown your breeks then he puts you in the suplex position, holds you there until it seems like you're the last person awake on the planet then drops you into an inescapable pin.

2. Razor Ramon - it is cool to have greasy permed hair, it is cool to chew a toothpick and it is cool to rack people up on your back and then throw them to the floor in the Razor's edge.

1. Smash (of Demolition) - only because he's so damned enigmatic and I can't remember a thing about him apart from intensely liking him. And the fact that he made his entrance into the WWF in the middle of a tag-team match by emerging from under the ring.

Honourable Mentions: Irwin R Schister (the IRS), the Mountie, Sgt Slaughter, Legions of Doom.

Ric Flair: Greatest worker in US history. Best heel, best face, did hour long matches just because he could, could carry anyone or anything to a passable performance (even El Gigante).

Toshiaki Kawada: Just insane. Takes absurd amounts of punishment in the ring, and stiffs the hell out of people. Plus, he knows how to do the best finisher ever (Tiger Driver '91).

Great Muta, AKA Keiji Mutoh: The Japanese Ric Flair. Admittedly had more off nights than the Ricster, but compare their matches now. Ric, if lucky, can get a 2 1/2-3 star performance off. Mutoh is still going 4-5 stars. And he still looks badass with his shaved head and goatee. Oh, and he has THE SHINING WIZARD.

Rey Mysterio Jr.: The most well known flyer in the States, his matches in WCW and ECW are beyond classic. Was considered the number one worker for eons by the IWC. Still way up there. Shame he's been buried in WWE.

Jushin "Thunder" Liger: He had a couple short stints in WCW that showcased his abilities. Mainly NJPW though. Came back from a tumor in his brain to compete again. Coolest headgear ever. Really fantastic wrestler, who like Muta, showcased the Japanese style to the world.

Great Sasuke: Best lucha style wrestler in Japanese history. His best US performance is on ECW's first PPV, Barely Legal. The 6 man Michinoku Pro match there is what started my interest in Puro.

Vader: While the moonsault's glory has been reduced in recent years, fact is no one as big as Vader has ever used it regularly in a match. Plus, he didn't get blown up like so many other giants do walking to the ring. His long list of classics in AJPW and WCW speak for themselves.

Chris Benoit and The Dynamite Kid: Effectively the same wrestler. Dynamite Kid was years ahead of his time, and carried the team he had with Davey Boy Smith. Sadly, today he's in a wheelchair. Benoit himself has been getting injured more and more recently, but continues his incredibly high work rate and excellent ring generalship.

Ricky Steamboat: He had several classic match series with Savage and Flair. Excellent wrestler, but probably the weakest in my top 10. If Angle can continue like he did the last few years, he could overtake him pretty easily. Kobiashi, Nagata, Jericho, Misawa, Ultimo Dragon (who's recently returned to action after several years off for a neck injury), and Lo-Ki (who's an absolute god and the future of wrestling) could all break in with some good years coming up. Of course, Bret Hart (stroke, fucked up kick from Goldberg), Owen Hart (killed in stunt), and Hayabusa (paralyzed during match) won't get the chance to improve on their legacies, unfortunately.

-Alan

I Love Wrestling would be great, though. You could just sit around and wait for the Lo-Ki backlash to start.

Here's my Top Ten. Biased towards the past, not the present.

10. George "the Animal" Steele: Totally ape! I loved when he tore up the turnbuckles.
9. Abdullah the Butcher: Jesus Christ, this superheavy could bleed1 He cut his forehead so many times with a razor that it looked like a cowboy's belt.
8. Lord Humungous???: I remember this hockey-masked terror as the scariest wrestler. Usually fought three if not more men. He is probably a variation on a theme in different regions of the country. Always formidable and oblivious to the pain of mere mortals. He made many children piss their pants at National Guard armories and high school gyms throughout the nation.
7. Dirty Dick Murdoch: One of the Texas Outlaws with Dusty Rhodes. A stalwart of "wrasslin, Texas-style."
6. Jerry "The King" Lawler: The Kaufman Saga immortalizes Memphis' finest. One of the great heels of all-time.
5. The Great Kabuki: The exotic powers of spitting green mist into your opponent's face makes him my token Japanese wrestler.
4. "Mr. Wonderful" Paul Orndorff: This sonuvabitch beat Van Vader's ass in the locker room in real life and he was the master of the piledriver, the most lethal finisher in the history of wrestling.
3. Hulk Hogan: Face it, the legdrop sucks and he doesn't have the greatest skills, but he is the Babe Ruth of professional wrestling.
2. The Road Warriors: Hawk and Animal. Quite simply, the most feared tag team ever representing the mean streets of bloody Chicago.
1. "The Nature Boy" Ric Flair: The umpteenth time World Champion! Greatest heel ever. Leader of the Four Horsemen. Also, in the WWF, I'll never forget when the NWO abducted him, drove him to a dark field in a limo and beat him to a pulp with baseball bats while a chopper circled the beatdown.

10. Harlem Heat - They made good heels, and frankly, were ore talented than almost the entire list here.

9. Rock & Roll Express - Straight out of the NWA and SMW, the best team of the early 80s except...

8. Midnight Express - Eternally linked, but rightfully so. Great series these two had for eons.

7. Freebirds - Again, not that entertaining to watch, but their in ring personas ruled.

6. Legion of Doom - Not much in terms of skill from Hawk and Animal, but plenty of action and brawling. Plus, they had the spike and paint before anyone else.

5. Money Inc. - I hate Rotundo, but Dibiase was a sinister, sinister heel. Great team.

4. Tully Blanchard & Arn Anderson - From the best lineup of the Horsemen, two excellent workers who had great matches.

3. The Steiners - Reinvented US Tag Wrestling. Scott brought over the hurricanrana and both could work for days. Excellent power and speed combination.

2. The Eliminators - You'll notice that both of the top two didn't last all that long. Perhaps it was in both's interests. For The Elims, they had awesome spots, good workrate, could sell, could brawl, and do just about everything but talk into a mic. Their finisher (Total Elimination) just fucking ruled everything, and the fact that no one uses it today is sad. Perry Saturn and John Kronos have never come close to attaining their lofty heights since (Saturn more due to a knee injury in ECW that's since kept him from doing 450s and handspring elbows like the old days).

1. Hollywood Blonds - Obviously. Steve Austin and Brian Pillman as super evil heels with a catch phrase, great entrance music, etc etc etc. The whole package. Period.

10. Rock N Sock (The Rock & Mankind)
9. Those two Soviet heels in the NWA
8. The Outsiders (Hall & Nash)
7. The Bushwhackers
6. The Dudley Boys
5. Texas Outlaws
4. Demolition
3. Rock N Roll Express
2. Hart Foundation
1. The Road Warriors

-
Alan

Mick Foley in all his guises
Leon Arras
The Dudley Boys
Rikishi
The Big Show
Kane
The Undertaker, as was complete with the pall bearer
Chris Benoit
Triple H (the MecMahon Hemsley era was one of the best storylines in recent years)
The Rock

10. Yuji Nagata
9. Toshiyo Yamada
8. Dick Togo
7. Super Dragon/American Dragon
6. El Satanico
5. Aja Kong
4. Nobuhiko Takada
3. Jushin Liger
2. Kenta Kobashi
1. El Hijo del Santo

I am tired so mayhaps I shall return to justify later.

FUCK!

1. Chavo Guerrero
2. Eddie "The Continental Lover" Mansfield
3. Andre the Giant
4. Greg Valentine
5. The Sheik
6. Dick the Bruiser
7. Mil Mascaras
8. Roddy Piper
9. Bull Ramos
10. Blue Demon, according to reports: didn't see him, but a bunch of guys I used to work with when I was a nurse on a Spanish-language chronic psych ward thought Blue Demon was the shiz-nit.

The working title for my next record was "Chavo Guerrero Is Champion of the World," and in my heart it's still called that, but we couldn't get ahold of C.G. to secure permission, and lawsuits suck ass. Damn.

Was Andre ever actually a good worker? I know its stupid for me to complain about inability to work when I put Hellwig in my list, but...I dunno. It'd be like putting Sid Eudy in a list.

(Side note: what should have happened in that battle royal is obviously the Bret Hart/Bad News Brown double-cross/trophy smashing.)

When I was writing that album I mentioned I got my hands on some old Olympic Auditorium wrestling videotapes - terrible quality, of course, but I was reminded of one of Piper's best stunts - he'd lost a loser-leaves-town match, and then suddenly there's a new heel on the scene, a masked man who doesn't speak except to say 'Si, Maestro" whenever he appears with his manager, Black Gordman. Chavo's interview regarding the Canadian: "Piper, cut it out with this Canadian stuff, everybody knows it's you!" Totally great. Except that when the Canadian gets unmasked, they brought in somebody else to wear the mask, so that the unmasking was like one of those movie-endings where they throw in a twist that you know can't work, because the narrative was moving too certainly in ONE direction only.

Damn, that John Grieshop is a bad piece of ass, bad work Mrs Grieshop.

I know the target was the head, but I still think it's pushing it to call that 'psychological'.

Martin that gave me the best giggle I've had all day, God bless you

Does everyone here know that The Mouth of the South Jimmy Hart was the singer in the Gentrys (I Keep on Dancin')?