tariq ali (attn mark s)

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i'm reading his newish book called the clash of fundementalisms, and i like it enough, but i wonder how much i should trust his history of islam, and where i can get a solid, bias free, history of same (i know nothing is bias free, im looking for something dry and factual, think britianica) and also a good primer(s) on the history of the foundation of islam.

also, tariq ali cd/sd ?

anthony, Thursday, 12 August 2004 13:37 (twenty-one years ago)

Dud, unfortunately

Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 12 August 2004 13:38 (twenty-one years ago)

Qualify that? He gets mad props for starting Verso, at least from me.

Stuff by Ziauddin Sardar is always thoughtful.

suzy (suzy), Thursday, 12 August 2004 13:40 (twenty-one years ago)

verso ?

anthony, Thursday, 12 August 2004 13:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Verso, the publishers...

suzy (suzy), Thursday, 12 August 2004 13:46 (twenty-one years ago)

Verso is fine, but hardly infallible. I read his autobiog 'Street-fighting Years'. It's alright, but not very rigorous (Sheila Rowbotham's is much better as a guide to the rad-left of the late Sixties), and like his sparring partner Christopher Hitchens he has a mandarin view of pop culture, and a Pilger/Pinter-ish tendency to (TM mark s) paranoid dalek speak. He's also very much about left-calabrity, ooh Rudi Dutchke was in my flat, that kind of thing. He's okay though. Props for Black Dwarf, 'political' underground mag in the late Sixties.

ENRG, Thursday, 12 August 2004 13:48 (twenty-one years ago)

It could be worse tho, he could be Vanessa Redgrave

Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 12 August 2004 13:53 (twenty-one years ago)

them's is bezzies. they were in the worker's revolutionary party together. i like VR, as an actress AND as a leading member of the revolutionary avant-garde.

ENRG, Thursday, 12 August 2004 13:55 (twenty-one years ago)

She's fucking awful at both

Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 12 August 2004 13:57 (twenty-one years ago)

admittedly the revolution eluded her, but i can't fault the acting.

ENRG, Thursday, 12 August 2004 14:01 (twenty-one years ago)

The only convincing performances of her career were in Morecambe & Wise Christmas Specials

Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 12 August 2004 14:05 (twenty-one years ago)

she was SUBVERTING the format seen?

ENRG, Thursday, 12 August 2004 14:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Eric Morecambe beat her to it

Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 12 August 2004 14:08 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.npg.org.uk/education/facepack/images/photos/large/x6394.JPG

ENRG, Thursday, 12 August 2004 14:13 (twenty-one years ago)

You can't see Tariq's short fat hairy legs in that pic

Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 12 August 2004 14:30 (twenty-one years ago)

mark, ask tariq what the fuck's happening with my book!

Marcello Carlin, Friday, 13 August 2004 06:10 (twenty-one years ago)

is mark reading the board anymore?

|a|m|t|r|s|t| (amateurist), Friday, 13 August 2004 06:19 (twenty-one years ago)

He's also very much about left-calabrity, ooh Rudi Dutchke was in my flat, that kind of thing

Calabrity? Presumably that's a celebrity who brings calamity. 'Ooh, Rudi Dutchke was in my flat and he broke the shower head and clooged the drain with shed head hair and now the squat downstairs hates our guts...'

Momus (Momus), Friday, 13 August 2004 06:40 (twenty-one years ago)

mark, what is happening with kym from hearsay's career!! is the second album ever coming out!??

: - D

doomie x, Friday, 13 August 2004 06:41 (twenty-one years ago)

i hope 'clooged' will now be adopted as per standard ILX typo policy

Snowy Mann (rdmanston), Friday, 13 August 2004 12:21 (twenty-one years ago)

It's not Scots?

Rockist_Scientist (rockist_scientist), Saturday, 14 August 2004 14:15 (twenty-one years ago)

seventeen years pass...

Does anyone have a history of verso books, like a piece I could read on the publisher? I thought of them as very crusty left (Tariq Ali, which I guess was new left) but over the years they are publishing a lot of really great sounding books on sex work, borders, etc. and they have just established an union too.

xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 27 July 2022 08:44 (three years ago)

No history, but in a nutshell: interesting start, but became thoroughly assimilated into the Spectacular Commodity Economy, then in the 2000s derailed after contact with long-standing wider ilx members led to a disastrous adoption of a ‘poptimism’ approach to critical theory.

^^disclaimer: the above may be completely untrue

Luna Schlosser, Wednesday, 27 July 2022 09:26 (three years ago)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=veBduK_2dR8

might be useful? Haven't watched it myself. When I hear people talk about who's in charge Sebastian Budgen is usually the name that comes up, who is, if not crusty, still more of a traditional Marxist than some of their more high-profile recent titles might suggest. I guess he gives the younger editorial crew some freedom with their choices.

That establishing the union took so long and faced such resistance got me wondering who exactly was doing that pushback. Tariq Ali, union buster??

lazy rascals, spending their substance, and more, in riotous living (Merdeyeux), Wednesday, 27 July 2022 10:08 (three years ago)

idk what Tariq's involvement with Verso would be nowdays.

I will try and watch that later this week.

xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 27 July 2022 10:11 (three years ago)

lol didn't verso finally just unionise after a long struggle with management = posh-boy tariq?

i like TA's gossipy tales of upper-level politics in pakistan (where he has good family connections)

i actually did know the answer to marcello's 2004 question abt his book but of course *he* no longer reads the boards = the person who had shown an interest in it had subsquently quit (i don't recall why tho ii'm not inclined to give verso the benefit of the doubt tbh)

mark s, Wednesday, 27 July 2022 11:20 (three years ago)

Coming out from long dormancy and lurking. I'd interned in Verso's NY office and can share that Tariq had been involved in monthly editorial meetings and had some occasional involvement but was very hands off in the day to day. Sebastian is a kind of crusty Trot (depending on how you define crustiness) but he's only one of several acquiring editors there - he primarily covers their more theoretical interventions, translations from FR/IT/DE, etc.

They've got a great core of other editors as well who have been drawing in other younger writers and broadening their purview (which he, as far as I know, has been generally supportive of, even if he remains crusty).

I had no idea about the long drawn out path to unionization (just catching up now) and am genuinely surprised given what I'd known about how they'd managed the company and the, at the time, very generous (by US standards) labour conditions/contracts were. They'd seemed to walk the walk then and I'm having trouble thinking about where the resistance to unionization would have come from. Will have to look into it more deeply.

Some good historical anecdotes on the NLR/Verso in this great profile on Mike Davis by Adam Shatz. Verso evolved out of "New Left Books", the one time publishing arm of the journal - http://linguafranca.mirror.theinfo.org/9709/davis.html

Federico Boswarlos, Wednesday, 27 July 2022 19:00 (three years ago)

I feel TA has the least interesting 60s anecdotes of the various London underground papers:

Frendz - we introduced the alleged IRA gun runner Jim McCann to the hash smuggler Howard Marks, and they then formed a notorious long-term partnership that was later made into books, a film etc. Nick Kent reviewed albums.

IT - we were raided by the Police for obscenity because we carried gay lonely hearts small ads; we held famous fund raising events at the Roundhouse, and at Alexandra Palace ("the 24 Technicolour Dream") where Pink Floyd and other bands played

Black Dwarf - visiting radicals slept on sleeping bags under the desks and painted molotov cocktails on the office walls. It was a riot!

Luna Schlosser, Wednesday, 27 July 2022 19:48 (three years ago)


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