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On how many American networks can you actually say "fuck" and "shit", and see gay people shagging?

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I was just wondering - where I'm from (Denmark), there's no beeping out any language in the media. You can say "shit, bitch, fuck, dick, ass, ho, cunt, dirty bitch, low motherfucker, nigga, hooker, slut, tramp, dirty low slut-tramp-bitch-ho, nigga fuck shit, whatever...", to quote our friend Ice-T. I realize that there's a thing called HBO (who produces 'Six Feet Under', hence the subject line of this thread') but on which other networks do producers and script writers have that same freedom?

― Jay Kid (Jay K), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 11:03 (twenty-two years ago)

Dude 1: Fuck
Dude 2: Shit
Dudes 3 and 4 : Do you mind, we're shagging here...

― mark grout (mark grout), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 11:06 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah yeah, i know, but seriously???

― Jay Kid (Jay K), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 11:11 (twenty-two years ago)

HBO also makes Sex & the City which has quite a bit of swearage. No idea about the others. In the UK you can say pretty much everything if it's late enough in the evening. The 9 o'clock watershed is kind of an unwritten (I think) boundary, but I think it needs to be past 10pm for a cunt.

― Madchen (Madchen), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 11:15 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.weinreder.com/david_bowie/images/later_with_jools_holland.jpg

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 11:22 (twenty-two years ago)

He's always on WAAAAAAAAAAY past 10pm.

― Sick Nouthall (Nick Southall), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 11:26 (twenty-two years ago)

among the BROADCAST networks, none. On cable channels, I dunno, there's thousands of channels and a good portion will show unedited movies.

― teeny (teeny), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 11:43 (twenty-two years ago)

abc, cbs, fox, the wb, and upn are the only ones under fcc jurisdiction so in theory any of the 9732 other channels could be fuckfests and shitstorms. generally though only ad free cable channels (hbo, cinemax, showtime, the movie channel (does this still exist?), starz, encore, sundance, ifc, um, whichever other ones i'm forgetting) feel free to have cussin, though comedy central lets the south park guys get away with it when they want to (and airs south park: bigger, longer, uncut uncut) and turner classics airs everything uncut, though tends to shy away from post-hays code stuff (more for aesthetic reasons than avoiding cussin or nudity). i think maaaybe usa used to let some things slip back in the day with 'usa up all nite'. maybe.

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 11:51 (twenty-two years ago)

the only thing preventing gay shagging from being on network tv is cowardice. i think the closest it's gotten is still that fucking thirtysomething episode.

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 11:53 (twenty-two years ago)

Did I hear Janet Jackson got bleeped for saying Jesus the other night?

― Madchen (Madchen), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 12:07 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, that's right.

There have been a couple of same-sex kisses on network tv.

― teeny (teeny), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 12:22 (twenty-two years ago)

CBC had Kids in the Hall, which is about as close to same sex relations seen on tv at the time.
As probably mentioned on the cancon threads, our CRTC is much more realistic then the FCC and allows for swearing under several circumstances. But its generally kept clean over the airwaves till nightime. CITY (who went on to found MuchMusic and 10 or 20 other channels) kinda broke the taboo by showing soft p0rn late night back in the 70s. And again recently starting sometime in the late 90s.
Cable only channels like Bravo and Showcase seem to operate under a different set of rules though.

― Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 12:31 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, right now the networks and pretty much anything under fcc jurisdiction are freaking the fuck out cuz our govt's been hijacked by some taliban motherfuckers

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 12:33 (twenty-two years ago)

Pretty much. And now the fcc is talking about regulating cable channels as well.

― El Diablo Robotico (Nicole), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 13:29 (twenty-two years ago)

WHOA! I would love to hear how the FFC can regulate something that is a PAID SERVICE. And, shit, there's already the V-Chip, right? EDR, you have any linkage to back up this claim?

― David R. (popshots75`), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 13:41 (twenty-two years ago)

the FCC already regulates the telephone industry, also a paid service.

― teeny (teeny), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 13:42 (twenty-two years ago)

NYPD Blue has language that wouldn't ordinarily make it on a broadcast network. It's aired after a certain hour, has disclaimers, and despite it's attempt at reality has very fake dialog.

You'd be making a mistake to blame this entirely on the FCC. The administration doesn't act in a vacuum. Janet Jackson started a firestorm because so many people complained. Also, the broadcast networks are extremely reactionary and cowardly. There aren't hard and fast rules detailing what can and can't be shown/said on TV. This is one thing that makes it hard. If it's "indecent" you're not supposed to show it. Indecent has to do with intent and not with content.

Saying that the gov't's been hijacked by some taliban motherfuckers is hardly representative. Actually, taste in this country are far from uniform and there are a lot of people who support the administration, esp. in these kinds of areas. So is representative gov't is akin to the Taliban, well, okay.

The thing to watch is whether the admisistration is reinstalled in November. If it is. . .

Also, it's not like other administrations have run this any differently. Michael Powell was appointed to the FCC by Clinton. Bush elevated him to Chairman.

"These guys are just facists." Maybe, like the people who vote for them.

― Skottie, Wednesday, 31 March 2004 13:43 (twenty-two years ago)

maybe I'm missing the point of your point, mr popshots--every industry is regulated by the government!

― teeny (teeny), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 13:44 (twenty-two years ago)

You can occasionally hear 'fuck' and 'shit' on PBS of all places. Usually when it's said on PBS it's in one of those 'graphic' documentaries.

I heard it on C-SPAN, too - when people were chanting 'Fuck Bush' at a demonstration.

― Kerry (dymaxia), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 13:54 (twenty-two years ago)

From the Wall Street Journal:

As Congress and the Federal Communications Commission ponder cracking down on the airing of indecent material on broadcast television, they are turning their attention to a heretofore sacrosanct medium: cable. In a letter sent to the cable industry's largest trade group and reviewed by The Wall Street Journal, FCC Chairman Michael Powell challenged cable companies to voluntarily clean up their act.

While crediting the cable industry for providing TV viewers with a wealth of new programming choices, Mr. Powell said it also "has given rise to more opportunities for the worst programming to invade our living rooms." In his letter to Robert Sachs, president of the National Cable and Telecommunications Association in Washington, Mr. Powell noted that while "much of the focus has been on broadcast programming, I believe the cable industry cannot completely ignore the discontent."

Which sounds like a threat to me, anyway.

― El Diablo Robotico (Nicole), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 13:55 (twenty-two years ago)

the OTHER Powell is just a stable boy for the Bush admin like his brother... this will blow over in a few months...

― Regposter (ModJ), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 14:10 (twenty-two years ago)

Definitely not enough of them, in my opinion.

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 14:13 (twenty-two years ago)

It's funny that you can hear cussin' and see boobies on Canada's two stodgiest national networks, CBC and CTV, but Global, the free enterprise, Fox-loving, upstart from Wpg is pretty clean. Except for their late-night phone-sex infomercials.

― The Huckle-Buck (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 14:15 (twenty-two years ago)

I have heard "shit" and "fuckwad" on NBC, but I think those days are over.

I've heard "fuck" on C-SPAN, too!

― tokyo rosemary (rosemary), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 14:23 (twenty-two years ago)

fuckwad? was that on Becker? (is that even NBC?)

― The Huckle-Buck (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 14:23 (twenty-two years ago)

fuckwad was on a law & order episode a while back

(dickweed was on svu last night!)

and yes, even though you're paying for them, most of the non-premium cable networks -- with the exceptions of ifc, tcm, and sundance -- blur and bleep. it would seem that there is a correlation between commercials and censorship. (it's yet another reason that trio, while great in theory, is so utterly disappointing in practice. i mean, how can you watch an edited version of HEAVY METAL PARKING LOT?? i ask you.)

― maura (maura), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 14:35 (twenty-two years ago)

maura OTf*****gM about Trio. Like, don't make a big deal about your "Uncensored Comedy" and "Too Hot For TV" months if you bleep out the word "penis", ok??

― tokyo rosemary (rosemary), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 14:38 (twenty-two years ago)

oh man i missed dickweed on svu! this morning everyone was 'gee i wonder what case they based that episode on'

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 14:41 (twenty-two years ago)

Not only did they say dickweed, they typed it!

I love when they have the internet on Law and Order.

― tokyo rosemary (rosemary), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 14:53 (twenty-two years ago)

Buffy used to regularly have Spike and Giles say things like bollocks and wanker, which Americans apparently had no problem with, but seem much ruder this side of the Atlantic.
There was even somebody called Thomas Wanker metioned every week in the credits. I was never sure if this was a joke or if somebody of this name really exists.

― Joe Kay (feethurt), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 15:10 (twenty-two years ago)

the OTHER Powell is just a stable boy for the Bush admin like his brother

Actually, Michael is Colin's son.

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 15:13 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, i hate it when racists can't get their facts straight

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 15:15 (twenty-two years ago)

They were so missing the opportunity to call him John Thomas Wanker.

― suzy (suzy), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 15:16 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah and last week on 'the daily show,' lewis black said 'shite' and 'fookin.' i mean, come on...

― maura (maura), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 15:20 (twenty-two years ago)

What about penises? They seem to be last taboo in American mainstream TV and movies, not counting Boogie Nights.

― Tuomas (Tuomas), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:20 (twenty-two years ago)

I think there's some rule (not kidding) that it's okay to show prosthetic caque. Not on TV, but in the movies.

― The Huckle-Buck (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:24 (twenty-two years ago)

Are you saying there's a rule that forbids showing real penises?

― Tuomas (Tuomas), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:28 (twenty-two years ago)

I don't think I've ever seen an erect penis in an American movie that wasn't a porno.

― teeny (teeny), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:30 (twenty-two years ago)

what about vaginae? not just femail pubic hare, but actual labium?

― The Huckle-Buck (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:32 (twenty-two years ago)

That's not a rule, though; the MPAA has few (if any?) actual static rules for its ratings, which is exactly what people keep complaining about.

(And I think non-erect penises are only a little less common than full frontal female nudity.)

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:32 (twenty-two years ago)

Hmm, I don't think show, horror movies for example often show full frontal female nudity, but rarely do we see even limp penises.

― Tuomas (Tuomas), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:36 (twenty-two years ago)

re: fuckwad

forreal? i remember josh and i having a doubletake at something like this.

― g--ff (gcannon), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:37 (twenty-two years ago)

Bad Lieutenant, The Piano, that Tom Cruise movie, Wild Things ...

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:37 (twenty-two years ago)

okay, but Harvey Keitel's wang is screwing with the averages.

― The Huckle-Buck (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:39 (twenty-two years ago)

And I wouldn't say horror movies "often" show full frontal female nudity; the straight to video ones might, but mainstream horror?

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:39 (twenty-two years ago)

Teeny, I think my point was a non-point birthed from ign'ance and bad sleep habits. Carry on, y'all.

Yeah, I think showing a penis in its non-erect state (Short Cuts!) is doing a grave disservice to the power and glory of the male member. In its normal flaccid state, it's really nothing more than a stout stubby catheter. And on that note, I'll hush & go back to work.

― David R. (popshots75`), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:40 (twenty-two years ago)

there was an ny'er bit on tv swearing like a year ago. it's based on ratings, surprise! writers from [er i forget, 3rd watch?] wanted more 'ass,' censors say no, writers say 'b-but there were 4 asses on nypd blue!' and censors say 'yr not nypd blue'

― g--ff (gcannon), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:41 (twenty-two years ago)

I'd still say the female full frontal nudity - male full frontal nudity ratio definitely isn't 50:50, more like 90:10 in favour(?) of women.

― Tuomas (Tuomas), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:44 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, but with women, full frontal only shows the pubic hair, so, like, big effin' deal, huh?

― The Huckle-Buck (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:45 (twenty-two years ago)

Well, you'd have to zoom a lot more with women than with men. I don't think this is a valid point; women don't probably feel less nude because you can't easily see their actual genitalia.

― Tuomas (Tuomas), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:51 (twenty-two years ago)

(This has got to be the silliest argument I've had in ages.)

― Tuomas (Tuomas), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:51 (twenty-two years ago)

When did it become about "feeling" nude?

I just think there's some hilariously flawed reasoning when it comes to nakedness standards. Like you show a whole boob as long as you don't show the nipple. The nipple automatically makes it dirty, but really, for visual purpose at least, the nipple is the least interesting part of a breast.

― The Huckle-Buck (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 17:57 (twenty-two years ago)

It is?

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 18:00 (twenty-two years ago)

visually, yeah. for tactile purposes, nuh-uh, but y'know...I don't know.

― The Huckle-Buck (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 31 March 2004 18:02 (twenty-two years ago)

I don't think I've ever seen an erect penis in an American movie that wasn't a porno.

Then you haven't seen the café blow job scene of 'In The Cut'. Except that I think that it is a dildo. But very life-like, I might add.

― Jay Kid (Jay K), Thursday, 1 April 2004 14:40 (twenty-two years ago)

I watched Boogie Nights on network TV once, and during the final famous scene, a huge black bar appeared that totally obscured the actual penis, but it was casting a shadow on the wall that was really clear and all the more noticeable for the censorship.

― sgs (sgs), Thursday, 1 April 2004 15:06 (twenty-two years ago)

Like you show a whole boob as long as you don't show the nipple. The nipple automatically makes it dirty, but really, for visual purpose at least, the nipple is the least interesting part of a breast.

That still doesn't explain the Janet Jackson incident.

― Girolamo Savonarola, Thursday, 1 April 2004 16:51 (twenty-two years ago)

Lil Kim got away with it.

― The Huckle-Buck (Horace Mann), Thursday, 1 April 2004 16:57 (twenty-two years ago)

So how does network tv get away with showing un-edited versions of Schnidlers List and Saving Private Ryan. I guess since it's historical its considered 'ok' to say fuck, and have full frontal nudity along with extremely graphic violence. but I don't understand who decides its ok and to what extent the networks work with the FCC to decide when it is 'proper' to show tabboo items and when it is not. Does anyone know?

― coytheman, Wednesday, 14 April 2004 16:44 (twenty-two years ago)

I think the FCC works almost entirely on the volume of complaints.

― Chris H. (chrisherbert), Wednesday, 14 April 2004 17:12 (twenty-two years ago)

We should have a call-in/write-in campaign where we all file complaints that we're not hearing "motherfucker" enough on Everybody Loves Raymond.

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 14 April 2004 17:14 (twenty-two years ago)

three months pass...
REVIVE!

― Revivalist (Revivalist), Monday, 19 July 2004 11:15 (twenty-one years ago)


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