U.S. Troops Pulling out of Saudi Arabia

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I was a little surprised to see that this is happening. What is the significance of it? The U.S. troops based in Saudi Arabia were one of the specific complaints Bin Laden made about the U.S. Is this move partly intended to reduce the likelihood of terrorist attack against the United States? Is it simply becoming impossible to safely keep troops in Saudi Arabia? Does the U.S. not need Saudi Arabia, militarily, now that we have Iraq (where we have decided we will be having military bases--so what happens if an Iraqi democracy decides it doesn't want a U.S. military presence?)? Is this preparation for "regime change" in Saudi Arabia, or at least preparation to allow the U.S. threaten such "regime change"? (Will Franklin Graham be made the Sherrif of Mecca?)

Rockist Scientist, Wednesday, 30 April 2003 15:01 (twenty-three years ago)

maybe there were only US troops in SA to contain/threaten Iraq. With Saddam Hussein gone Bushco might feel there is no further need to station troops there.

DV (dirtyvicar), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 15:03 (twenty-three years ago)

the reason has a little something to do with Qatar ratifying a constitution, methinks.

hstencil, Wednesday, 30 April 2003 15:03 (twenty-three years ago)

I'm not too surprised but I was intrigued at how quickly it came, and I have many of the same questions as you, Rockist. 'Regime change' in Saudi Arabia is always going to be dicey as hell, I think -- the trump card of the current regime is perfectly, totally simple: "Okay, we're retreating to Mecca and Medina. Try and bomb us here, motherfuckers."

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 15:04 (twenty-three years ago)

Surprised this hasn't been talked about much, esp. as that's where CentCom is headquartered for the war:

Qataris Approve First Real Constitution
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

Filed at 9:20 p.m. ET

DOHA, Qatar (AP) -- Qatari voters approved their first real constitution Tuesday -- a leap toward democratic rule in a country where the emir has held absolute power since independence from Britain in 1971.

The constitution was approved in a referendum by 96.6 percent of the voters -- 68,987 to 2,145, with 274 invalid votes, Qatar's Interior Minister, Prince Hamad bin Nasser Al Thani, announced at a news conference four hours after the polls had closed.

Crowds of Qatari men celebrated in the streets, honking cars draped in the Qatari flag and photos of the emir and the crown prince.

The draft will become Qatar's first real constitution, replacing a 1972 ``Provisional Political Order'' that outlined only limited government structures and did not lay out voting or other rights.

The constitution envisages a 45-member parliament, of which 30 will be elected in polls where women may stand and vote. The remaining 15 -- as well as the Cabinet -- will be appointed by the emir.

However, legislators will have the right to question Cabinet ministers, enact legislation and vote on the national budget.

Government officials said before the vote that parliamentary elections would be held in 2004.

Government officials were unable to provide a total for the number of eligible voters. Out of Qatar's 800,000 inhabitants, only about 25 percent are citizens.

But the polls appeared busy throughout the day.

Men wearing white robes and headdresses and women in black chadors that exposed only the eyes and hands entered schools and government buildings through separate entrances to cast ballots.

At an elementary school on the outskirts of Doha, the capital of the tiny state, Ali al-Khater, a businessman, said he had read the draft constitution several times and had voted ``yes.''

``Every person hopes for a better future and this constitution is going to help us realize this future,'' al-Khater said.

One last-minute voter, Umm el-Jassim, said she had been busy all day but ``wouldn't have missed it for anything.''

The emir, Sheik Hamad bin Khalifa Al Thani, Crown Prince Jassem bin Hamad Al Thani and Prime Minister Abdullah bin Khalifa Al Thani voted at a polling station erected in the emir's palace.

Qataris first voted in 1999 municipal elections. The advisory Central Municipal Council was re-elected earlier this month.

Women have been able to vote and run in the elections -- a rarity in the conservative Gulf Arab states.

At Qatar University's polling stations, turnout on the female campus was reportedly twice that on the male campus.

hstencil, Wednesday, 30 April 2003 15:09 (twenty-three years ago)

The real question is how this will affect the relatively high quality CD reissues of Oum Kalthoum material that have been coming out of Saudi Arabia over the past several years. And should I buy any Mohammed Abdo CDs I want now, just in case they aren't available in the near future?

hstencil, I'm embarrassed to say that I am only very vaguely aware of this story.

Rockist Scientist, Wednesday, 30 April 2003 15:13 (twenty-three years ago)

well Rockist, that's because it's hardly been reported. I think it's extremely significant, tho. Why does Rummy bitch about Al Jazeera? Because it's the closest thing in the Middle East to a goverment-free television station. Where is Al Jazeera based? Qatar.

hstencil, Wednesday, 30 April 2003 15:29 (twenty-three years ago)

What the Beeb has to say about this:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/2984547.stm

Mooro (Mooro), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 15:36 (twenty-three years ago)

YESSS - the troops were there as an afteraffect of Gulf War I (corrollary in South Korea - this is why you don't fight wars to a stalemate, and thankfully at least THAT's one policy that's died), at the behest of the Saudi govt. as buffer against Iraq, which routinely made threats of invading through the years (empty threats surely, obv. in retrospect, but still enough to provide the excuse) and I'd assume as support personnel for the no-fly zones, I'm pretty sure it was mainly Air Force and Army personnel stationed there, the only Navy base I can think of in the area is at Bahrain (Millar would know more than me). Even before Khobar Towers (and God I can remember that day) alot of people thought it was a bad idea to have a semi-permanent force based there, I can just about guarantee you some issue of Foreign Affairs from the midnineties has something on this, but if you give your opponent time and an opportunity he will take it, and Hussein did, hence the weapons-inspection dance, which hurt Hussein none but did damage the US by maintaining sanctions (which hurt the Iraqi people more yes yes but brought criticism upon the US and fostered an image of the US 'starving' the Iraqis, nevermind the reality of how those sanctions were supposed to work) and keeping troops stationed in Saudi Arabia, both of which raised resentments against the US (in addition to the routine 'send a message' bombings Clinton undertook, and I still find it odd that almost noone ever notes Clinton dropped more bombs on Iraq than either Bush). One of the primary arguments made for this war (albeit not by the administration) was 'we can't keep troops stationed in SA' -> 'we have to keep troops stationed in SA while Hussein is still in power' -> 'we have to remove Hussein from power'. That said it's a small miracle that this is actually happening - there is no greater force in govt. than inertia.

James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 18:36 (twenty-three years ago)

Other notable event going well under radar: the wall across Cyprus has fallen!

nabisco (nabisco), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 19:09 (twenty-three years ago)

That happened last week. Didn't go unnoticed here.

Ed (dali), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 19:10 (twenty-three years ago)

Read reports on that as well. There is always some sort of hope...

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 19:12 (twenty-three years ago)

how much press has the Castro crackdown gotten in Europe?

James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 19:12 (twenty-three years ago)

Its definitely on Radio 4 and in the guardian. Didn't get nearly as much as cyprus.

Ed (dali), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 19:13 (twenty-three years ago)

The US moved troop out of Saudi Arabia because it can station them in Iraq now.

fletrejet, Wednesday, 30 April 2003 19:14 (twenty-three years ago)

saltwater tastes salty

James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 19:17 (twenty-three years ago)

Rumsfeld says we just don't need em any more: "It is now a safer region because of the change of regime in Iraq," Mr. Rumsfeld said. "The aircraft and those involved will now be able to leave."

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 19:20 (twenty-three years ago)

twenty years pass...

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/aug/30/germany-and-us-trained-saudi-forces-accused-of-killing-yemen-migrants

Saudi Arabia really leaning into the future of border politics, with US and German help

Tracer Hand, Thursday, 31 August 2023 07:50 (two years ago)

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/26/world/middleeast/saudi-killing-migrants-yemen.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare

“US Knew Saudis were killing African Migrants “ is NY Times headline

curmudgeon, Friday, 1 September 2023 18:35 (two years ago)

sitting on top of vast reserves of oil is a hell of a drug

more difficult than I look (Aimless), Friday, 1 September 2023 18:40 (two years ago)

Sadly The NY Times article doesn’t address all that the Guardian article does:

The Guardian has established that the US military’s training of Saudi forces, including border forces, has been part of a long running military support programme known as MOI-MAG (Ministry of Interior-Military Assistance Group) with US involvement in training border forces beginning in 2008

curmudgeon, Friday, 1 September 2023 18:40 (two years ago)

The Ethiopian migrants are trying to get to Saudi Arabia to work and survive off of that trickled down oil money .

curmudgeon, Friday, 1 September 2023 18:45 (two years ago)


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