ts: buffy season 2 vs. buffy season 3

another thing I like about the show is that stuff that even the more novelty-type episodes like that one always have stuff that figures into the season's plot arcs.

I have a crackpot theory that the guy who wrote The Zeppo is actually Darin Morgan, who wrote the four best send-up episodes of The X-Files.

My favourite end-of-show scene is Giles walking into a tree in the episode where Buffy becomes psychic. Also all hail Band Candy, with the adults-as-teenagers.

Season Two I think has some of my favorites, like Passion and the two-part season finale. But Season 3 has some damn good shit in it. And more Oz! And willow has better hair. 'cause then you get the Vampire Willow episode. and the Graduation episode. And the prom episode that made me cry when they gave out the special award.

I recently watched Season 4 again and I have to say it's better than I remembered it. I really love the first few episodes with Buffy and her annoying roommate Kathy, who loves Celine Dion and plays the VH1 Divas all day and night.

oh, another favorite would be the thanksgiving episode. "Buffy, Xander is in real danger. Do you think the solution is pie?"

In one scene Angel wears a Hawaiian shirt!

And the episode where Spike shows up for the ring of allmora or whatever it is (after the episode on season 4 of buffy) is hysterical at the beginning. Spike is standing on a rooftop watching Angel save some girl from peril and he narrates. "Away to the Angelmobile! I must get more of that poncey hair gel I like *so* much."
CLASSIC.

what are our thoughts on buffy season 5, now available in video stores?

this show sucks. sorry, but it needed to be said.

Dawn is very very very bad.

I don't like the last two seasons because it seemed to just limp along. No Giles? Phooey! And that last season just pissed me off. It was episode after episode of boring speeches, self-righteous "Buffy you don't know what you're doing even though you've been saving our useless scooby asses for six years now" and then a crapass ending. Faith busting out of jail was on Angel and that was like, the best part. They didn't even bother to tie up six seasons of loose ends. You'd think there would have been a little more hustle invested in ending the series properly.

I think if there was a single major problem later on it was that they let story arcs rise to prominence and then *stay* prominent for far too long. For example the Angel going bad arc is very powerful, but it actually only lasted, what, 9 episodes? And the Mayor likewise stayed mostly in the background for over half of season 3, despite having been foreshadowed as a big bad as early as mid-season 2 (I think). If there was a "slog" element to seasons six and seven, it was I suspect largely due to the plots taking too long to resolve themselves. The potential slayers plot, for example, could have been introduced quite a bit later into season 7 than it was with little harm done. Mind, Caleb arrived only just before the end, but ironically that actually felt *jarring* because the First's prominence as big bad had been rammed home since ep 1 of the season.

Generally, whereas, in seasons 2 and 3 there were really organic shifts in mood and theme over the course of the season as a whole, in the last two seasons the basic themes were the same from first ep to the last.

Plus of course the humour wasn't so evenly spread and was concentrated into single episodes, meaning proceedings could become a bit unrelentingly grim at time. That said they still roxored.

how good is it to watch season 3 again?

and yeah, Xander is a sanctimonious prick. just watched the Miss Post episode in season 3 where Xander's all Let's Kill Angel. What the hell was his deal? He never got that way over Oz or anyone else that the girls opted to date instead of him.

dammit.

There's also a significant decrease in Willow and Buffy Time, which I think leads to Willow's wiccan habit and Buffy's relationship with Spike.

I actually think that, considering how intrinsically annoying her character is supposed to be, Dawn was handled fairly well. Her evolution from season 5 to season 7 is fairly convincing, especially as her overwraughtness was toned-down for the last season and the last stages of the evolution were largely in the background.

(and buffy w/o giles is just WEIRD)

There was Giles' house, the Magic Box, and then only the house for S7.

I think the house in season 7 is supposed to represent the claustrophobia and insulation that Buffy and the Baby Slayers are feeling. Besides, the town was going to shit around them, supposedly; I'm sure in terms of sets they were saving all their money for the video game stylee animation of the Final Destruction of Sunnydale.

And Dawn was less annoying in S7 but that's probably because she was completely shoved to the background. Although the episode where she thought she was maybe going to be a slayer was really good (despite it being all about her). Xander's comment at the end almost made me cry. (Okay, it made me tear! Shut up! Gawwwwd.)

Willow - "Right there with you."

And then later when Spike stops Buffy from launching a missle at the principal. good stuff.

(also - wasn't the fantastic 'Hush' ep in S5 ?)

-- fiddo centington (dubplatestyl...), January 5th, 2004 2:51 PM. (dubplatestyle) (later) (link)

Once again, Jess pops in and proves for no reason at all that he is genetically incapbable of doing anything except peeing on other peoples' shoes.

Also, this show got me thru a rough patch a few years back, since I had just lost my job & moved home to the parents' basement for a few months. FX started rerunning it, so my unemployment consisted of Buffy, playing games that i got offa Kazaa, drinking 20oz's of Mountain Dew, and gaining 20 lbs back.

plus, the Velveeta Cheese dude from the dream ep was killer.

Personally, I'm a major Buffy fan--however, even when the show is at its best, I still think the parts are greater than the whole. I think that's best illustrated by S2, which only sort-of hangs together, but contains some of the series' best stand-out moments and episodes (particularly "Surprise," "Birthday," "Passion," and "Becoming Pt. 2"). As a whole, I think S3 is a better construction (although there are still bits that are totally stupid- I think "Faith, Hope and Trick," and "Homecoming" are pretty much generic disposable tv, and how did Angel get back from hell again exactly?). Buffy requires just as much retconning and disbelief suspension as any other fantasy/sci-fi universe in order to render it remotely sensical ("you see, Spike's got this chip and it sort-of goes off whenever he tries to hurt someone, except someone who's a demon, or recently back from the dead, or if he's just pretending, or if he's just mad and thinks about hurting someone . . . and actually it doesn't really go off until he has actually hurt someone, so how's it triggered again?"), but it's miles better than most other live-action tv, and took risks most "quality" shows wouldn't even consider.

I'm a big Buffy fan, but this didn't bother me -- he's entitled to his opinion.

Echo! (Then again I talked more elsewhere.)

BTW, Nicole's nick in this thread is the best name evah, etc.

Yes, and Anya relaxedly munching popcorn!

(not that anyone HAS, neccessarily, but I have the feeling that this is where we're going)

even when you factor in all the slightly annoying elements (buffy/angel breakup being stretched out for years, xander/cordelia snipping unamusingly at each other for decades, wesley not particularly adding anything to the show), this was the best season ever. it not only had the best xander episode (you know the one) and the best willow episode ("dopplegangland" - the scene where they think willow is dead always chokes me up), it had the best villain buffy ever faced. mayor wilkins was the ONLY villain of the entire series (apart from maybe evil willow) who was actually scary. he was scary because, well, as buffy said, "i didn't get the bad guy vibe off him." it would've been so easy to have him turn out to be faking his love for faith - you know the routine: he was using her all along, she's the first to go when he ascends, blah blah blah. the fact that he's NOT faking it was a stroke of genius. i actually felt sorry for him at the end, weird as it sounds.

i'm not really looking forward to season 4 so much (sitting through riley, adam and the initiative again is REALLY going to be a chore, even if we do get anya and the return of faith), but i'm looking forward to watching it side-by-side with season 1 of angel (which i haven't seen much of yet).

great throwaway moment: xander and oz argue over the exact nature of kryptonite.

the books of ascension: very powerful works, and i'm not talking about the prose

OH MY GOD IT'S TIME FOR THE CHEERLEADER PYRAMID AT MIDFIELD I GOTTA GO. NO YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND I HAVE TO GO I'M THE APEX

the only structurally unnecessary part of the pyramid lol