is there a UK city that nobody here has visited?

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following on from the ILXors in Europe thread, i was wondering about the possibility of this. how to ascertain? should we just reel off the cities we have been? or just suggest a city and wait for someone to say 'nope, been there'?

― stevem (blueski), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:34 (twenty-one years ago)

And how do we define "been to" because there are loads of tiny little villages that we've all driven through on A-roads, but never stopped at.

― HRH Queen Kate (kate), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:36 (twenty-one years ago)

got off and done some shopping at, maybe?

I've never been to anywhere in Wales, or anywhere in the south-west peninsula. Most other places I've been to, I think.

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:37 (twenty-one years ago)

City as in 'with cathedral' or a more modern definition? The first way is easier from the point of view of finding somewhere nobody's been. For example who's been to St. Asaph?

― David (David), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:38 (twenty-one years ago)

I wish I had my map right now. How about those wee tiny scary places along the North shore of Scotland? Have you been there, Pash?

― HRH Queen Kate (kate), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:39 (twenty-one years ago)

been=drunk in

― Enrique (Enrique), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:39 (twenty-one years ago)

St Asaph = patron saint of thread killing?

― stevem (blueski), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Which ones are cities, though K8? We used to go touring in scotland in my dad's Jowett Javelin a lot when I was a kid (NB this sounds idyllicy-fifties-ish, but actually it was the seventies)

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:41 (twenty-one years ago)

Arrr, we need to define cities. "Has a cathedral"? Recognised as such w/o one? (e.g. "Brighton and Hove")

― HRH Queen Kate (kate), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:43 (twenty-one years ago)

I can claim having been right along the scary North coast of Scotland. Nothing even approximating a city. I went to a wedding in Thurso which is the biggest town along there.

― ailsa (ailsa), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:46 (twenty-one years ago)

Thurso was the place I was struggling to remember the name of, so that takes that, then.

Do Orkneys/Shetlands/Isles of Scilly count, though?

― HRH Queen Kate (kate), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:48 (twenty-one years ago)

The Orkneys are part of the UK and Kirkwall has a cathedral, so a city by ye olde definition.

― David (David), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:52 (twenty-one years ago)

let's include cities without cathedrals. i've been to Hove.

― stevem (blueski), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:53 (twenty-one years ago)

They already are included aren't they?

― David (David), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:53 (twenty-one years ago)

< / pedant>

― David (David), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:55 (twenty-one years ago)

I've been to Kirkwall. They only have one tree - it's in the High Street opposite the cathedral with a fence round it. This is all I remember about Kirkwall.

― ailsa (ailsa), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:55 (twenty-one years ago)

Scotland has kind of pseudo-cities like Brechin and Elgin that no-one would know were cities if it weren't for the names of their football teams. (I've been to both of those two).

― ailsa (ailsa), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:56 (twenty-one years ago)

I want to go to the town that has that really long name with roman numbers in it.

― Catty (Catty), Friday, 19 December 2003 13:56 (twenty-one years ago)

Has anyone here been to Hull? Or Stoke?

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Freaking hell, we've had a whole thread about Hull-based posters, and gah, I've been there more times than I've been to some suburbs of London!

― HRH Queen Kate (kate), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:06 (twenty-one years ago)

I've been to Hull a couple of times.

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:09 (twenty-one years ago)

I would have thought someone would have been to a football match in Stoke. I've driven through it.

― ailsa (ailsa), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:09 (twenty-one years ago)

St Davids in Wales, the smallest city in the world, apparently.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:10 (twenty-one years ago)

yep, I have been to Stoke - I'm not a big fan

― chris (chris), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:10 (twenty-one years ago)

OK phew, I was about to have to post the "does Stoke Newington count?" joke.

― HRH Queen Kate (kate), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:11 (twenty-one years ago)

List of cities for reference

― ailsa (ailsa), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Where the hell is Ripon?

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:14 (twenty-one years ago)

North Yorkshire.

― ailsa (ailsa), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Incidentally, if we DO manage to find a city no one has visited, we are FAPping there.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:15 (twenty-one years ago)

(haven't been there)

x-post

― ailsa (ailsa), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:15 (twenty-one years ago)

I have an Idea, One propose, next poster to refute and suggest alternative, and so on..

Right,

I've never been to Liverpool.

― mark grout (mark grout), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:15 (twenty-one years ago)

I've been to Liverpool. I have never been to Lisburn. Actually I have never been to Northern Ireland, but I imagine Lisburn may be the least likely to have been visited.

(You can discount everywhere in Scotland btw. Been there, done that)

― ailsa (ailsa), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:17 (twenty-one years ago)

I thought Lisburn was in Portugal?

― Enrique (Enrique), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Not only have I been to Liverpool, I've actually played there!!

I've never been to Canterbury (even though I like caravan, soft machine etc)

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:18 (twenty-one years ago)

So very very sorry -- it's xmas!!

― Enrique (Enrique), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:19 (twenty-one years ago)

matt dc has canterbury covered. i expect the Exeter contingent all the South West cities covered? Northern Ireland is a tricky one.

― stevem (blueski), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:20 (twenty-one years ago)

I used to live in Canterbury. They are obsessed with Caravan!

I contend that no one here has been to Ripon.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:25 (twenty-one years ago)

I have - there's a racecourse there

Ely?

― chris (chris), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:26 (twenty-one years ago)

I bet no one here has been to Upper Buggersby.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:27 (twenty-one years ago)

I've never been to Ballykissangel. or Glenbogle.

― Catty (Catty), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:31 (twenty-one years ago)

I've been to Ely!! (I think you made that one up matt dc)

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:31 (twenty-one years ago)

mmm city...?

― mark grout (mark grout), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:31 (twenty-one years ago)

My parents have been to Ballykissangel (it's really called Avoca). I've been to Glenbogle if that's the place in Monarch of the Glen (Adverikie Estate, somewhere on the back road from Newtonmore to Laggan). Hah! Fear our visiting of fictional towns!

― ailsa (ailsa), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:33 (twenty-one years ago)

I haven't been to Portsmouth (or any of the ones in northern ireland)

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:34 (twenty-one years ago)

My parents made me go to Portsmouth for a fortnight on holiday when I was young (see also Birmingham thread for psychological scars). Robster lives there I think.

I still haven't been to Northern Ireland.

― ailsa (ailsa), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:35 (twenty-one years ago)

Okay, has anyone been to Royston Vasey?

― Catty (Catty), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:35 (twenty-one years ago)

That's Goathland on the Yorkshire moors isn't it? I've driven through it.

I have also been to the place in Peak Practice (Crich)

― chris (chris), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:38 (twenty-one years ago)

I can't remember what the name of the IRL Royston Vasey, but it's on the same road through the Peak District that Glossop is on. I've been there, dammit. (Had not seen LoG at the time, and was mystified as to what my mates kept quoting.)

― HRH Queen Kate (kate), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:50 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm sure it's not in the Peaks Kate.

― chris (chris), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:51 (twenty-one years ago)

Me.

― mark grout (mark grout), Friday, 19 December 2003 14:51 (twenty-one years ago)

Skipping 14 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

ever met anyone from Trebizon, Mark?

― robin carmody (robin carmody), Saturday, 20 December 2003 17:18 (twenty-one years ago)

I've been to Truro as well - it seemed nice, little Cornish city with cool churches and stuff - unfortunately I was forced to trudge round shops with my then girlfriend and didn't get to see any of the interesting stuff :(

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Saturday, 20 December 2003 17:19 (twenty-one years ago)

tell me more about cornwall! My mom is planning a trip there as it's where our family comes from. We come from the lizard penninsula, does that mean I'm a lizard?

― teeny (teeny), Saturday, 20 December 2003 18:44 (twenty-one years ago)

Robin, I've been to Wells. I've also been to Brecon, St. David's (obviously) but not St. Asaph.

― David (David), Saturday, 20 December 2003 19:03 (twenty-one years ago)

Teeny, it means you're a janner, and you should be very proud.

― Tim (Tim), Saturday, 20 December 2003 20:48 (twenty-one years ago)

― teeny (teeny), Saturday, 20 December 2003 20:58 (twenty-one years ago)

haha David I love the way you say you've been to St David's "obviously" when the vast majority here probably have no idea why it is so obvious (it is to me, though, as you know).

the only thing I know about St Asaph is that Ian Rush and Michael Owen both came from there, or very near (although the latter plays for England, of course) which leads me to suspect it might be one of those places in North East Wales where the third and fourth buttons on yer basic analogue TV set are "ITV1 Granada" and "Channel 4" rather than "HTV Wales" and "S4C", and everyone speaks with what are basically Scouse accents (old favourite joke of mine: in which county is Wrexham? Denbighshire or Clwyd? the answer is Merseyside ...) but perhaps there is something else I ought to be aware of?

nobody got the Trebizon joke, did they?

― robin carmody (robin carmody), Saturday, 20 December 2003 22:54 (twenty-one years ago)

I work with someone from the Lizard. I think it's just called that because the landmass is shaped like a lizard, I don't think the ppl there are in the least bit reptilian. Neither are they 12ft tall.

I've been to wells. I also have much love for St Albans.

I suppose Southwark is a city. Shakespeare's brother's grave is in Southwark cathedral.

― MarkH (MarkH), Sunday, 21 December 2003 12:24 (twenty-one years ago)

nobody got the Trebizon joke, did they?

no - is it some Arthurian thing?

― MarkH (MarkH), Sunday, 21 December 2003 12:25 (twenty-one years ago)

I thought it was like the "First Term at Trebizon" books, so we could FAP with lashings and lashings of ginger beer etc.

― ailsa (ailsa), Sunday, 21 December 2003 12:34 (twenty-one years ago)

oh Ailsa, I was quite disturbed by that post until I got to the "of ginger beer" bit.

― MarkH (MarkH), Sunday, 21 December 2003 12:36 (twenty-one years ago)

Peterborough I have only been to as a stopping off point on the train line from the south to the north (or more precisely GNL, and Cambridge-Sunderland). Have had many long waits there... never got a sense of the place beyond.

There are loads of UK cities that I've not been to... only briefly experienced Birmingham for example and many years ago.

I wonder if that many people have actually made the trek to Sunderland - the city I live in (well, half a year) and which only gained the status 11 years ago IIRC. It must be admitted it's not in many ways the most desirable of cities; how much more have I grown fond of Newcastle recently, in comparison.

― Tom May (Tom May), Sunday, 21 December 2003 17:04 (twenty-one years ago)

oddly enough, Tom, Peterborough is one of the three cities where I've only changed trains and never actually gone beyond the station (as it seems to be for many, part of the premise of my thread about it); the other two are Leeds (while I was going on holiday to North Yorkshire a matter of weeks before "Emmerdale" dropped the Farm from its title, which I know is a coincidence but, what with my family living in the south-east at the time, I don't want to believe it is) and Winchester (I *think* I once changed trains there anyway; certainly been through it more times than I can count).

only actually properly been to 10 UK cities *while they were cities*; London, Glasgow, Canterbury, Cambridge, Ely, Southampton, Portsmouth, Bristol, Bath and Exeter. I've been to Brighton but only when it was a town before the new city of Brighton and Hove was created, so I'm not sure whether that should count. the one schoolfriend (from South London 1955-60) my mum is still close to lives in Sunderland.

great that somebody else here knows the Trebizon books and got the joke! actually they were considered quite modern in their day (the last was as recent as 1994), ie they acknowledged that boarding school girls listened to POP MUSIC and didn't necessarily spend all their time talking about their fathers' estates and weren't snobby about "scholarship girls" ... for what it's worth there weren't any lashings of ginger beer to be seen, although I can see how it all blurs into one in this era of accelerated cultural proletarianisation.

― robin carmody (robin carmody), Monday, 22 December 2003 00:42 (twenty-one years ago)

I can confirem that Peterborough is a dump, my Dad worked there for a while when I was a kid, plus their ground is a hole.

― chris (chris), Monday, 22 December 2003 09:43 (twenty-one years ago)

I met my wife in Sunderland (she was at college there) It is a bit of a dump, yes.

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Monday, 22 December 2003 09:48 (twenty-one years ago)

The West Front of Peterborough Cathedral is a marvel though, one of the best in the UK I think.

― Tim (Tim), Monday, 22 December 2003 09:48 (twenty-one years ago)

you know I don't go big on that sort of thing. Strangely enough, Chesterfield have Peterborough at home on Boxing day (as seems to happen a lot) Our wacky church is better than theirs.

― chris (chris), Monday, 22 December 2003 09:51 (twenty-one years ago)

tell me more about cornwall! My mom is planning a trip there as it's where our family comes from. We come from the lizard penninsula, does that mean I'm a lizard?

Cornwall

― Matt (Matt), Monday, 22 December 2003 09:51 (twenty-one years ago)

for what it's worth there weren't any lashings of ginger beer to be seen, although I can see how it all blurs into one in this era of accelerated cultural proletarianisation.

Hurrah! I'm a pleb! Despite having been to Trebizon-type school, I'm the poster-child for accelerated cultural proletarianisation. I'm glad my life now has some meaning.

Actually I have never read the Trebizon books as I was so disappointed that my school wasn't like Mallory Towers / The Chalet School that I gave up on the genre. I must read these books now and sneer at their wrongheadedness, as I was very much sneered upon for liking "weird music" and daddy not having an estate (actually, was laughed at for his Morris Marina estate, but I'm not sure that's quite the same), and was pretty much the definition of frowned-upon scholarship girl.

― ailsa (ailsa), Monday, 22 December 2003 10:33 (twenty-one years ago)

I have been to Ripon! Lightwater Valley next door innit.

Ladies and gennelmun, I give you... Congleton

― j0e (j0e), Monday, 22 December 2003 10:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Is Congleton a City? It's more of a one horse town surely? A nowheresville between the somewhere of Derbyshire and the somewhere of Cheshire/Manchester

Yes, I've been there.

― chris (chris), Monday, 22 December 2003 10:51 (twenty-one years ago)

agh. city. I will go away and think about what I've done.

― j0e (j0e), Monday, 22 December 2003 10:58 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, I've been to Truro, gosh Robin, you've got a good memory. I've also been to Peterborough. I found it extremely odd, like a British-based David Lynch film.

Has anyone here been to Carlisle?

― Anna (Anna), Monday, 22 December 2003 12:44 (twenty-one years ago)

I have been to Carlisle. It was cold.

― Ricardo (RickyT), Monday, 22 December 2003 12:47 (twenty-one years ago)

Yes to Carlisle, many times. I have a particularly soft spot for the cathedral.

― David (David), Monday, 22 December 2003 12:49 (twenty-one years ago)

Peterborough is suprisingly feral!

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Monday, 22 December 2003 12:49 (twenty-one years ago)

Carlisle is cold, isn't it. It's got a lovely cathedral though, with a very shortened bit at the top (I can't believe I've forgotten all my terminology from Medieval history, it was only 10 years ago. ten years?!)

― Vicky (Vicky), Monday, 22 December 2003 12:50 (twenty-one years ago)

The nave was partially demolished during the Civil War so that part is short. The Choir and east window are wonderful though. The tower is 110 feet high.

― David (David), Monday, 22 December 2003 12:51 (twenty-one years ago)

The nave, that's the fella! I got to see an amazing painted ceiling in one of the surrounding buildings, maybe it was the bishop's house.

― Vicky (Vicky), Monday, 22 December 2003 13:14 (twenty-one years ago)

I know the one you mean though I've not been in; Prior somebody or other. Prior Slee popped into my head but I've checked and that's the gateway tower. The painted ceiling in the choir is also very nice.

― David (David), Monday, 22 December 2003 13:21 (twenty-one years ago)

I've never been to the North East of England, other than driving down from Edinburgh to London. Vast swathes of the North East are unknown to me, bordered by a rough arc from Cockermouth in the north-west to Nottingham in the south.

I've been to Peterborough dozens of times. Is it really that bad?

― Markelby (Mark C), Monday, 22 December 2003 13:33 (twenty-one years ago)

If you have been there 'dozens of times' I think you are qualified to answer that Markus!

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Monday, 22 December 2003 13:46 (twenty-one years ago)

Who is this Markus of whom you speak?

― Lasagne Police (RickyT), Monday, 22 December 2003 14:10 (twenty-one years ago)

It's a fair cop guv!

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Monday, 22 December 2003 14:11 (twenty-one years ago)

I've never been to any of them, if that helps.

― Curt1s St3ph3ns, Monday, 22 December 2003 17:33 (twenty-one years ago)

Peterborough is a lovely place. During the time I lived nearby, an incident in a car park one Saturday afternoon (he claimed I had stolen *his* space) lead to some local tough taking his keys to my car & leaving a scratch to the metal along the length of it.

Cathedral is good, great views of it from the main road coming into the city.

― Mooro (Mooro), Monday, 22 December 2003 18:20 (twenty-one years ago)

I've had chips in Carlisle.

― Ed (dali), Monday, 22 December 2003 18:23 (twenty-one years ago)

is Carlisle actually a city though? always thought it was only a town ... I've been there, same time as I was in North Yorkshire.

ailsa I find it hard to imagine the Trebizon girls listening to what would have been called "weird" music, but one can at least imagine them listening to Five Star or Curiosity Killed The Cat or somesuch, whereas one can't imagine the girls in boarding school stories written in 1960 listening to Adam Faith, or indeed anything other than classical music. that's the difference. you should remember that if the last 25 years' redefinition of the middle class in popcultural terms had not happened, Dido would never have taken up pop music as a career, and Phil Collins' "... But Seriously" would never have existed either. you may find yourself yearning for old-fashioned Tory landowning snobbery as a result of that fact.

― robin carmody (robin carmody), Tuesday, 23 December 2003 04:04 (twenty-one years ago)

incidentally being sneered at for listening to "weird music" is hardly the territory of the posh (I know you're not suggesting it is); an Oasis/boyband-dominated comprehensive in the mid-90s was possibly even less tolerant of a Tindersticks fan than a boarding school would have been ...

― robin carmody (robin carmody), Tuesday, 23 December 2003 04:05 (twenty-one years ago)

If you tolerate Tindersticks then what exactly does come next?

― N. (nickdastoor), Tuesday, 23 December 2003 09:55 (twenty-one years ago)

...bordered by a rough arc from Cockermouth in the north-west...

i take it dan's on holiday/away from his computer then?

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Tuesday, 23 December 2003 10:11 (twenty-one years ago)

is Carlisle actually a city though?

According to this page:

http://www.ezresult.com/article/Cities_of_the_United_Kingdom,
Carlisle is one of a number of places whose status as a city dates from 'time immemorial'. I'm still confused though. St. David's, for example, is little more than a village but has its cathedral and hence calls itself a city, which goes down well with the tourists. But it doesn't have the 'time immemorial' designation (nowhere in Wales does except Bangor, according to that page) and I see it was actually granted official city status in 1994 and I don't understand why (it's not an administrative centre).

― David (David), Tuesday, 23 December 2003 23:46 (twenty-one years ago)

also note the non-inclusion of St Asaph in that list. Blackburn, incidentally, has an Anglican cathedral but AFAIK has never been a city - maybe the cathedral is a recent foundation? Hull seems to be by far the longest-established city without a cathedral.

in some cases one can measure a change in status by the name of the football team - ie Swansea became a city in 1969 (probably to do with the Prince of Wales' investiture), Swansea Town FC became Swansea City in 1970. in Carlisle's case it's no help, though, because the team is called Carlisle United ...

― robin carmody (robin carmody), Wednesday, 24 December 2003 03:53 (twenty-one years ago)

I thought that it was no longer the case where a city needed to have a cathedral?

― Ste (Fuzzy), Wednesday, 24 December 2003 09:33 (twenty-one years ago)

I thought that it was no longer the case where a city needed to have a cathedral?

That is true, of course, for new designations. I was just confused as to why there would be a need to classify St. David's officially as a city in 1994 (whereas Carlisle, Canterbury etc. have no official classification but are instead recognised as such 'from time immemorial'). St. David's is a very old foundation but I suppose it must be a diocesan administrative thing with it not coming under the Church of England until later (when Wales ceased to be independent).
This would explain why other Welsh places have no 'ancient cathedral -> city status' (but why is Bangor an exception to that?). That page seems to have disappeared now btw.

Blackburn Cathedral is a former parish church built 1820-26. It was created a cathedral in 1926 (so a new 'industrial' diocese). That would explain that one.

― David (David), Wednesday, 24 December 2003 11:43 (twenty-one years ago)

also remember that the Anglican church has been disestablished in Wales for decades - even before the Incredible String Band thing emerged, the fact that he came from the disestablished Church in Wales was much remarked upon as a distinguishing factor between Rowan Williams and the majority of Anglican conservatives - so maybe St David's and, for that matter, St Asaph are not automatically cities because the church is not bound up with the state?

Blackburn, ah yes - the population around there had grown so massively that it was doubtless necessary to create new dioceses, the Church's equivalent of the parliamentary Reform Acts which removed the antiquated situation in the early part of the Industrial Revolution where Manchester had one MP and some rural areas had two.

― robin carmody (robin carmody), Wednesday, 24 December 2003 18:41 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.holdthefrontpage.co.uk/campaigns/2003/05may/030527mace.shtml

"Since Croydon is Europe's largest town, but has never been honoured with city status, we thought it would be interesting to do a compare and contrast with somewhere completely different. "

Robin, Should Croydon get City Status?

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Wednesday, 24 December 2003 18:46 (twenty-one years ago)

it is within the local government area of a city already - the resentment from beyond the M25 would be a bad thing for London's reputation with the rest of the country, I think. making Reading into a city might be a better choice if the south-east needs another one, because I always thought it was the biggest place left as a town (Wolverhampton is bigger, but it became a city in 2000). long-term, I can also envisage Bournemouth and Poole getting together for a similar bid to the successful Brighton and Hove one.

― robin carmody (robin carmody), Wednesday, 24 December 2003 19:51 (twenty-one years ago)

yes, good shout out for Reading - the next City Status awards will be in 2010?

Milton Keynes could become an official city - as it will have a massive population by then.

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Wednesday, 24 December 2003 20:03 (twenty-one years ago)

they tend to be to do with royal anniversaries, I'm afraid to say (2000 was the millennium), so probably 2012 (Diamond Jubilee) assuming the Queen is still alive - Derby in 1977 was for the Silver Jubilee, Sunderland in 1992 for the Ruby one (and Annus Horribilis, as we know), the 2002 cities for the Golden.

― robin carmody (robin carmody), Wednesday, 24 December 2003 20:22 (twenty-one years ago)

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