strangest pub names

and all firkin pubs....does anyone know whether the pub with the longest name, the Ferret & Firkin in the Balloon Up the Creek, actaully form(s/ed) part of the infernal chain, or predated it?

I like The Red Lion. Lions aren't red, so that's pretty silly.

But as I mentioned elsewhere there's a pub in Wimbledon called the Emma Hamilton. Now there's a strange name if ever I heard one.

We made Tom go to the Old Tom pub but he claimed to feel no frisson. Humph.

Pub game easily spoiled by tossy Nu-Pub fever of 80s (The Speculator in Essex Road). In Mardol in Shrewsbury there used to be a pub called The Mardol which totally means nothing, far as I know, The sign had a big red devil throwing rocks.

I know that some towns made City by Royal Charter then scrabble around trying to find a church to call a cathedral (which they now have the right to have inside the City boundaries). One church I know of rejected the proposed upgrade, being quite happy as they were, thank-you. This story may be apocryphal, of course.

Named after Lord Nelson's...companion, who had a country seat in nearby Merton.

I remember the horse Dr Syntax, for some unfathomable reason. There is actually at least one "old city" without a cathedral: Cambridge. However the "cathedral factor" explains why towns as small as Truro, Ely, Wells, St Mary's in Pembrokeshire (though wasn't that only made a city very recently?) are officially cities. Presumably Wimborne would be a city if the Minster was a cathedral, which is a bizarre thought.

You mean St. David's. I think its city status is very old.

Once out drinking in Marylebone Kate suggested we go to a pub called the Angel up the other Angel.

What?!?!? What?!??! I'm confused? What Emma are you? I went looking for a pub named Angel in Angel with *my* drinking buddy named Emma, but that's not the Emma that is you. Why is it every female in the UK is named Emma or Kate? It is too confusing. Numbers to be handed out shortly.

David. I do know that Emma Hamilton was Lord Nelson's mistress. Do you think I could get to 26 years old without being told this by every person I come into contact with? Especial amusement among chums who have seen a certain episode of Blackadder. It is very crap having a name that is not proper famous but just mildly historically scandalous famous.

And no I do not go for blokes with one eye.

Sorry..I didn't notice your surname.

Was very tired when I wrote "St Mary's". I'm sure I remember reading a few years ago that St David's had only just been made a city. Probably misunderstood entirely though: anyway, it's definitely the smallest city in Britain.

Of course, Kate, virtually all cities to have been elevated as such recently had large / increasing populations. I wonder what is the largest town *not* to be a city? I have a terrible feeling that Reading might be very high up there.

It's better than being called, say, Mr Death or Mr Cockfarmer.

And another called The Hairy Lemon.

There used to be one called The Auld Chinaman.

There is almost certainly a pub somewhere in Ireland called The Napper Tandy.

I do not care if it is about a racehorse I prefer the SYNTAX ERROR (NB I just did one of those but you lot may call it a corrected typo) explanationg.

BUT I DO NOT KEEP CUPS IN IT!!!!

I had an odd moment where I thought I was on the bra thread.

As you will tell from this I'm a fan of Dr Syntax books. Thanks for giving me locations of Dr Syntax pubs, please let me know of any others.

Doctor Syntax was the fictitious schoolmaster hero of three very popular books between 1812 and 1821.

The famous caricaturist and water-colour painter Thomas Rowlandson painted one or two pictures each month showing the Doctor in various humorous scrapes (falling into water, disputing his bill with an inn keeper, meeting prospective wives etc) then William Combe wrote a continuous story in verse along the theme of the pictures. Combes did not know the subject of pictures until he received them. The Doctor's adventures were first serialised in a monthly magazine then "by popular demand" in book form as > The Tour of Doctor Syntax, in Search of the Picturesque. The Tour of Doctor Syntax in Search of Consolation. The Tour of Doctor Syntax in Search of a Wife.

They were the smash hit of their day and were the subject of much illegal copying, jumping on the band wagon and what we now call "merchandising" with Dr Syntax crockery, wigs, clothes etc, much the same way as everything is Harry Potter today. If your pub displays a sign of a man with protruding chin, a wig and black clothes this will be the famous schoolmaster. See pictures at http://www.philaprintshop.com/syntax.html and http://antiqueprints.com

If the pub sign is a horse then it is the famous racehorse born in 1811 and named after the schoolmaster. - Dr. Syntax (GB) (1811) Family 37. Described as a horse of great character, he stood around 15 hands. Said to be mouse colored, he had a large, bright eye and flaring nostrils, and was thought to be light in the quarters. He won twenty Gold Cups over a ten year period. Because of his small size and uncertain temper he was not popular in the stud. [source http://www.bloodlines.net/TB/Studbook/EarlyD.htm ] - See John F. Herring Senior's painting at http://www.encore- editions.com/horses/horsesjfherringsr.htm . Dr Syntax had a sister Miss Syntax born 1814.

One of the Dr Syntax pubs mentioned is at 241 Fylde Rd, Preston. This probably records Dr Syntax's successes at the nearby old (1760 - 1848) Preston racecourse.

Extracts from http://www.geraldsegasby.co.uk/Preston.htm website about the Preston racecourse and may explain the prevalence of "Syntax racehorse" pubs in the north >

1814: This was the first year Mr Riddell had run horses at Preston. On Tuesday, 5th July, he won the opening event (a Maiden Plate or £70) with Doctor Syntax, who was next year to begin a series of Preston Gold Cup successes which constitute a Turf record. On one occasion when I was judging at Hexham Races I stayed at Swinburne Castle with the late Mr Cuthbert Riddell, who, for my benefit, had a display of the Preston Gold Cups won by Doctor Syntax. The dinner table glistened with trophies and transported us to the brave days of the past.

Thos. Riddell, of Swinburne Castle, Northumberland, in 1760 married Elizabeth Margaret, only daughter and heiress of Edward Horsley Widdrington, of Felton, thus bringing the Felton and Long Horsley estates into the Riddell family. Thomas, eldest son of the above marriage, married into another old north country Catholic and Turf loving family - Margaret Salvin (later to make racing history with The Cure). Ralph Riddell (brother of Thomas) succeeded to the Felton Park property in 1798, and became prominent on the Turf as owner of Doctor Syntax, X.Y.Z., and other horses, and as a bloodstock breeder of a quarter of a century. His horses were trained at Felton up to a point and then sent to Middleham. I have been loaned his diaries and account books, from which I have made extracts germane to Preston Races and to Doctor Syntax.

1813: 12 July. Paid Mr Knapton for a brown two-year- old colt by Paynator 125gns. (this was the famous Doctor Syntax).

1814: 13th April. Ran Doctor Syntax, colt by Paynator, for first time at Catterick. He fell. He ran second on 18th April at Middleham. Won Maiden Plate at Preston.

1815-16-17-18-19-20-21: Won the Gold Cup at Preston with Doctor Syntax, also Gold Cup at Lancaster, 1815-16; second, 1817; won, 1818-19-230, second, 1822-23. Gold Cup at Richmond, 1818- 20-21-22-23. This, of course, beat the performance of Brown Jack, whose six successive wins in the Queen Alexandra Stakes is spoken of as a record. Moreover, Doctor Syntax still lives in some of our most notable bloodstock pedigrees today through Bee's Wing and her son, Newminster, whose male line has had considerable success in begetting 'chasers.

Doctor Syntax was bred by Humphrey Osbaldeston at Hunmanby, East Yorkshire, and foaled in 1811. He was sold to William Knapton, who had a stud at Huntingdon, near York, and was landlord of the Star Inn. Stonegate,York, which he ultimately bought for £820 in 1803, but failing to complete purchase, the inn reverted to the owners. Knapton remained at the Star until 1822. In 1809 he organised horse and ass races at Huntingdon in connection with the village feast in June. The Yorkshire Herald reports that Mr and Mrs Knapton acted as hosts to all comers to tea, supper and a dance, and added: "During the day a number of Mr Knapton's friends went to see his breeding stock,and were highly gratified by a view of those by the late Delpini. The stock by his present stallions, Paynator and Evander, are of great promise." Paynator, of course, was sire of Doctor Syntax, foaled in 1791, bred and raced by Lord Clemont. Just at the time "The Doctor" was foaled, William Coombe published "The Schoolmaster's Tour" in Ackermans's Poetical Magazine. It made such a hit that, in 1812, the long and tedious poem was re-issued in book form as The Tour of Doctor Syntax in Search of the Picturesque. It is a book I have not taken from my library shelves for years, and probably will never read again; undoubtedly, this same book gave the name of Mr R Riddell's famous racehorse. Doctor Syntax was out of an unnamed mare by Beningbrough, out of Jenny Mole, by Carbuncle, training to a Yorkshire mare (sister to Old Merlin's dam, foaled about 1685).

"The Druid" tells us that he was so small at two years old that his owner decided to have him cut and used as a hack for his son. The colt was actually cast for operation by Mr Crowther, a veterinary surgeon, but the day coming on very hot it was decided to postpone matters.

John Lonsdale, who trained at Tupgill, Middleham, persuaded Mr Riddell to leave the colt entire and allow Lonsdale to take him to Tupgill to be trained. He never exceeded 15 hands in height; in fact "The Druid" states that in training he was barely 15 hands.

At that period racehorses took their ages from the first of May. That is to say, though a horse in 1811 might be foaled in January, February, March or April, he did not officially become a yearling till 1st May, 1812, a two-year-old on 1st May 1813, a three- year-old on1st May 1814, and so on. Thus, when Doctor Syntax ran his first race (and fell) at Catterick, 13th April, 1814, he was officially a two-year-old, as also when he finished second at Middleham on 18th April, and third at Durham on 26th April. When he won his first race, a maiden plate at Preston, on 5th July, the same year, 1814, he was officially a three-year-old.

Doctor Syntax won five races at Preston, Morpeth and Richmond (Yorks) at three years of age; and his Cup sequence commenced when he was four years old in 1815. The Cup distance at Preston and Lancaster was three miles, and at Ricmond four miles. From three to twelve years of age Doctor Syntax ran in 49 races and won 36. In addition to his long winning sequence at Preston he finished second for the Preston Gold Cup in 1822.

Doctor Syntax had a full sister, Miss Syntax, foaled in 1814. The Doctor was the first foal of is dam, and his sister was the third, the mare having been barren in 1813. Miss Syntax was sold to the Marquis of Queensberry by her breeder, Mr Osbaldeston, who had bought her dam from Mr Riddell. She won the Gold Cup at Dumfries (twice), walked over for the Gold Cup at Kendal (on the New Course in 1821) and won several other races at York, Newcastle, Ayr and Edinburgh.

Put to Tramp, Miss Syntax bred The Little Red Rover in 1827. He finished second to Priam in the Derby and ran up to seven years of age and won 17 races.

Through Little Red Rover, Miss Syntax enters into many pedigrees. The Golden Horn (dam of Reverberation and G.G. dam of Volodyovski), Buccaneer and Lady Audley. (dam of Touchet) were out of a daughter of Little Red Rover. Buccaneer was the sire of See Saw - sire of Loved One - sire of Sunstar's dam.

Reverberation sired Concussion, the dam of Sirenia, Hammerkop, Ishallah and Llangibby. Touchet was the sire of Juggler and Necromancer.

Hence we see that over and beyond the immense influence Doctor Syntax has had on the Brititsh Thoro-oughbred through Bee's Wing and her son, Newminster, and daughter Honeysuckle and Honeydew, the sister of Doctor Syntax, Miss Syntax, has been instrumental in transmitting a measure of the sterling old Yorkshire racing blood which brought many of the south country sportsmen to ruin when Sir Matthew Pierson sent Old Merlin to Newmarket and ran him in a match against a horse belonging to Tregonwell Frampton (see Vl. I)

I gues.s I was mislead by the subject!

Ho hum you sad nerds!

The Tumbledown Dick
The Ham and Blackbird

nb my boss always got the name wrong and called it the
HAM & BLACKCURRENT which is more surreal.