Son of Saddam!

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have we got 'em???

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 18:35 (twenty-two years ago)

http://i.cnn.net/cnn/2003/WORLD/meast/07/22/uday.profile.ap/uday.file.december.2000.jpg

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 18:37 (twenty-two years ago)

he's dead

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 18:38 (twenty-two years ago)

The bodies were pretty messed up when they found them. They claim a senior Baathist has identified them as Saddam's sons. They will do DNA tests that will take a week.

Could be, but then again they claimed to have killed Saddam three times.

fletrejet, Tuesday, 22 July 2003 18:39 (twenty-two years ago)

Could be, but then again they claimed to have killed Saddam three times.
and they have, but he's got the physiology of Jason!

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 18:41 (twenty-two years ago)

Astounding!

Like Fletrejet, I'm not holding my breath. And let's face it, heavily trashed bodies + US claims != any sort of proof or guarantee in a lot of eyes.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 18:44 (twenty-two years ago)

Unfortunately, Saddam seems to have the consistency of frigging Teflon. I wouldn't be surprised if his sons do, as well. Too much money + land to hide = survival, apparently.

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 18:53 (twenty-two years ago)

Oh come on, a high profile success like this, right when Blair is really under hot hot heat like an indie groupie, how could it be anything but genuine???

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 18:56 (twenty-two years ago)

they'll probably find Jimmy Hoffa in there too.

Chris V. (Chris V), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 18:57 (twenty-two years ago)

and maybe my copy of Amazing Spider-Man #234

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 18:57 (twenty-two years ago)

and the quarter bag I lost in the sofa in '98.

teeny (teeny), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 19:02 (twenty-two years ago)

and my first copy of "OK Computer".

Charles McCain (Charles McCain), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 19:03 (twenty-two years ago)

I don't understand - if we had good enough intelligence about who was in the building and the number of people they were up against, why would we destroy the whole structure in such a way as to render the bodies unrecognizable? It seems they could easily have sent in a team to secure the building and taken prisoners or killed the occupants in a cleaner fashion. I'm very suspicious of this, but I also think that the people in charge would be smarter than to risk another blundering deception now that so many others have blown up in their faces.

We never claimed to have actually killed Saddam. As I recall there has never been an announcement that he was dead. Just a lot of 'we think he might have been in there' type stuff.

Millar (Millar), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 19:08 (twenty-two years ago)

I think there were Rumsfeldian utterances like "with a reasonable degree of certainty..." or "we don't know that we don't know...."

amateurist (amateurist), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 19:10 (twenty-two years ago)

slow news day...

stevem (blueski), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 19:14 (twenty-two years ago)

They are "80% sure"

Millar is right, his sons would have worth a million times as much alive, but judging from the pictures I saw, they used some heavy ordinace against.... four people?

fletrejet, Tuesday, 22 July 2003 19:14 (twenty-two years ago)

I also think that the people in charge would be smarter than to risk another blundering deception now that so many others have blown up in their faces.

I'd be tempted to agree, but since this IS the US government we're talking about, they could be thinking, "In for a penny...".

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 19:15 (twenty-two years ago)

"have blown up in their faces" is a good choice of words in this case.

Mark C (Mark C), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 20:08 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.centcom.mil/CENTCOMNews/news_release.asp?NewsRelease=20030768.txt

Pashmina (Pashmina), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 20:47 (twenty-two years ago)

hot damn

Millar (Millar), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 20:55 (twenty-two years ago)

Oh my. That's two, out of....how many more?

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 21:01 (twenty-two years ago)

That's it, I think.

The news outlets are reporting this as a confirmed fact, for what that's worth.

amateurist (amateurist), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 21:02 (twenty-two years ago)

In fairness, it couldn't happen to two more deserving guys.

Now, does anyone have any information on the gunfire and explosions all over Baghdad tonight? Sky News had nothing much except footage from a hotel window of the city lit up by occasional flares and tracer rounds. The reporter: "well, we really don't know what the hell is going on".

Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 21:10 (twenty-two years ago)

The reporter: "well, we really don't know what the hell is going on".

Spoken like a seasoned professional.

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 21:12 (twenty-two years ago)

which one's butch and which one's sundance?

James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 21:22 (twenty-two years ago)

Can't read it, Blount. Summarise?

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 21:23 (twenty-two years ago)

U.S. Commander Confirms Search for 2 Top Targets Is Over
By NEIL MacFARQUHAR


BAGHDAD, Iraq, July 22 — The two sons of Saddam Hussein targeted by allied forces, Uday and Qusay, were killed today in an extended firefight with American troops in the northern Iraqi city of Mosul, the United States military said.

Lt. Gen. Ricardo S. Sanchez, commander of allied ground forces in Iraq, announced the deaths hours after a six-hour confrontation in which American soldiers destroyed a house that the two sons were seen running into.

"We're certain that Uday and Qusay were killed today," General Sanchez said, adding "We used multiple sources to identify the individuals."

The two men were seen exiting a car and racing into a house in the eastern part of the city around 9 a.m. and were videotaped, Kurdish officials said. They said the tape was quickly handed over to the American military, who identified the men and surrounded the house with troops from the 101st Airborne.

The people inside responded by opening fire on the troops. United States forces retaliated, and the boom of high-powered weaponry shattered the calm of the area for hours, said the Kurdish officials, including one eyewitness. The house was completely shattered by the assault, which included attacks by at least one helicopter gunship. Four bodies were found inside.

"They died in a fierce gun battle," General Sanchez said of Mr. Hussein's sons. "They resisted the detention and the efforts of the coalition force to go in and apprehend them. And they were killed in the ensuing gun fight."

The bodies of the two sons, General Sanchez said, "are in a condition where you could identify them." He said the bodies had been transported to Dubai.

The American military said it was working on confirming the identity of the other two people killed. According to Kurdish officials, one is believed to be Mustapha, a teen-age son of Qusay, and the other a bodyguard who always travels with Uday.

The deaths represent the elimination of the two most sought-after members of the regime after Saddam Hussein himself. Qusay and Uday were No. 2 and No. 3 — right behind their father — on the American military's most-wanted list of 55 members of Mr. Hussein's regime.

Before today, American forces had announced the capture of 34 Iraqis on the most-wanted list. Mr. Hussein still remains at large and American officials say he may be hiding out in Iraq.

The United States government had offered a $15 million reward for each son, both of whom were key lieutenants for the deposed president. Asked whether those rewards will be paid out, General Sanchez said: "We're pursuing that at this point in time. I would expect that it probably will happen."

Qusay, 37, the younger, calmer brother, was in charge of his father's security detail, the Special Republican Guards. Uday, 39, a infamous playboy feared for his sadistic bent, organized the Fedayeen Saddam using pardoned criminals who would be given a new lease on life if they would kill for the regime.

The death of the two sons, analysts believe, would be the biggest development in ending Baath Party rule since Baghdad fell on April 9. Some say they believe it might diminish but not eliminate attacks that have killed around 40 United States soldiers since President Bush declared the end of major combat on May 1.

General Sanchez said he believed the deaths of the two sons would have a beneficial impact for American forces.

"This will prove to the Iraqi people that at least these two members of the regime will not be coming back into power," the general said, "which is what we stated over and over again. And we remain totally committed to the Hussein regime never returning to power and tormenting the Iraqi people."

Even before the identity of the bodies was confirmed, celebratory gunfire erupted across Baghdad tonight as Iraqis celebrated the news, the night sky illuminated with tracer fire.

"I don't think it is possible, but if it is true, they deserved whatever happened to them," said Omar Salam, 22, eating his dinner at a roadside cafe with gunfire erupting all around him.

Most Iraqis will breath a sigh of relief that Mr. Hussein's two most likely successors have been eliminated. It leaves Mr. Hussein as the main target of the continuing manhunt.

In Mosul, a retired army general, Ali Jajawi, who lives 100 meters from the house, said that this morning people saw the house's owner, Nawaf Al-Zaydan, and his son Shahlan in American vehicles. It was difficult for people to get close to them, but some managed to ask some questions.

People asked him what had happened and Nawaftold them that Uday and Qusay were inside the house. He had gone to bring breakfast for them, he said, and the Americans arrested him.

Neighbors found it strange because he was smoking in the car and appeared totally calm, leading many to believe that he had turned the men in, said Farhan Sharafani, a member of the Kurdish parliament.

Both Nawaf and his brother Salah Al-Zaydan, had been prosecuted by the regime under a law promulgated several years ago making it illegal to claim kinship with the president's family. They both claimed they were part of the Albu Nasser tribe and were jailed for it, said Ghazi Ajil Al-Yawar, a member of Iraq's Governing Council from Mosul.

Mosul is located about 240 miles northwest of Baghdad, outside the so-called "Sunni Triangle" in central Iraq — home to much of the remaining support for Mr. Hussein, a Sunni Muslim who used his Baathist Party to oppress the country's Shiite majority.

In other violence today in Iraq, an American soldier was killed and another injured in an ambush along a road north of Baghdad.

The death brought to 149 the number of American soldiers killed in action since the war began on March 20, according to the United States Central Command at MacDill Air Force Base in Florida. Eighty-one American soldiers have died in non-combat accidents since the start of the war, the military said.

James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 21:35 (twenty-two years ago)

[Merci, James.]

Apparently, we've just witnessed the Iraqi version of High Noon.

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 21:38 (twenty-two years ago)

punks get beat down

James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 21:39 (twenty-two years ago)

espn's on the case

James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 21:45 (twenty-two years ago)

And just when you didn't think murder and torture could win the Gold...

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Tuesday, 22 July 2003 21:47 (twenty-two years ago)

Hmph. From the BBC report:

Qusay, 36, had become Saddam Hussein's heir apparent and controlled key areas of the country's security apparatus, with responsibility for concealing any weapons of mass destruction

So convenient. "Well, the guy who would have told us everything is dead, uh, yeah! Moving on."

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 23 July 2003 01:23 (twenty-two years ago)

Meanwhile, a larger picture to consider.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 23 July 2003 01:30 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm remaining skeptical as hell on this one.

Colin Meeder (Mert), Wednesday, 23 July 2003 02:51 (twenty-two years ago)

When are they gonna bag Osama what's-his-face?

hstencil, Wednesday, 23 July 2003 05:13 (twenty-two years ago)

First week of November, 2004

oops (Oops), Wednesday, 23 July 2003 05:48 (twenty-two years ago)

ha, I was thinking it'd be around the time of the GOP convention in NYC next year (i.e. near the 9/11 anniversary).

hstencil, Wednesday, 23 July 2003 06:05 (twenty-two years ago)

Hilarity, from a BBC report:

"We are going to make sure the Iraqi people believe this at the end of the day, and there are a lot of ways to do that," Paul Wolfowitz, the US deputy defence secretary, told reporters in Washington.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 23 July 2003 19:39 (twenty-two years ago)


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