― Mike Hanle y (mike), Sunday, 12 October 2003 08:28 (twenty-one years ago)
― stevem (blueski), Sunday, 12 October 2003 09:32 (twenty-one years ago)
― spittle, Sunday, 12 October 2003 17:50 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hunter (Hunter), Sunday, 12 October 2003 20:36 (twenty-one years ago)
re this fracas -- yet another reason why Boston (the town) sucks
― Little Big Macher (llamasfur), Sunday, 12 October 2003 23:09 (twenty-one years ago)
Granted, Pedro acted like one of those Duquettian social pariahs (cf. Jose Canseco, Carl Everett, Mike Lansing, Dante Bichette, etc etc etc), albeit Pedro's a little better than those folks (combined) (* 100). I'm still not sure why he was egging on Karim Garcia, and I'm also not sure why, aside from the throwing-at-head thing (which, duh, is a big deal), 4th-outfielder epitomizer Garcia A) took SUCH umbrage @ Pedro deigning to throw a baseball near his personage and B) felt it necessary to exact revenge by sliding into Todd Walker @ 2nd base long after Walker had gotten rid of the ball (which is how I understood what happened on that double play) - it'd be a neat trick to see a runner break up a double play when the ball's already 3/4ths of the way to 1st. Of course, given the purported cleat massage that Garcia (& super-terrific good fella Jeff Nelson) gave to the groundscrew member, perhaps it's not too surprising to see Garcia act like such a chump.
As for Pedro's run-in with Zimmer, I've heard some rumblings regarding Zim's less-than-cherubic personage, though I would like some stories to back this up. Regardless, it might've behooved Pedro to not toss Zimmer aside (tho, heat of the moment, damned if I wouldn't have done the same), tho it might've behooved Zimmer to not charge a guy half his age. Never mind the whole "I'm gonna hit you / I've fallen and I can't get up" shift of the entire encounter. And it would've been nice if Manny realized how far Clemens' pitch was from hitting him and reacted accordingly.
Given what went down, the umps should've either A) tossed Pedro after the head-pointing thing & warned both sides or B) let Clemens stoke the fires with a little chin music & warn both sides. Issuing a warning immediately after the Garcia confrontation totally screws the Yankees, in that Manny's overreactive fucknuttiness regarding a middle-of-the-plate ball can actually be vaguely justified, and morons like Garcia feel the need to channel Ty Cobb in exacting vengeance.
Ideally, I would hope that Garcia would simply take his base, swallow his pride, and let his teammates get back at Pedro's insolence by smacking him around. Of course, that's what they were doing prior to The Pitch, and I guess Pedro was successful in that regard (if his intentions re: The Pitch were to establish dominance again and get his slop-throwing self back on track). That said, the Yankees (& Clemens, in particular) showed a LOT more restraint than I thought possible, & I might throw up in my mouth after typing this, but it's that sort of professionalism that typifies the Yankees and their pseudo-mythical ability to win the big games.
Honestly, I'd feel better about sympathizing with the Yankees' plight were it not for the YES Network's post-game coverage and their inability to even attempt to fashion a feasable facade of journalistic impartiality. Like, y'know, if you're going to comment on how harping on all the Pedro / Garcia / Zimmer nonsense detracts from the greatness of the actual game (and, yeah, the game was pretty good), then how about backing that shit up by practicing what you preach? Seeing Peter Gammons on there for a brief chat, though, was nice.
― David R. (popshots75`), Monday, 13 October 2003 07:29 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ally (mlescaut), Monday, 13 October 2003 12:42 (twenty-one years ago)
*Chicago Cubs excepted.**
**cf. Shawn Estes, current Cubby/then Met who couldn't hit the broadside of a barn***
***Clemens' big ass****
****retribution for Piazza/bat incident.
― gygax! (gygax!), Monday, 13 October 2003 14:33 (twenty-one years ago)
"Zimmer was leading the American Association with 23 HR and 63 RBI on July 7, 1953 when he was hit in the head by a Jim Kirk pitch. He was unconscious for almost two weeks, lost his speech for six, and dropped 44 lbs. Inserted in his head were four "buttons...like tapered corkscrews in a bottle," he explained. He returned in 1954 and was Brooklyn's second baseman in the 1955 World Series. He was doing well in 1956 when a pitch from the Reds' Hal Jeffcoat fractured his cheekbone and ended his season." http://www.baseballlibrary.com/baseballlibrary/ballplayers/Z/Zimmer_Don.stm
― earlnash, Monday, 13 October 2003 14:44 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ally (mlescaut), Monday, 13 October 2003 15:07 (twenty-one years ago)
― cinniblount (James Blount), Monday, 13 October 2003 15:08 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ally (mlescaut), Monday, 13 October 2003 15:10 (twenty-one years ago)
So arguably, Clemens would've kept things a little calmer if he'd had to face the Mets pitcher later in the game. (Given that Clemens has always been very upfront about pitching angry, I don't think that's true, but it's an easy argument to make.)
― Tep (ktepi), Monday, 13 October 2003 15:18 (twenty-one years ago)
― Tep (ktepi), Monday, 13 October 2003 15:19 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ally (mlescaut), Monday, 13 October 2003 15:34 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 13 October 2003 15:37 (twenty-one years ago)
It's pathetic. Shawn Estes' only job in the Mets rematch was to hit Clemens and he missed. How can you MISS such a huge target? George W. Bush has better pitch location.
― felicity (felicity), Monday, 13 October 2003 16:00 (twenty-one years ago)
― half jack, Monday, 13 October 2003 16:58 (twenty-one years ago)
1) Even if he's not throwing at you (he wasn't), when it's straight at your head & almost 100 mph (it was), the distinction isn't much consolation.
2) Remember when his fucking helmet got shattered in the spring? Could make a guy a little jumpy ...
― brian nemtusak (sanlazaro), Monday, 13 October 2003 20:31 (twenty-one years ago)
― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Monday, 13 October 2003 20:39 (twenty-one years ago)
― Tep (ktepi), Monday, 13 October 2003 20:51 (twenty-one years ago)
― brian nemtusak (sanlazaro), Monday, 13 October 2003 20:56 (twenty-one years ago)
― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Monday, 13 October 2003 21:09 (twenty-one years ago)
― brian nemtusak (sanlazaro), Monday, 13 October 2003 21:16 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ann Sterzinger (Ann Sterzinger), Monday, 13 October 2003 21:36 (twenty-one years ago)
― ModJ, Monday, 13 October 2003 22:33 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ally (mlescaut), Monday, 13 October 2003 23:39 (twenty-one years ago)
Zimmer ran at him, and Pedro flipped him to the ground. Much nicer than wailing on the old guy.
― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 00:25 (twenty-one years ago)
― Tep (ktepi), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 00:27 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ally (mlescaut), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 00:29 (twenty-one years ago)
― hstencil, Tuesday, 14 October 2003 01:08 (twenty-one years ago)
http://www.espn.go.com/page2/s/caple/031013.html
― brian nemtusak (sanlazaro), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 02:24 (twenty-one years ago)
― bnw (bnw), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 03:26 (twenty-one years ago)
― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 03:28 (twenty-one years ago)
― Chris V. (Chris V), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 10:27 (twenty-one years ago)
But if there is a Game 7 with Martínez on the mound, Bloomberg should be more concerned with the behavior of those Yankees fans who might be more concerned with the visiting villain.
Names or even nicknames will never hurt Martínez, but in the absence of sticks and stones, a battery might. When he's on the mound or when he warms up in the bullpen, he would be within range of any Yankees loyalist with a good arm. But if there's no Game 7, Pedro the Perpetrator will be safe. Until next season.
(I saw this quoted this morning with just the final paragraph, which makes it seem almost menacing instead of trying-to-be-prophetic.)
― Tep (ktepi), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 12:04 (twenty-one years ago)
― dyson (dyson), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 12:34 (twenty-one years ago)
― Tep (ktepi), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 12:36 (twenty-one years ago)
― dyson (dyson), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 12:55 (twenty-one years ago)
― bnw (bnw), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 15:08 (twenty-one years ago)
― Tep (ktepi), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 15:13 (twenty-one years ago)
Also:http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/news/images/032901-domi_water.jpghttp://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/news/images/032901-domi_fan.jpg[insert pic of Domi pummeling the guy when he missed his punch and fell into the penalty box.]
― bnw (bnw), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 16:24 (twenty-one years ago)
― Chris V. (Chris V), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 16:35 (twenty-one years ago)
― dyson (dyson), Tuesday, 14 October 2003 17:35 (twenty-one years ago)