Alberta Homeless Shelters to Charge for Beds

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What does Mr. Noodles think about this?
(note: honestly asking and not just trying to pick an ideological fight)


Monday, October 20, 2003

Fees for homeless proposal slammed

By MIKE D'AMOUR, CALGARY SUN

An outspoken advocate for Calgary's homeless is firing back
at a provincial government proposal to charge the homeless
for using shelters.

"I don't know why they'd suggest that," said Dermot Baldwin,
executive director of the Calgary Drop-In Centre.

"I think they have no idea what homelessness is about -- it's
poverty, dysfunction and bad luck," he said.

"These are people who do not need to be beaten up again, they
need help."

Baldwin was responding to a plan floated by Seniors Minister
Stan Woloshyn last week that would see welfare recipients, the
working poor and disabled people who collect provincial benefits
pay a fee to stay overnight in shelters.

Homeless people who don't work and aren't collecting any
provincial benefits wouldn't be asked to pay.

Liberal housing critic Laurie Blakeman accused the government
of ignoring the root causes of homelessness while blaming the
poorest people in society for a growing shortage of low-cost
housing.

She said Alberta's low minimum wage leaves the working poor
struggling to avoid homelessness.

And many of Calgary's homeless are already hard-pressed to
find a warm place to sleep, added Baldwin.

"We have 740 beds (at the CDI) and right now we're 100
(people) over capacity."

"We have people (squatting) in closed up buildings, sleeping in
the backs of cars and cardboard boxes or making fabricated
shelters from stuff they find in the lanes."

No figure for the shelter fee has been set, but it would likely
be linked to a person's monthly income.

Under the proposal, a portion of the fee would be set aside in a trust fund and upon
leaving a shelter, a person could take that money and use it as a damage deposit on
an apartment.

But Baldwin said that's not the business those who care for the homeless are in.

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 20 October 2003 16:58 (twenty-one years ago)

A shelter in Louisville, Kentucky tried the same thing recently, but rescinded after the ensuing controversy.

hstencil, Monday, 20 October 2003 17:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Apparently a lot of shelters in Massachusetts charge, or did ten or so years ago; my long-since ex had to spend time in a shelter in order to qualify for housing assistance (which is weird in of itself), and the only one with openings that didn't charge was a short-term women's shelter intended for women who needed a place to stay for a week or two as part of their "abusive relationship exit strategy" (I'm quoting because the phrasing is so ... bureaucratastic).

Tep (ktepi), Monday, 20 October 2003 17:20 (twenty-one years ago)

If it passes I think we will get a lot more homeless people in Toronto or Vancouver. Isn't this a fallout of having no PST in Alberta?

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Monday, 20 October 2003 17:36 (twenty-one years ago)

Never heard of such stupidity: you are charging the homeless/low-income workers for a place to sleep? Shelters aren't hotels, with maid service or mints placed under pillows. I can understand things are economically tight, but why kick people any further down than they are? Is there a Canadian politician actually proud of this proposal?

*ahem*

[End of mini-sermon]

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Monday, 20 October 2003 17:51 (twenty-one years ago)

what there should be is some sort of thing (though I suppose this would be deemed socialistic) that would prevent companies from laying people off unless they were doing it to keep the company alive. Like throwing 200 people off the rolls just to maximize profits would earn you some big huge bonus rich kid tax so that the rest of society wouldn't have to foot the bill for your greed.

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 20 October 2003 18:03 (twenty-one years ago)

In other headlines:

God starts charging for Salvation, $200/sin

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 20 October 2003 19:20 (twenty-one years ago)

Damn, I'm already in hock, up to my eyeballs

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Monday, 20 October 2003 20:49 (twenty-one years ago)

Alberta is my mother's name.

Sean (Sean), Monday, 20 October 2003 21:56 (twenty-one years ago)

well, the free ride's over, Sean!

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 14:34 (twenty-one years ago)

Alberta is so odd. I'm guessing they're actually not even the most right-wing province in Canada, and probably more left than any U.S. state, but just love to pretend that they're asshole redneck rightwingers. (the government that is, not the citizens)

Then again, that's just my guess.

donut bitch (donut), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 16:46 (twenty-one years ago)

Alberta is far and away the most right wing province. Probably are still left of most states though.

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 16:54 (twenty-one years ago)

Ontario, Quebec and BC have all had their lunatic rightwing moments (and Saskatchewan may have one coming up). Alberta seems to be the most consistently rightwing governed province though.

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 17:31 (twenty-one years ago)

What was BC's right leaning government? I thought BC had been card carrying near communist NDP government for years and years until recently a moderate one took over.

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 18:21 (twenty-one years ago)

If you listened to my friends, you'd think Gordon Campbell (BC premier) was fucking Hitler, but yeah, BC is now Liberal terri-Torie.. and apparently he somewhat lives up his Social Service Slasher Primetime Band name... moderate, right, or whatever. and he apparently lives la vida loca in Maui occasionally, too. Sounds like a party man!

donut bitch (donut), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 18:26 (twenty-one years ago)

How is Gordon Campbell moderate? Because he's a member of the Liberal Party? Prov and Fed incarnations can differ drastically. The Sask NDP, particularly that of 1990s, was ideologically closest to the Fed. Liberals. Just as the BC Libs are better dressed Reformallianconservatives.

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 18:28 (twenty-one years ago)

After years of NDP hippiethon out there even Copps probably would appear like a GOP warhawk.

G Campbell's love of the sauce still doesn't come close to Ralph's.

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 18:31 (twenty-one years ago)

Seriously, dude, check out the federal ridings...BC votes to the right. You think drop-out squeegee kids, squatters and soapmakers vote?

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 18:35 (twenty-one years ago)

the NDP in BC (esp under harcourt) were notoriously hard on welfare. the present Liberal gov is so far about as "moderate" as Harris's was in Ontario - a matter of perception i guess. prior to the NDP dominion the quite-right SoCreds held power there from 1975-91 (?)

(xp)

jones (actual), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 18:40 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, Klein and Campbell are threatening to amalgamate into a giant minumum-wage-free unregistered-guns and for-profit-healthcare zone...called Albertan Columbia!

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 18:43 (twenty-one years ago)

What was BC's right leaning government?
As Jones mentioned, the Social Credit party had control provincially for quite a long time. Also, there's a pretty high percentage of Reform support in the federal side of things in BC, which surprised the hell out of me when I first heard that.

Sean Carruthers (SeanC), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 18:55 (twenty-one years ago)

Thought the pot growers would help :P

But holy smokes did they ever swing right in the last election. NDP were doing alright in '97, though Reform got the seats. In that last one they were decimated, outside Libby and Sven.

Turns out my riding has been strongly grit for 24 years.

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 18:57 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.parl.gc.ca/information/about/process/house/hfer/hfer.asp?Language=E&Search=R&Source=AboutParl_Process
Incase anyone was interested. Im sure there is a prettier site out there for this sorta thing.

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 18:59 (twenty-one years ago)

well, for one, despite the fact that Easterners think of BC as hippie heaven, it's got a pretty keen commercial scene going and even outside of that, tons of AB/SK/MB and even a few North-Western Ont. fogeys go there to be old and crotchety, and they, y'know have bucks, much moreso than yr avg. hemp-clothing booth dude.

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 19:01 (twenty-one years ago)

Forgot about the hordes od old people. I do that no matter what province they are in though. ;)

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 19:04 (twenty-one years ago)

that's because you probably don't have a job where they phone you all day to make sure that you got their 25 faxes regarding their goddamned bridge tournaments

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 19:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Bridge sucks.

Casuistry (Chris P), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 19:19 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm trying to quit smoking today.
So I'm, uh, irritable.

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 19:20 (twenty-one years ago)

I love contract bridge! Duplicate can be annoying.

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 19:25 (twenty-one years ago)

Never heard of such stupidity

For a really poignant, yet measured and detached description of just such a pay-for-homeless-shelter-system, see Orwell's Down and Out in Paris and London, the London section that is.

Skottie, Tuesday, 21 October 2003 20:26 (twenty-one years ago)

outside Vancouver's Commercial St. area, parts of downtown, and maybe one street block in downtown Victoria, you can feel the older, affluent contempt for "lower life" almost everywhere in B.C. -- (outside the more gang-inflicted neighborhoods like NW Surrey) Just ask anyone in Vancouver who has to work at a posh restaurant or cafe. So, i'm not terribly surprised that the provincial government is on the right, actually.

donut bitch (donut), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 21:12 (twenty-one years ago)

(I tell you, all the extreme politeness is just a scam!)

donut bitch (donut), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 21:12 (twenty-one years ago)

That's why I love Canada -- all of MY extreme politeness is a scam too!

Casuistry (Chris P), Tuesday, 21 October 2003 22:07 (twenty-one years ago)


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