Political Comedy: Search And Destroy

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Specifically, oppositional comedy. Elton in the 80s - now Mark Thomas, Jeremy Hardy, John O'Farrell maybe, and so on. I'm sure the US has its equivalents. Do politics and comedy mix? Does it get a message out? Does it achieve anything? Is it just the leftist equivalent of crowd-playing cheap-joke operators like Richard Littlejohn?

― Tom, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Mark Thomas is an interesting example because while I admire most of the things he stands for and what he's actually got done I find the shows themselves unwatchable - utterly unfunny and mostly consisting of bullying various secretaries and lackeys because he can't get anywhere near the decision-makers. I think a lot of confrontation- comedy draws its appeal from the dislike alternative types have of 'office workers' (see IL* threads passim).

Generally I have to say that political comedy is dud, whereas political satire is often classic.

― Tom, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

You're totally right about Mark Thomas, old boy.

― DG, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Mind you you can't fault him for honesty, changing his show from "The Mark Thomas Comedy Product" to "The Mark Thomas Product".

― Tom, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Well, he couldn't really have gone on flying the comedy flag when the show was so OBVIOUSLY unfunny.

― DG, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Mark Thomas varies between really impressive blows for the common folk - witness forcing that old aristo to cough up his inheritance tax - and abusing his editorial power to big up his quests - such as turning PFI for hospitals, which has complex and ambiguous costs and benefits, into a crusade against selling out the public sector. And then brings an unquestioning audience on side with humour. I can find him quite funny, actually, but his piousness irritates me.

― Magnus, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

satire is superior to overt political comedy in most ways. search private eye, spitting image, week ending, yes (prime) minister, gerald scarfe, steve bell, martin rowson, james gilray, hogarth

― Ed, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

one thing i rather admire abt MT = he is an obsessive nerd re the factual detail (ie like clinton he masters his brief)

I can't watch out of extreme squirming embarrassment, partly because yes it's mainly lackeys getting it in the neck, but I can't do ali g vs muhammed fayed either, so surely this is my squeamishness

― mark s, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

With you on that. Elton, Thomas et al can't touch Yes Minister for tearing strips off the government machine.

― Magnus, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Yes Minister = thatcherite propaganda against possibility of idea of public service (much less gentle and undertstanding than MT here, i'd say)

― mark s, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Misses the point of comedy completely. You're supposed to laugh at other people's misfortunes, not use them to make a point. Although John O'Farrell is funny sometimes.

― dave q, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

The problem is that satire is merely heightening, or illustrating the point. Yes Minister was great satire because it illustrated that MP's were thick, the civil servents did everything and therefore very little changed. Problem is that whilst this maybe a borderline thruth, it is not THE whole truth of the matter - and its unclear whether Yes Minister's existence actually did anything to rectify the situation. Indeed in a lot of ways it just bred more distrust. Satire is funny, but is it that useful?

Mark Thomas, Michael Moore and their ilk are actually trying to do something which of course should be applauded. They are also trying to raise awareness in a direct way which involves facts. I disagree with Magnus above about Mark Thomas's treatment of PFI on the programme. Perhaps it is one sided but it is an equally factual based one sidedness to counter happily with the one-sided presentation the government give us. Just because Thomas and Hardy (and to a lesser extent Moore) have come to campaigning journalism via the route of comedy does not make their points any less valid, it just makes the presentation a touch different.

I used to think the above about Thomas but after a few episodes of the last couple of series I think I have done a volte face. No, it is no longer comedy, but it is interesting and educational. Stand Up Politics, its the new rock'n'roll. (Or the old Red Wedge - the colour which is oddly bypassed as wedge coulours in Trivial Pursuit).

― Pete, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I'm not sure you are disagreeing with me very much, Pete. PFI really needs more examination than its been given, but his approach was too crude, more so than one-sided, really. Still, if it made folk think... hmm, fair point, s'pose.

mark s: if Yes Minister is Thatcherite, it is only so through retrospective interpretation. The writers and cast loathed her, and have gone on record as resenting being bounced into getting her involved in a sketch, even if it was for charity. Ironic thing is, the Tories couldn't stop giving them gongs.

― Magnus, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

YM writers = political nitwits, then
YM = v.v.v.funny btw

― mark s, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Y(P)M - v.v. funny because of the peformers as much as the script? Mark Thomas - incapable of delivering a gag?

― Andrew L, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

My dad once played an Arab sheik in Yes Minister. So it is clearly rubbish.

― Nick, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Anyone: Don't you sometimes find Mark Thomas/Michael Moore a tad juvenile? Or is that the point? In theory I agree with both their points of view but sometimes feel they are a little heavy handed, also forgetting that not everyone can afford to have principles etc. (Then again do they have much money?)

― Bill, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

'Not everyone can afford to have principles'? Well, that reinforces my jaundiced view of the underclasses, but I'm sure you didn't mean to do that.

― dave q, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Destroy: Ben Elton, Have I Got News For You, oh political comedy in general. I hate it. Yes hate it.

― jel, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

This Hour Has Twenty Two Minutes reigns supreme over all political comedy in Canadia. That is all.

― Mr Noodles, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Talking of satire, does Chris Morris count as political satire per se, or is he another beast entirely? (Apologies to US people who may not have heard of Morris..?)

― Will McKenzie, Wednesday, 26 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

twelve years pass...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7Ec35C_H_Y

― elegant eyes, aristocrat face, gorgeous hair (soref), Thursday, 5 December 2013 02:26 (twelve years ago)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5Kw1sA4AoM

― elegant eyes, aristocrat face, gorgeous hair (soref), Thursday, 5 December 2013 02:30 (twelve years ago)

(second video is probably NSFW)

― elegant eyes, aristocrat face, gorgeous hair (soref), Thursday, 5 December 2013 02:30 (twelve years ago)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxfDWE_oZME

― elegant eyes, aristocrat face, gorgeous hair (soref), Thursday, 5 December 2013 02:50 (twelve years ago)

that third video isn't working for some reason?

― elegant eyes, aristocrat face, gorgeous hair (soref), Thursday, 5 December 2013 03:04 (twelve years ago)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxfDWE_oZME

― elegant eyes, aristocrat face, gorgeous hair (soref), Thursday, 5 December 2013 03:05 (twelve years ago)

Does this kind of thing just seem bizarre and alienating to anyone who isn't already involved with the british far left?

― elegant eyes, aristocrat face, gorgeous hair (soref), Thursday, 5 December 2013 03:06 (twelve years ago)

five years pass...

why is late-night US TV comedy terrible?

https://sethsimons.substack.com/p/no-ethical-late-night-under-capitalism

― a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 28 May 2019 04:52 (six years ago)

(political comedy, that is)

― a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 28 May 2019 04:52 (six years ago)

five months pass...

I'm watching an HBO special by Daniel Sloss and it is painfully bad

― Guayaquil (eephus!), Sunday, 3 November 2019 02:50 (six years ago)

political comedy is so bad so often that it seems like a miracle when it's actually good

― (The Other) J.D. (J.D.), Sunday, 3 November 2019 02:55 (six years ago)

This is both bad comedy and bad at being political

― Guayaquil (eephus!), Sunday, 3 November 2019 03:01 (six years ago)

I dunno, maybe I'm being unfair and it's OK at being political

― Guayaquil (eephus!), Sunday, 3 November 2019 03:02 (six years ago)

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