"Why conservatives must not vote for Bush"

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There have been a number of pieces like this already, linked here by others, but here's one of the latest via Salon (yeah, you have to do the day pass thing, be warned etc.)

The Bush administration is pushing military proposals that may understate defense costs by $500 billion over the coming decade. The administration lied about the likely cost of the Medicare drug benefit, which added $8 trillion in unfunded liabilities. Moreover, it declined to include in budget proposals any numbers for maintaining the occupation of Iraq or underwriting the war on terrorism. Those funds will come through supplemental appropriation bills. Never mind that Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz had promised that reconstruction of Iraq could be paid for with Iraqi resources. (Yet, despite the Bush administration's generosity, it could not find the money to expeditiously equip U.S. soldiers in Iraq with body armor.)

Nor would a second Bush term likely be different. Nothing in his convention speech suggested a new willingness by Bush to make tough choices. Indeed, when discussing their domestic agenda, administration officials complained that the media had ignored their proposals, such as $250 million in aid to community colleges for job training. Not mentioned was that Washington runs a plethora of job training programs, few of which have demonstrated lasting benefits. This is the hallmark of a limited-government conservative?

Jonah Goldberg, a regular contributor to NRO, one of Bush's strongest bastions, complains that the president has "asked for a major new commitment by the federal government to insert itself into everything from religious charities to marriage counseling." Indeed, Bush seems to aspire to be America's moralizer in chief. He would use the federal government to micromanage education, combat the scourge of steroid use, push drug testing of high school kids, encourage character education, promote marriage, hire mentors for children of prisoners and provide coaches for ex-cons.

Not that I think this will necessarily mean a defeat or anything but I'm seeing more and more of this -- and laughing quietly to myself, of course. Doublethink is a beautifully ridiculous thing in action if you're completely removed from its effects (too bad we're not). Anyway, use this thread to link in more opinion pieces as they happen, or old ones as available.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 10 September 2004 17:56 (twenty-one years ago)

"Conservatives" are not conservative

gabbneb (gabbneb), Friday, 10 September 2004 18:00 (twenty-one years ago)

well don the louis vuitton libertarion coulda told you that


xpost

cinniblount (James Blount), Friday, 10 September 2004 18:00 (twenty-one years ago)

There was a good article in latest The New Republic issue about how a lot of staffers at the Cato Institute (a libertarian think-tank that is pro "unfettered markets, minimal government, balanced budgets") are now actually recommending that those who care about fiscal conservatism would be better off voting for Kerry:

For one thing, there is a growing belief at the Institute that the Republicans--not just Bush, but the congressional leadership as well--have sold out traditional small-government conservatives, spending lavishly to woo cultural conservatives and big business... In contrast, New Democrats may not always talk the small-government talk, but Cato staffers note that, under Clinton, the Democrats reined in government spending and deregulated a broad swath of industries. "Perhaps we are being unfair to former President Clinton," wrote Cato fellow Veronique de Rugy for National Review Online in 2003, pointing out that Clinton reduced nondefense discretionary spending. At the same time, there is a more philosophical, and more cynical, pro-Kerry argument that has gained credence within the Institute--namely that the best way to limit government spending is to divide the parties' control between the executive and the legislative branches. And, given the GOP's advantage in Congress, the best way to affect such a division is to pull the lever for Kerry. In April, [Cato senior fellow Doug] Bandow outlined this view in a widely syndicated column (originally published in Fortune), arguing that "the biggest impetus for higher spending is partisan uniformity, not partisan identity." Therefore, he urged his conservative readers, "Vote Democratic."

o. nate (onate), Friday, 10 September 2004 18:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Is anyone familiar with the columnist Charley Reese? I used to read his columns and then throw the newspaper, screaming. He had an interesting column in May, though...
http://reese.king-online.com/Reese_20040521/index.php

Rock Hardy (Rock Hardy), Friday, 10 September 2004 19:28 (twenty-one years ago)

It's interesting that President Bush's policies (or his simplicity) are forcing the right to rethink the meaning of conservatism. Maybe their "talking point" on flip-flopping will backfire.

There was an interesting opinion piece in yesterday's LA Times by Lee Siegel on how liberals shouldn't let complexity be used as an epithet against them and how it shouldn't deter them from action (Commentary; Election '04: a Guide for the Complexed; Relax, it's OK for liberals to hate Bush.; [HOME EDITION]
Lee Siegel. Los Angeles Times. Los Angeles, Calif.: Sep 9, 2004. pg. B.11):

Thus liberals, in order to prove their tolerant, complex liberalism, are bending over backward to accommodate the conservatives' position, which consists, in turn, of the belief that the concept of "liberal" has been betrayed by its present-day adherents and is now synonymous with the words "radical" and "intolerant."
And so he advises:
* In matters of intellect, when you meet a contradiction, make a distinction. In politics, when you meet a contradiction, blame it on the other side. There is no intellectual beauty and little intellectual clarity in the practice of politics.
This complements P. Agre's discussion of conservatism that I linked to on another thread, which I can't find, so I'll link to it again: http://polaris.gseis.ucla.edu/pagre/conservatism.html.

youn, Friday, 10 September 2004 20:01 (twenty-one years ago)

from P. Agre's essay:
An underlying notion of conservative politics is that words and phrase of language are like territory in warfare: owned and controlled by one side or the other. [...]

George Bush, likewise, owes his election in great measure to a new language that his people engineered for him. His favorite word, for example, is "heart". This type of linguistic engineering is highly evolved in the business milieu from which conservative public relations derives, and it is the day-to-day work of countless conservative think tanks. [...]

More importantly, conservative rhetors have been systematically mapping the language that has historically been used to describe the aristocracy and the traditional authorities that serve it, and have twisted those words into terms for liberals. This tactic has the dual advantage of both attacking the aristocracies' opponents and depriving them of the words that they have used to attack aristocracy.

It looks like they have co-opted 'change' :(

youn, Tuesday, 14 September 2004 00:27 (twenty-one years ago)

Those are great quotes, youn.

You've Got to Pick Up Every Stitch (tracerhand), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 00:36 (twenty-one years ago)

"His favorite word, for example, is "heart"

From now on I'm going to picture W as a Care Bear. Yeah, interesting stuff Youn. I do think Left Wing politics, and all politics, are equally interested in treating words and phrases as weapons and battlegrounds.

Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 00:40 (twenty-one years ago)

Why do you think that?

You've Got to Pick Up Every Stitch (tracerhand), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 00:49 (twenty-one years ago)

well don the louis vuitton libertarion coulda told you that

You talkin' to me Blount?

Fuck off with the LV shit--no self-respecting billionaire like myself would stoop to such hack coutoure.

don carville weiner, Tuesday, 14 September 2004 00:57 (twenty-one years ago)

er, couture.

Conservativism was never a strong point of the Bush family, as far as I can tell.

don carville weiner, Tuesday, 14 September 2004 00:57 (twenty-one years ago)

Um, I don't know why I think (thought?) that. I guess because there are words that the left uses that gain power and resonance because of the associations they have. I'm thinking mainly of UK politics, but the New Labour attempts to gain "choice" from the Right are kind of what I am thinking of. If we accept 'PC' ideas as being Left Wing in nature, I think we could say that they too are an attempt to manipulate language within a political framework. It's just that language is incredibly important in politics, and it's use affects the way that people interpret your stance. I dunno. There's probably a lot of interesting thinking about language in politics, but none of it is coming from me. I have a headache.

Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 01:03 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, I've noticed that with "choice"

i'm not sure the "PC" thing flies as a parallel to what youn's talking about though

You've Got to Pick Up Every Stitch (tracerhand), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 01:09 (twenty-one years ago)

No, I guess not.

Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 01:09 (twenty-one years ago)

The problem with liberal politics in general is that its supporters are often too naive to accept the idea that a word can be used to mean something it really doesn't, I mean look at the way they constantly snipe at one another over absurd semantic issues. The right stomps all over the left in that category, and incidentally this is also why all overtly political rap music sucks.

TOMBOT, Tuesday, 14 September 2004 01:29 (twenty-one years ago)

Holy heck (I mean, I AM right in thinking that Keillor was always somewhat to the right of things, aren't I?)

We're Not in Lake Wobegon Anymore

By Garrison Keillor August 26, 2004

Something has gone seriously haywire with the Republican Party. Once,
it was the party of pragmatic Main Street businessmen in steel-rimmed
spectacles who decried profligacy and waste, were devoted to their
communities and supported the sort of prosperity that raises all
ships. They were good-hearted people who vanquished the gnarlier
elements of their party, the paranoid Roosevelt-haters, the flat
Earthers and Prohibitionists, the antipapist antiforeigner element.
The genial Eisenhower was their man, a genuine American hero of D-
Day, who made it OK for reasonable people to vote Republican. He
brought the Korean War to a stalemate, produced the Interstate
Highway System, declined to rescue the French colonial army in
Vietnam, and gave us a period of peace and prosperity, in which
(oddly) American arts and letters flourished and higher education
burgeoned - and there was a degree of plain decency in the country.
Fifties Republicans were giants compared to today's. Richard Nixon
was the last Republican leader to feel a Christian obligation toward
the poor.

In the years between Nixon and Newt Gingrich, the party migrated
southward down the Twisting Trail of Rhetoric and sneered at the idea
of public service and became the Scourge of Liberalism, the Great
Crusade Against the Sixties, the Death Star of Government, a gang of
pirates that diverted and fascinated the media by their sheer
chutzpah, such as the misty-eyed flag-waving of Ronald Reagan who,
while George McGovern flew bombers in World War II, took a pass and
made training films in Long Beach. The Nixon moderate vanished like
the passenger pigeon, purged by a legion of angry white men who rose
to power on pure punk politics. "Bipartisanship is another term for
date rape," says Grover Norquist, the Sid Vicious of the GOP. "I
don't want to abolish government. I simply want to reduce it to the
size where I can drag it into the bathroom and drown it in the
bathtub." The boy has Oedipal problems and government is his daddy.

The party of Lincoln and Liberty was transmogrified into the party of
hairy-backed swamp developers and corporate shills, faith-based
economists, fundamentalist bullies with Bibles, Christians of
convenience, freelance racists, misanthropic frat boys, shrieking
midgets of AM radio, tax cheats, nihilists in golf pants, brownshirts
in pinstripes, sweatshop tycoons, hacks, fakirs, aggressive dorks,
Lamborghini libertarians, people who believe Neil Armstrong's
moonwalk was filmed in Roswell, New Mexico, little honkers out to
diminish the rest of us, Newt's evil spawn and their Etch-A-Sketch
president, a dull and rigid man suspicious of the free flow of
information and of secular institutions, whose philosophy is a jumble
of badly sutured body parts trying to walk. Republicans: The No.1
reason the rest of the world thinks we're deaf, dumb and dangerous.

Rich ironies abound! Lies pop up like toadstools in the forest! Wild
swine crowd round the public trough! Outrageous gerrymandering!
Pocket lining on a massive scale! Paid lobbyists sit in committee
rooms and write legislation to alleviate the suffering of
billionaires! Hypocrisies shine like cat turds in the moonlight! O
Mark Twain, where art thou at this hour? Arise and behold the Gilded
Age reincarnated gaudier than ever, upholding great wealth as the
sure sign of Divine Grace.

Here in 2004, George W. Bush is running for reelection on a platform
of tragedy -- the single greatest failure of national defense in our
history, the attacks of 9/11 in which 19 men with box cutters put
this nation into a tailspin, a failure the details of which the White
House fought to keep secret even as it ran the country into hock up
to the hubcaps, thanks to generous tax cuts for the well-fixed,
hoping to lead us into a box canyon of debt that will render
government impotent, even as we engage in a war against a small
country that was undertaken for the president's personal satisfaction
but sold to the American public on the basis of brazen
misinformation, a war whose purpose is to distract us from an
enormous transfer of wealth taking place in this country, flowing
upward, and the deception is working beautifully.

The concentration of wealth and power in the hands of the few is the
death knell of democracy. No republic in the history of humanity has
survived this. The election of 2004 will say something about what
happens to ours. The omens are not good.

Our beloved land has been fogged with fear -- fear, the greatest
political strategy ever. An ominous silence, distant sirens, a
drumbeat of whispered warnings and alarms to keep the public uneasy
and silence the opposition. And in a time of vague fear, you can
appoint bullet-brained judges, strip the bark off the Constitution,
eviscerate federal regulatory agencies, bring public education to a
standstill, stupefy the press, lavish gorgeous tax breaks on the rich.

There is a stink drifting through this election year. It isn't the
Florida recount or the Supreme Court decision. No, it's 9/11 that we
keep coming back to. It wasn't the "end of innocence," or a turning
point in our history, or a cosmic occurrence, it was an event, a
lapse of security. And patriotism shouldn't prevent people from
asking hard questions of the man who was purportedly in charge of
national security at the time.

Whenever I think of those New Yorkers hurrying along Park Place or
getting off the No.1 Broadway local, hustling toward their office on
the 90th floor, the morning paper under their arms, I think of that
non-reader George W. Bush and how he hopes to exploit those people
with a little economic uptick, maybe the capture of Osama, cruise to
victory in November and proceed to get some serious nation-changing
done in his second term.

This year, as in the past, Republicans will portray us Democrats as
embittered academics, desiccated Unitarians, whacked-out hippies and
communards, people who talk to telephone poles, the party of the
Deadheads. They will wave enormous flags and wow over and over the
footage of firemen in the wreckage of the World Trade Center and
bodies being carried out and they will lie about their economic
policies with astonishing enthusiasm.

The Union is what needs defending this year. Government of Enron and
by Halliburton and for the Southern Baptists is not the same as what
Lincoln spoke of. This gang of Pithecanthropus Republicanii has
humbugged us to death on terrorism and tax cuts for the comfy and
school prayer and flag burning and claimed the right to know what
books we read and to dump their sewage upstream from the town and
clear-cut the forests and gut the IRS and mark up the constitution on
behalf of intolerance and promote the corporate takeover of the
public airwaves and to hell with anybody who opposes them.

This is a great country, and it wasn't made so by angry people. We
have a sacred duty to bequeath it to our grandchildren in better
shape than however we found it. We have a long way to go and we're
not getting any younger.

Dante said that the hottest place in Hell is reserved for those who
in time of crisis remain neutral, so I have spoken my piece, and
thank you, dear reader. It's a beautiful world, rain or shine, and
there is more to life than winning.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 20:41 (twenty-one years ago)

nihilists in golf pants!

teeny (teeny), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 21:14 (twenty-one years ago)

also is there room for social security/medicare in this pile-on?
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2004-09-13-medicare-costs_x.htm

teeny (teeny), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 21:16 (twenty-one years ago)

brownshirts in pinstripes

i like that one

Lt. Kingfish Del Pickles (Kingfish), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 21:21 (twenty-one years ago)

I like "aggressive dorks" and "Lamborghini libertarians" best, myself

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 21:24 (twenty-one years ago)

For as much as Keillor champions small-town values, I always assumed he was a liberal in that NPR/Salon/Utne Reader sort of way -- I mean, he makes self-deprecating jokes about being an English major.

jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 21:28 (twenty-one years ago)

does anyone know the origin of 'think tank'?

youn, Tuesday, 14 September 2004 21:32 (twenty-one years ago)

Keillor has always been a liberal and somewhat obviously so, to me at least

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 21:39 (twenty-one years ago)

i mean, he's based out of the twin cities and the upper west side

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 21:39 (twenty-one years ago)

I dunno, I remember reading a few pieces in the mid-nineties that seemed pretty socially conservative on a variety of fronts.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 21:43 (twenty-one years ago)

the midwest is pretty socially conservative. he's certainly not prudish in his writing, though.

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 21:48 (twenty-one years ago)

he used to write about sex for Salon

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 21:50 (twenty-one years ago)

*Vomits conspicuously at the very thought of GK disporting himself sexually*

Michael White (Hereward), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 22:53 (twenty-one years ago)

what's even better? imagine him NARRATING one of his sex treatises...

Lt. Kingfish Del Pickles (Kingfish), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 23:00 (twenty-one years ago)

Also until recently Minnesota Republicans (who run as Independent-Republicans) were fairly toothless, which may affect his take on them.

suzy (suzy), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 23:03 (twenty-one years ago)

until recently some Minnesota Republicans were Democrats

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 23:05 (twenty-one years ago)

the Franken-Coleman race is going to be really fun

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 23:06 (twenty-one years ago)

I think so too - and will have very good insider info when it goes on.

suzy (suzy), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 23:10 (twenty-one years ago)

i wouldn't share it

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 23:12 (twenty-one years ago)

It will depend. I am planning to talk to his bro about a book thing soon though ;-).

suzy (suzy), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 23:35 (twenty-one years ago)

Wow, that Keillor piece is a great piece of writing. Thanks for sharing Ned. While I don't necessarily agree with it all (well, the start really - is his description of the 'real' and 'good' GOP anything but a myth? He seems to strip off everyone but 5 people in the 50s...anyway), I really enjoyed that. He reminded me of Gore Vidal at times, probably just because of the 'Death of the Republic' forebodings.

But yeah, one of the best pieces of US political writing I've read for a while, if I'm not overstating things.

Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 23:53 (twenty-one years ago)

is his description of the 'real' and 'good' GOP anything but a myth? He seems to strip off everyone but 5 people in the 50s

no, he describes a lot of people in Congress who preceded Reagan and especially the Gingrich Revolution

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 23:56 (twenty-one years ago)

or, there were a lot before Reagan, but most were gone or co-opted by 98 or so

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 14 September 2004 23:59 (twenty-one years ago)

OK, cool. It wasn't a serious concern - I guess the listing style of it seemed like he was taking so many things out of the early-mid 20th Century Party that there couldn't be much left. But I guess you are right.

Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 00:00 (twenty-one years ago)

one month passes...
So there have been a few recently I've started a thread or two about, but here's one that's even better in a 'with friends like these' sense. NRO comment: "...Not the kind of endorsement the White House is likely to trumpet."

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 15 October 2004 19:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Well, at least it's honest - someone has to court the cynical callous suburban white guy vote.

Kevin, in response to your question - there are still a number of 'moderate' Republicans at the state level. In my home state of Illinois, the state GOP is well-known for its hatred of conservatives (and vice-versa). I don't think they've ever been conservative in any sense of the word, for that matter. They're just a 'pro-business' party. We had an election a few years ago in which the Democrat was more conservative than the Republican.

k3rry (dymaxia), Saturday, 16 October 2004 01:23 (twenty-one years ago)

i.e. George Ryan and Death Row

Gear! (Gear!), Saturday, 16 October 2004 01:29 (twenty-one years ago)


I'll never forget what Daley said before one controversial execution: "I'm pro-death, let's get it on."

k3rry (dymaxia), Saturday, 16 October 2004 01:46 (twenty-one years ago)

carsten daly?

darragh.mac (darragh.mac), Saturday, 16 October 2004 02:01 (twenty-one years ago)

no, carsten is the clothes guy from Queer Eye..

Sir Kingfish Beavis D'Azzmonch (Kingfish), Saturday, 16 October 2004 02:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Reading upthread I realise I still have a headache. I imagine it went away some time between then and now.

Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Saturday, 16 October 2004 02:08 (twenty-one years ago)

you imagine so? i wish i had that kind of pyschosensitive pain control ability.

can you imagine i have loads of money?

darragh.mac (darragh.mac), Saturday, 16 October 2004 02:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Richard M. Daley (aka Richard II, son of an even more powerful mayor, Richard J. Daley) is the mayor of Chicago and his crew pretty much control the state Democratic Party. Daley also used to be the State's Attorney who put a lot of those innocent guys on death row.

k3rry (dymaxia), Saturday, 16 October 2004 02:21 (twenty-one years ago)

can you imagine i have loads of money?

Sorry, the reason you don't have loads of money is because I imagined it that way. Don't worry though, wealth is a curse.

Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Saturday, 16 October 2004 02:29 (twenty-one years ago)

Various other pieces linked on the Electoral College prediction thread, but here's a new one.

I am not enamored with John Kerry, but I am frightened to death of George Bush. I fear a secret government. I abhor a government that refuses to supply the Congress with requested information. I am against a government that refuses to tell the country with whom the leaders of our country sat down and determined our energy policy, and to prove how much they want to keep that secret, they took it all the way to the Supreme Court.

Those of you who are fiscal conservatives and abhor our staggering debt, tell your conservative friends, "Vote for Kerry," because without Bush to control the Congress, the first thing lawmakers will demand Kerry do is balance the budget.

The wonderful thing about this country is its gift of citizenship, then it's freedom to register as one sees fit. For me, as a Republican, I feel that when my party gives me a dangerous leader who flouts the truth, takes the country into an undeclared war and then adds a war on terrorism to it without debate by the Congress, we have a duty to rid ourselves of those who are taking our country on a perilous ride in the wrong direction.

---

The writer, a Republican formerly of Louisville, was Jefferson County judge from 1962-1968 and U.S. senator from Kentucky from 1968-1975.

I wouldn't call this an insurrection or anything, and you're not going to see any open statement from current GOP Congressmen or governors, I'll bet, but this is starting to turn into a clearer breaking of ranks, and there's still a week and a half to go for final decisions and quite possibly public statements. The impact? Potentially minimal, but if there's enough articulation going on that those who feel they are being directly addressed -- GOP voters/members with an inclination for wonkery and reflection in equal measure -- then the results could be interesting indeed.

Also, though I've seen a couple of declared 'liberal for Bush' pieces, they've been few and far between, and the people saying them don't include any elected officials past and present from my recollection. Correct me if I'm wrong, though.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 21 October 2004 02:18 (twenty-one years ago)

i haven't seen any 'liberal for bush' pieces that actually put forth a liberal argument for bush. i've seen some that urge bush reelection to bring down the american empire, etc. etc., some cuz 'the next four years are gonna be horrible no matter who's president, better bush suffer the consequences', or just the hitchens argument, which doesn't qualify as liberal.

cinniblount (James Blount), Thursday, 21 October 2004 07:38 (twenty-one years ago)

Figured as much. So the first argument is the Marilyn Manson argument, then.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 21 October 2004 16:16 (twenty-one years ago)

Perhaps linked earlier, but if not -- Benjamin Wallace-Wells in the Washington Monthly.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 21 October 2004 17:42 (twenty-one years ago)

you're not going to see any open statement from current GOP Congressmen

Yes, but if Bush wins, Senator Richard Lugar (R-Ind.) will be squarely in the sights of Karl Rove's Fantastic Vengeance Machine (tm) for his courageous statements about the Iraq fiasco during an election year.

Aimless (Aimless), Thursday, 21 October 2004 18:30 (twenty-one years ago)

Pat Buchanan's The American Conservative magazine has refused to endorse Bush, and presents a conservative case for Kerry

gabbneb (gabbneb), Friday, 22 October 2004 16:42 (twenty-one years ago)

Foreign policy is the one topic that will reliably make Buchanan sound like a Green party candidate. The reasoning behind it is rather different, but it still comes out into the same general isolationist chickens-roosting kind of argument.

nabisco (nabisco), Friday, 22 October 2004 17:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Not new, but a pretty good overview of the Fukuyama/Krauthammer spat (in sum -- Fukuyama thinks BushCo has massively screwed up and Krauthammer is pouty in response).

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:05 (twenty years ago)

Wasn't it Burke, one of the revered touhstones of conservatives, who attacked the universalist message of the French Revolution with the observation that each nation has to evolve on its own terms? I can see why we've started to see the neo-cons as radical and jacobin.

Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:15 (twenty years ago)

...overview of the Fukuyama/Krauthammer spat...
Tis a shame this is merely two empty-suited pundits bellyaching. It sounds like an argument between a JNoise and a Oi band.

Lord Custos Epsilon (Lord Custos Epsilon), Thursday, 28 October 2004 20:32 (twenty years ago)

Republican tax-cut popularizer Jude Wanniski endorses Kerry

gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 28 October 2004 20:37 (twenty years ago)


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