"Let's have a FAP, eh?", or, This is the thread where I wander around Western Canada for a few weeks

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As you probably already know, I'm about to go on a mammoth tour around Western Canada. Eleven days, 4100 miles (6600 km), many long drives through Zen nothingness, fistfuls of ketchup-flavored potato chips until we puke.

Here's the roadmap:

http://www.theminorthirds.com/pix-can-trip.gif

And here's Ryan (in glasses) and me:

http://www.theminorthirds.com/tm3-cp-rt-400.jpg

And we're coming to, you know, rock, more or less.

I'll be in Edmonton (hi Anthony! hi Fields of Salmon!), Saskatoon (hi, uh, no one I know!), Winnipeg (hi Bryan! hi Jodi!), Regina (hi Huckleberry!) and Moose Jaw (hi dk!). I think everyone who lives there is aware that I'm coming and all. If not: E-mail me!

We leave Wednesday afternoon. I have never been outside the U.S. before. We are terribly, terribly excited.

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 17:26 (twenty-two years ago)

I know you're leaving Charlotte and Jake out because you're afraid of their power and will kick you out of the band you started, like Syd Barrett.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 24 November 2003 17:33 (twenty-two years ago)

Yes, surely not because Jake is on another (less expensive, much noisier) Gang Wizard tour and because Charlotte can't get the time off work.

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 17:49 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm building one of those circular projection screens for the show so you can show films like Pink Floyd.

Bryan (Bryan), Monday, 24 November 2003 17:51 (twenty-two years ago)

Yes, surely not because Jake is on another (less expensive, much noisier) Gang Wizard tour and because Charlotte can't get the time off work.

You and your rational reasons! How dare you be accurate!

Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 24 November 2003 17:53 (twenty-two years ago)

Oh, best to ya guys, Chris and Ryan. Hope you can actually convince c*st*ms to let you off without buying an entertainment work permit! Oh, and I love you both.

donut bitch (donut), Monday, 24 November 2003 17:59 (twenty-two years ago)

I feel partially responsible for this...

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:01 (twenty-two years ago)

Me too but it'll be ok.

Bryan (Bryan), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:01 (twenty-two years ago)

I had nothing to do with it. But it's nice that I get an honourable mention.

Jodi (Celerina), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:02 (twenty-two years ago)

when I left my apt this morning, the wind chill was at -33.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:02 (twenty-two years ago)

You were a fool to leave your apartm... oh.

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:03 (twenty-two years ago)

Jodi, your role was small but you're still mentioned in the liner notes, you're just as blood-stained and frostbitten as the rest of them.

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:04 (twenty-two years ago)

Goddamned chinook coming this weekend. It might not even be cold while you're here, Chris!

Bryan (Bryan), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:05 (twenty-two years ago)

seriously, bring warm clothes and lots of em, and an emergency car kit.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:05 (twenty-two years ago)

or not, apparently it'll be tropical

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:05 (twenty-two years ago)

I've warned him, Huck, but warm = 0 C, so it's not like it'll be balmy. Chinooks often mean crazy sudden snowstorms, too.

Bryan (Bryan), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:07 (twenty-two years ago)

We have an "emergency blanket". Ryan bought it. I said to him, "You only bought one?" There was an awkward, tender moment.

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:10 (twenty-two years ago)

Also: Ryan has AAA (which Bryan says is cooperative with CAA) and he's an Eagle Scout, he knows how to make a fort in a snow bank. No fear!

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:10 (twenty-two years ago)

Hurrah!

Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:11 (twenty-two years ago)

Unless something weird happens there won't be enough snow for forts, sadly. Not around here anyway. Make sure you have lots of candy and candles and that you keep the phone charged up.

Bryan (Bryan), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:15 (twenty-two years ago)

Candy?

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:17 (twenty-two years ago)

You should have candy with you at all times! Even when there isn't the threat of a snow storm or putting the car in the ditch.

Jodi (Celerina), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:19 (twenty-two years ago)

yes. it's canada's currency.

dyson (dyson), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:20 (twenty-two years ago)

Yes. Good energy source in case you're stranded for any amount of time. You're not really going to be anywhere where you'll likely get into trouble (at least not on the Canadian side), but it's still a good idea. Most people put a bunch of candy into their winter survival kits here. Mentalists.

Bryan (Bryan), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:20 (twenty-two years ago)

and you can use it to make the locals live up to their polite stereotypes...

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:22 (twenty-two years ago)

Gimme some candy!

Er, gimme some candy, please.

Jodi (Celerina), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:22 (twenty-two years ago)

see?

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:23 (twenty-two years ago)

"But We Had Candy: The true story of an American band stranded on the dangerous and uncharted side of the Trans-Canada Highway."

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:23 (twenty-two years ago)

Should I bring American candy?

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:23 (twenty-two years ago)

that would be the left hand side, ey, b'y?

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:24 (twenty-two years ago)

Yes! Bring Kraft Caramels!!!

Bryan (Bryan), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:24 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm told that when visiting Third World countries such as Canada, it's best to have a some crisp American dollar bills. It's like gold to the natives!

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:25 (twenty-two years ago)

"Kraft Caramels" are surely a Canadian candy.

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:25 (twenty-two years ago)

Smarties vs Rockets FITE!

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:25 (twenty-two years ago)

Do they still have Kraft Caramels in the states?

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:26 (twenty-two years ago)

YES THEY DO!!!

Bryan (Bryan), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:26 (twenty-two years ago)

holy crap! yes! I think Kraft Caramels singlehandedly stunted my growth.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:26 (twenty-two years ago)

Your best bet with American currency is to convince the locals your 1 dollar bill is actually a 5 since we can't tell the damm things apart.

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:27 (twenty-two years ago)

OK, I'll look for Kraft Caramels. I don't even like caramel.

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:27 (twenty-two years ago)

Noodles, it's our form of vengeance for all the time we get your worthless quarters out of vending machines.

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:28 (twenty-two years ago)

My first halloween without Kraft Caramels was a sad thing indeed. I used to make sure there were tons on hand at home so as to not run out over the course of a night.

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:28 (twenty-two years ago)

Well your American quarters are accepted, but only at par so we keep the 10 cents or whatever.

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:29 (twenty-two years ago)

ts: regular vs chocolate Kraft caramels

Bryan (Bryan), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:29 (twenty-two years ago)

regular

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:30 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.oldtimecandy.com/images/candypix-pages/kraft-caramels_small.jpg

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:31 (twenty-two years ago)

Well, think of this this way, Chris. At least you could survive off an economy pack of AERO chocolate bars if the weather halts you guys. (something you cannot get in the states)

donut bitch (donut), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:32 (twenty-two years ago)

(Well of course you can get Aero in the states but you have to pay import prices.)

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:32 (twenty-two years ago)

they grow on trees here.
not that we have trees, mind you.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:35 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm regular as well, Noodles! heh. The chocolate ones do taste really good.
Canadians! ADVISE ME! I am gonna get a really good bottle of rye for when Chris is here. What do you like? The 12 year old CC is good but still a mixing rye. Is that Crown Royal in the gold bottle good? What else? Seems silly to have them come here and drink bourbon, eh?

Bryan (Bryan), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:35 (twenty-two years ago)

I useta drink Golden Wedding in high school. Ugh.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 24 November 2003 18:39 (twenty-two years ago)

I should take them to Riderville, I'm sure there's a bazillion Grey Cup junkernauts on for clearance!

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 20:29 (twenty-two years ago)

That's not that far from downtown if I remember correctly. Looks like they're finally gonna get to experience some real cold on Friday, none of this pussy +1 crap like we've had here!

Bryan (Bryan), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 20:33 (twenty-two years ago)

You should take them to all the cool warehouses along the Ring Road. Do they still have the refinery flame up there somewhere? How about the big Sears Warehouse? I miss all that.

Sean Carruthers (SeanC), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 20:34 (twenty-two years ago)

Yeah, my brother and I took a drive around the refinery a couple of weeks ago. It was late at night and foggy. So it felt like we were on another planet. And not a friendly one.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 20:35 (twenty-two years ago)

Do you still have the guys in the muscle cars ripping up and down Albert Street for hours on end as soon as all of the stores close at 6pm?

Sean Carruthers (SeanC), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 20:44 (twenty-two years ago)

the stores close at 5:30 now.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 20:45 (twenty-two years ago)

Take them to that cemetery on Broad Street and later try to break into Taylor Field. THEY SHOULD DO A GUERILLA SHOW THERE!!! THEN THEY CAN SAY THEY'RE STADIUM ROCK!!!

Bryan (Bryan), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 20:46 (twenty-two years ago)

it's a field, not a stadium

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 20:47 (twenty-two years ago)

We already know they're field rock so I guess there's no point.

Bryan (Bryan), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 20:49 (twenty-two years ago)

what time did they leave?

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 20:54 (twenty-two years ago)

A bit after 11. They may take a little tour through Brandon but I know they're anxious to get there. We got into a bottle of rye last night and that kinda messed up any plans of getting them on the road by 9:30 like they were hoping. They'll probably not spend too much time in Brandon as Chris was not wanting to leave things too tight before the radio interview this evening (it was at 8, right?).

Bryan (Bryan), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 21:00 (twenty-two years ago)

I could use some time to get home and tidy up.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 21:02 (twenty-two years ago)

well, I'm gone.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 21:14 (twenty-two years ago)

No update! OH NO! Has Huck snapped and brutally murdered The Minor Thirds!!!???

Sean Carruthers (SeanC), Thursday, 4 December 2003 16:42 (twenty-two years ago)

I don't think Huck has a computer at home and he took the day off to be with the boys. They're probably out looking for Dick Assman right now.

Bryan (Bryan), Thursday, 4 December 2003 16:46 (twenty-two years ago)

Hi. We're at the venue. I should get offline and go do soundcheck. The Perms seem to have left their drummer in Winnipeg. Ha! OK, maybe that's mean. They seem worried. Poor things.

Anyway, yes. We saw Brandon -- thanks for recommending that radio station, it was awesome!

Huck, we have no problem with the accomodations and are grateful that you've allowed us to crowd up your space and force you to be tour guide and all. It has all been mellow and nice. Everyone has been mellow and nice.

And we did see the refinery mabob, which was large and pollutive but pretty (sigh) -- Ryan and I have total love of these kinds of industrial structures.

Tonight we rock, tomorrow we hit MOOSE JAW!

dk, you better get your butt down here and say hi (or say hi in Moose Jaw), k?

Also: As mentioned on the other thread, prairie boys are generally pleasanter on the eyes than I had expected (I hadn't thought about it that much, actually).

c in regina, Friday, 5 December 2003 03:17 (twenty-two years ago)

Oh, also we did see ac's hometown (though we didn't have time to stop, but we did see the sign).

I want to repeat (though I'm sure I'll say it again) that this tour has been wonderful (if completely exhausting) and I'm glad to have met you all and your fine highway system. ;-)

c in regina, Friday, 5 December 2003 03:23 (twenty-two years ago)

Yay! I am always very happy when people acknowledge my wee hometown! I would have been quite shocked and confused if you had bothered to stop. There's not THAT much to see.
Every time I think of the Perms I laugh and laugh and laugh.
It was nice to meet you both, too.

ac, Friday, 5 December 2003 04:04 (twenty-two years ago)

I think Chris and Ryan are still asleep. But the sun is nearly all the way up, so they'll be off to the Friendly City ASAP.
Was fun to have housguests.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Friday, 5 December 2003 14:51 (twenty-two years ago)

How was the show? Did the Perms' drummer show up? Did they just invite some crazy guy off the street to play cowbell instead?

Bryan (Bryan), Friday, 5 December 2003 14:57 (twenty-two years ago)

show was good. TM3 rocked the house! Rocked the whole damn province! The second band was totally weird exact midpoint between the White Stripes and Nickelback, with poetry interludes! The Perms performed sans drummer, but their trumpet player looked like a bodybuilder.
They didn't seem too impressed, since everybody had pretty much left by the time they hit the stage, since most of them were there for the second band, whose name is pretty convoluted and beyond my immediate recall.

Random hippy dude comes up and starts telling Chris how one of his lyrics is inaccurate (surprising it's not about SK, it's about the cellular structure of the euglenoid [sp??)) and then says, "so, you guys like the Grateful Dead?"

Also bizarro quartet of drugged-up hoodlums were all making out and staggering all over the place, but seemed to listen to TM3 nonetheless.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Friday, 5 December 2003 15:06 (twenty-two years ago)

HA!!! That's so funny that everyone left during the Perms! I was fully expecting that TM3 would've been up for last night's show and I'm glad it went well. Chris is a pretty powerful performer and can read an audience very well so it's no wonder they kicked everyone's ass.

Bryan (Bryan), Friday, 5 December 2003 15:15 (twenty-two years ago)

Reading the thread I'm almost sad that I left Brandon; if I was there I would have totally tried to get a show set up at the Punk Community Centre. That would have been so cool, even if no one but me and Cig showed up.

Sean Carruthers (SeanC), Friday, 5 December 2003 16:53 (twenty-two years ago)

I would've driven out. The Double Decker or Suds would've been better venues but I understand where you're coming from. I need to go and talk to Cig soon or I may lose my way in the world.

Bryan (Bryan), Friday, 5 December 2003 16:56 (twenty-two years ago)

We have arrived. We looked at the Western Development Museum thingy and it was... it was a bunch of planes. It was kinda cool but still not the prairie museum I was hoping for (apparently THAT's what I should have done in Saskatoon, oh well!).

A handful of people after the show were really excited by our project, which was very nice, and we sold a few CDs and had actual conversations with people. People who I hope actually like the CDs and e-mail and whatnot.

Anyway, off to check out the tunnels and try to find the famous Peacock Collegiate.

chris jaw, Friday, 5 December 2003 19:31 (twenty-two years ago)

Chris, I'm soo happy for you.

(btw, I got to play in the G*ng W*z*rd show last night at an art gallery in Seattle as a mummy playing with the language master. sadly, one of the entourage got a little crazy (i.e. not Jake and not Br*an M*ller) and tried to roll a tom drum down the stairs but accidentally dropped it on a woman's head. she had to go to the hospital. show immediately cancelled and everyone was escorted out. very very sad day in the chapter of the g*ng w*z*rd. even though jake, br*an, and i had nothing involved in it, we still feel terribly TERRIBLY awful about what happened, and hope everyone is ok)

donut bitch (donut), Friday, 5 December 2003 19:35 (twenty-two years ago)

Oh, no, that's terrible!

Sigh.

Anyway. A quick google search for "cellular structure euglena" shows hippie guy to have been wrongo bongo. But he has his weed to keep him warm.

chris jaw, Friday, 5 December 2003 19:39 (twenty-two years ago)

but he really like biology!

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Friday, 5 December 2003 19:58 (twenty-two years ago)

Yeeps, DB! :-(

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 5 December 2003 21:06 (twenty-two years ago)

I missed it last night. / What time should I come tonight? / Why are you going to Peacock Collegiate? / I watched Godspell there last weekend. / It was really great. / The Sunday after we saw the girl who was in it, the one who was all flirty and was wearing fishnet stockings in it. At Superstore. My mom said, 'Were you in Godspell?' She was surprised at being recognized and asked if we had enjoyed it. And my mom had been sort of badmouthing her performance after the show, saying that she had seemed sort of arrogant or something. / What time should I come tonight? / Isn't it cold? / Actually, it's warmer than it was last night. (Minus twenty four celcius! That's minus eleven American, I think.) / Moose Jaw.


http://www.angelfire.com/amiga/sla/5thegreendivide.jpg

d k (d k), Friday, 5 December 2003 22:20 (twenty-two years ago)

The Moose Jaw show went really, really oddly. Did you show up? If so, why didn't you say hi? Sigh.

OK, we fine a hotel and then we find our way home.

Casuistry (Chris P), Saturday, 6 December 2003 04:07 (twenty-two years ago)

Argh road conditions seem to have suddenly gotten worse. Well, we'll get home eventually. Slow but sure wins the race.

Casuistry (Chris P), Saturday, 6 December 2003 16:47 (twenty-two years ago)

d k shame on you for not going! you missed out.
weather was super terrible yesterday, not so much today.
hope you guys escape from SK ok.

HuckleberyyMann, Saturday, 6 December 2003 20:41 (twenty-two years ago)

Have a safe trip home, Chris.

JuliaA (j_bdules), Saturday, 6 December 2003 21:25 (twenty-two years ago)

I was there, though! But very shy and unable to say hi. It did seem to go kind of oddly, I guess. But it was good.

d k (d k), Saturday, 6 December 2003 23:55 (twenty-two years ago)

I made it home safe and sound. We stuck on the TC and saw Calgary, which must have added a zillion hours to our trip back, but left us with mostly good roads.

Argh, dk, I wish you had said hi. I was in a weird mood by the end of that show and was hoping you would prove to actually be there and say hi, it would have cheered me up a bit. Were you the guy who lingered around towards the very end?

Moose Jaw is actually a really nice town -- a bit touristy, but nice. It reminded me of Ashland, OR, without all the cultural stuff, though (and I guess only db will get what I mean), and some historical stuff in its stead.

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 8 December 2003 12:12 (twenty-two years ago)

Sorry d k, I misinterpreted an earlier thread. Still you shoulda said 'hi' at least.

Chris, I'm glad you made it through the weather. I don't know if the winds that hit Regina Friday night made it to Moose Jaw (which, as has been said, is in a different weather system, despite the fact that we can SEE Moose Jaw from here, if we stand on a chair), but if they did, congratulations, you have survived nearly the worst this part of the world will throw at you (only we have to deal with it for about three months solid).

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 8 December 2003 14:35 (twenty-two years ago)

We got just a taste of it when leaving MJ. I expected it to be bad all the way out to Swift Current, from what I'd heard on the news, but it really wasn't. Though I was told that the trip from Regina to MJ was terrible.

I am so exhausted. I can't believe I'm going to work today.

dk, I don't suppose you know if our picture was in the Saturday Times-Herald after all? We were told it would be (which seemed odd, since we had a huge picture in the Friday paper), but the paper comes out after noon and we were on the road by then.

I suppose I'll call them in a bit.

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 8 December 2003 17:36 (twenty-two years ago)

I can't believe I'm AT work today, considering the shit hit the fan on Friday. But whatever. I guess now I NEED this shitty job. For now. Anyway, there's a very distinct possibility the the TM3 article will go down as the final thing I did for this crap-ass piece of bull-hooey.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 8 December 2003 17:45 (twenty-two years ago)

Ack! Did you start a shit-upon-fan thread? What's the story?

Casuistry (Chris P), Monday, 8 December 2003 18:55 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm actually sorta trying to not dwell on it too much. It's been a long time a-comin' and in the long run it's going to be a very positive thing. And I brought it on myself, well, I forced the issue. But I really needed a kick in the ass, as I was getting to comfortable on the second bottom rung here.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Monday, 8 December 2003 18:57 (twenty-two years ago)

A few pictures:

http://www.theminorthirds.com/pix-cp-with-sask-sign.jpg
Me in Saskatchewan.

http://www.theminorthirds.com/pix-ant-with-ryan.jpg
Anth with Ryan in Edmonton.

http://www.theminorthirds.com/pix-santa-maria-in-edm.jpg
The Santa Maria in the West Edmonton Mall.

http://www.theminorthirds.com/pix-cp-with-vegreville-egg.jpg
The Egg in Vegreville, AB, is cooler than you'd expect.

http://www.theminorthirds.com/pix-ryan-camera-in-sk.jpg
Ryan taking a picture of something off in the distance in (I think) Foam Lake, Saskatchewan.

http://www.theminorthirds.com/pix-sask.jpg
Yup, we drove across Saskatchewan, twice! And we loved every minute of it!

Casuistry (Chris P), Tuesday, 9 December 2003 20:40 (twenty-two years ago)

where's all the wildlife from our nature walk?

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 9 December 2003 20:43 (twenty-two years ago)

CP, think I flashed back to Children of the Corn with that last Saskatchewan photo. Evident you had a great time, though.

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Tuesday, 9 December 2003 20:43 (twenty-two years ago)

Huck, It's all on Ryan's camera still. Hang on, I think I have one photo of it...

Nichole, thankfully, it's not corn, it's wheat. Big diff.

Casuistry (Chris P), Tuesday, 9 December 2003 20:44 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.theminorthirds.com/pix-sask-wolves.jpg
We saw some wolves, but they, like all Canadians, were really friendly.

Casuistry (Chris P), Tuesday, 9 December 2003 20:45 (twenty-two years ago)

And they really would just not stop necking. Get a room! What are you, animals?!

Casuistry (Chris P), Tuesday, 9 December 2003 20:46 (twenty-two years ago)

whatever, they were only doing it for the camera, goddamn Saska-show biz wolves.

Huckleberry Mann (Horace Mann), Tuesday, 9 December 2003 20:48 (twenty-two years ago)

What the photo doesn't show is the third wolf who was all left out and pouty.

Casuistry (Chris P), Tuesday, 9 December 2003 20:52 (twenty-two years ago)

three weeks pass...
You came right before it all burned down:

Historic Downtown Moose Jaw Left In Rubble.

Sort of sad. No one hurt. Still smoke over the city.

Lil Keke, Saturday, 3 January 2004 02:53 (twenty-two years ago)


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