So, are we watching the Debate tonight?

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Well, are we?

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 30 September 2004 20:36 (twenty-one years ago)

"debate"

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 30 September 2004 20:38 (twenty-one years ago)

Well, they're calling it a debate.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 30 September 2004 20:40 (twenty-one years ago)

No. I am going to see Rilo Kiley with Sarah (which was one of her bday presents) and I probably wouldn't be watching it if we were going to be home, as it means nothing, especially to me, and would probably just piss me off.

― n/a (Nick A.), Thursday, 30 September 2004 20:40 (twenty-one years ago)

I am.

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 30 September 2004 20:52 (twenty-one years ago)

I too will watch the event though I will undoubtedly be fortified.

― Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 30 September 2004 20:55 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm gonna drink beer and watch it. and then spit my beer out probably. i dunno, it's gonna be depressing. unless something really weird happens. which is doubtful.

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 30 September 2004 20:56 (twenty-one years ago)

I am, but I don't know why. For the anger/humor I guess.

― dave225 (Dave225), Thursday, 30 September 2004 20:56 (twenty-one years ago)

Beer is definitely key.

― o. nate (onate), Thursday, 30 September 2004 20:57 (twenty-one years ago)

I am going to Gabbneb's to drink beer and cheer on the home team.

― don carville weiner, Thursday, 30 September 2004 20:58 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm going to watch because I love 1) getting angry and 2) talking monkeys.

― why do old people and old users of ILX such bastardos (deangulberry), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:00 (twenty-one years ago)

Yes, I probably will, if the reception comes in on my TV. (It's a shitty TV that I never actually watch.) I will be drinking beer. Then I will probably watch a movie about Swedish teenage lesbians.

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:02 (twenty-one years ago)

Apparently they won't be able to address each other directly. What the fuck's up with that?

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:03 (twenty-one years ago)

The candidates I mean....not the Swedish teenage lesbians.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:03 (twenty-one years ago)

no TV.. surely it's being webcast?

― Ian c=====8 (orion), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:04 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't know. They're showing it on the big-screen TV at a bar in Hoboken.

― o. nate (onate), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:09 (twenty-one years ago)

MSNBC.com will air the debate live in a Webcast from 9 to 10:30 p.m. ET.

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:10 (twenty-one years ago)

it will be on the radio. npr. i think.

― scott seward (scott seward), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:10 (twenty-one years ago)

from the commentary on NPR this evening, sounds like the "can't address each other" rule will be easily skirted.

― dave225 (Dave225), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:12 (twenty-one years ago)

How so?

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:14 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm heading to Sabala's on Mt Tabor to get pissed and watch it with the rest of the punks on the big screen. Hopefully, they'll run the live Daily Show recap afterwards...

― Lt. Kingfish Del Pickles (Kingfish), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:23 (twenty-one years ago)

-If they break the rules, there's no consequence.
-They can also answer in such a way that the other candidate will be compelled to answer, even though they aren't supposed to.

― dave225 (Dave225), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:35 (twenty-one years ago)

take a shot whenever either candidate bursts out laughing at the ludicrous of one of the responses...

― Lt. Kingfish Del Pickles (Kingfish), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:48 (twenty-one years ago)

So, anyone know any webcasts, or when they start? I tried the MSNBC one, and all I could find was a couple minute programme of a woman telling me obvious things about the debate. Is C-Span streaming it? Or, if like me you are in the UK, is BBC Parliament airing it? They aired the conventions so...Anyway, maybe the MSNBC one works and I'm an idiot, in which case could I get directions?

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:50 (twenty-one years ago)

You may have to wait until the debates actually start.

― why do old people and old users of ILX such bastardos (deangulberry), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:51 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh, okay. Thanks.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:52 (twenty-one years ago)

What's with the crazy backdrop??
http://i.a.cnn.net/cnn/2004/ALLPOLITICS/09/30/debate.main/vert.tech.prep.ap.jpg

― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:54 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.sundazed.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/tmensurfbd.gif

― why do old people and old users of ILX such bastardos (deangulberry), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:56 (twenty-one years ago)

It's either a desperate bid for respectability or the fronting of "Doc Smith's Olde Granary and Lemonade Stand"

xpost

― You've Got to Pick Up Every Stitch (tracerhand), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:57 (twenty-one years ago)

Is that what a 'surfin bird' is behind the speaker?

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:59 (twenty-one years ago)

Oop. X-post. Sorry for rubbishly stealing joke.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Thursday, 30 September 2004 21:59 (twenty-one years ago)

the union and the constitution forever?

― still bevens (bscrubbins), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:06 (twenty-one years ago)

I will be watching it.

― The Bitter Tears Of Little Lord Travolta (nordicskilla), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:06 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm "debating" whether to watch it, heh

― latebloomer (latebloomer), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:08 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm so thin-skinned and easily angered by political things, i don't know if i could stomach it actually.

― latebloomer (latebloomer), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:09 (twenty-one years ago)

watching george w. bush attempt to speak knowledgably about things is always a powerful reminder of his total heeldom

― You've Got to Pick Up Every Stitch (tracerhand), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:12 (twenty-one years ago)

- Every time President Bush says the word "safer," take a drink. If he uses the word "democracy" in the same sentence, make it a double.

- For every John Kerry reference to the UN, have a drink.

- If Bush uses the phrase "compassionate conservative," you must chug your entire beverage.

- Take one drink for every three times Kerry points with his left hand.

- Any previously recorded Bushism, like "misunderestimate" or "subliminable," used by the president during the debate requires one drink.

- If Kerry exceeds the time limit for any response, take a drink.

- Back-to-back offenses require a double shot and a NoDoz.

A reference by your candidate to any of the following requires one drink:

1) Florida

2) North Korea

3) Axis of evil

4) Saddam Hussein

5) The American people

- And for an exciting twist on the game, anytime anybody mentions the word "Vietnam," everybody has to take a drink.

In this game, everyone's a winner. At worst, you'll reach the end of the debate experiencing a warm, pleasant buzz. But if you're really lucky, you'll pass out by 10 o'clock and won't have to listen to the closing statements. Cheers!

― Professor Challenger (ex machina), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:13 (twenty-one years ago)

...And there is a by-election is Britain today - it's a world of polirical fun!

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:13 (twenty-one years ago)

- Every time you are drafted into the Army and sent to some desert to kill people, CHUG.

― why do old people and old users of ILX such bastardos (deangulberry), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Boy, looking at Bush here, maybe he should've demanded a shorter podium.

http://i.a.cnn.net/cnn/2004/ALLPOLITICS/09/30/debate.main/vert.tech.prep.ap.jpg

I'm going over to a friend's house so that I won't have to fight the rabbit ears. I have low expectations, but I'm hoping for the best. As I understand it from the good guys, hope is on the way. Or maybe it's help. I know that I can't get that Little River Band song out of my head.

― Pleasant Plains (Pleasant Plains), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Boy, looking at Bush here, maybe he should've demanded a shorter podium.

WTF?

― why do old people and old users of ILX such bastardos (deangulberry), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:42 (twenty-one years ago)

And he shoulda worn a better suit.

― Pleasant Plains (Pleasant Plains), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:50 (twenty-one years ago)

it's on, live, here.

― RJG (RJG), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Does it qualify as "comedy"?

― The Bitter Tears Of Little Lord Travolta (nordicskilla), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Is it like Rollins where you don't know if you are meant to laugh or "take notes"?

― The Bitter Tears Of Little Lord Travolta (nordicskilla), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:54 (twenty-one years ago)

Or be kind of creeped out.

― The Bitter Tears Of Little Lord Travolta (nordicskilla), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:54 (twenty-one years ago)

Not to imply a sense of entitlement, but I'm at work so a descriptive blow-by-blow rather than stuff like "WHAT?!" and "WOW! DID HE JUST DO THAT?" would be appreciated.

― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 30 September 2004 22:55 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm off to see Q And Not U, so I'll be taping the debate. Should I program it to NBC, CBS, ABC or FOX (my CNN feed is too crappy)?

― alex in montreal, Thursday, 30 September 2004 23:23 (twenty-one years ago)

the IM chat is up & going.

join the chat "FUN MIT DER DEBATES"

xpost program it to cspan...

― Lt. Kingfish Del Pickles (Kingfish), Thursday, 30 September 2004 23:25 (twenty-one years ago)

No cspan in my area, just the ones I listed.

― alex in montreal, Thursday, 30 September 2004 23:29 (twenty-one years ago)

Skipping 664 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

....and that made my skin crawl.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 2 October 2004 03:22 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm home because (a) i have no life (b) i'm TELECOMMUTING this weekend (in the harold and kumar "it's friday night! here's a big stack of work! thanks!" sense) and i'm pretending that i'm staying in to get a head start on the job.

w/r/t kerry -- i do believe that "poise" (which isn't just a physical attribute) and debating skills do paint a picture of how a president might conduct himself in office. i want a president who's an organized thinker, who can present an opinion with clarity even if it's a conflicted opinion. i want a president who can speak well, someone who can be a walking advertisement for what education in america can be when it's taken seriously (the success of those fancy new england prep schools might serve as a model for the handful of public schools that still have a fighting chance). i want a president who's demonstrably good at something (like debating/public speaking); if he can do that, he may just have the brains and werewithal to be good at things that really do matter. call me crazy.

re kerry's "smugness" -- eh, maybe, but i saw it more as slyness. when bush is smug, he looks stupid and infantile. kerry's sly smirk might come from self-satisfaction, but it's a different sort; i can tell that when kerry is watching bush he's thinking, processing, analyzing, deconstructing, and if he's pleased with himself it's because he's just caught some spark of inspiration. kerry looks bright (hard to tell under all the grooming, but it's true, he does). bush's smug smirk says nothing but "i'm rubber, you're glue, nyeh nyeh. i want some ribs."

― pfeffernuesse (Jody Beth Rosen), Saturday, 2 October 2004 03:24 (twenty-one years ago)

1. Once again, Bush reaches out to his hard right, and Kerry reaches out to the moderate right that isn't even his to reach out to ("It really is a dangerous world out there, and we DO need a strong daddy to protect us, but a strong SMART daddy is better.").

2. German papers are very uneasy about the debate -- there's general recognition that Kerry is by far the better candidate, but extreme unease with K's plans for allies, as if Kerry thinks that being talked to nicely will get Germany wrapped around America's finger again. (It will, but) Europeans have a sense that diplomacy is much more than just friendly persuasion.

― Colin Meeder (Mert), Saturday, 2 October 2004 06:27 (twenty-one years ago)

"We have climbed...and look towards a valley of peace." He was staring directly into the television monitor and soothing the radical right with biblical references.

at this point is when i yelled "oh FUCK you" at the tube in the bar.

anybody want to see the vid from last night's Daily Show? hit me up on soulseek... Jon's pretty much about to call bullshit to Guilani's face.

http://www.youforgotpoland.com/

― Lt. Kingfish Del Pickles (Kingfish), Saturday, 2 October 2004 07:26 (twenty-one years ago)

2) The world outside America is very scary, full of threats to all Americans. In a debate about foreign policy, the only topics discussed were threats, fears, dangers to America. There's more to the rest of the world than that.

-- Joe Kay (nuramur...), October 1st, 2004.

-- Colin Meeder (amisrau...), October 2nd, 2004.

At least Kerry understands diplomacy -- trying to find points where a negotiating party's self-interest coincides with a common interest. Bush's attitude toward diplomacy reminds me of Dr. Strangelove and the video for Relax by Frankie Goes to Hollywood. His attack on Kerry's global test for preemptive action seems to be at odds with his rhetoric on spreading democracy: he doesn't seem to believe that people act based upon their beliefs or that nations can hold each other accountable, not just for altruistic reasons either but to get along.

― youn, Sunday, 3 October 2004 06:16 (twenty-one years ago)

Kerry cheated!!! - http://www.drudgereport.com/dnc57.htm

This is too funny to say anything about, but you know Rush and co. are going to take it completely serious.

― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Monday, 4 October 2004 00:23 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.pandagon.net/mtarchives/k-ecartoon.gif

― Sir Kingfish Beavis D'Azzmonch (Kingfish), Monday, 4 October 2004 05:07 (twenty-one years ago)

the cheat thing has already been killed...by the NY Post...

― Sir Kingfish Beavis D'Azzmonch (Kingfish), Monday, 4 October 2004 08:10 (twenty-one years ago)

that is the cutest political button i've ever seen...

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Monday, 4 October 2004 08:24 (twenty-one years ago)

as usual, BushCo is trying to distract from its own problem - the accusation that Bush was wearing an earpiece, which might explain his bizarre long pauses while answering (and, perhaps, his non-sequitur "let me finish!" outburst) and his strange head movements and facial expressions while not. maybe the Bush people were so downcast after the debate not just because he lost, but more because he may have revealed the man behind the curtain

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Monday, 4 October 2004 11:54 (twenty-one years ago)

Wouldn't a more likely cause of his "let me finish" outburst be the warning lights turning on?

The earpiece claim is just a little more ridiculous than the cheat-sheet - you don't think Kerry or any of his handlers or anyone working for the networks or the other hundreds of people near the stage wouldn't notice?

― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Monday, 4 October 2004 12:01 (twenty-one years ago)

I wouldn't be surprised if GWB had someone in the audience giving hand signals of what talking point to use. That would partly explain why Bush only had about five things to say. (Hand signals being given by one-armed man.)

― dave225 (Dave225), Monday, 4 October 2004 12:04 (twenty-one years ago)

that's a marvellous piece on conspiracy nonsense, pretty well picked to bits in the comments under it...

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Monday, 4 October 2004 12:09 (twenty-one years ago)

you're saying that he was talking to a light? both candidates often continued talking briefly after the last one went on, Kerry more than Bush admittedly.

If he was wearing an earpiece, I'm not sure that kerry's people didn't notice; they probably did. Why do you assume they would have made a big stink about it? If you saw the split-screen, Kerry repeatedly tried to get Lehrer's attention visually for rebuttals, and when Lehrer turned him down or didn't notice and moved on, Kerry securely acknowledged him or calmly went back to writing notes, i.e. he was trying very hard not to act defensive about process - calling out Bush for wearing a wire would have made him look whiny and loser-ish. He doesn't have the right personality - cold, mean entitlement - to pull off an "i paid for this microphone"-type line, and even if he did, it probably wouldn't be to his advantage.

(xp: I didn't read all the comments; that link makes my browser act funny)

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Monday, 4 October 2004 12:10 (twenty-one years ago)

and do you think anyone wouldn't notice Kerry - right in front of Bush and Lehrer and tv cameras - pulling something out of his pocket and putting it on the lectern?!

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Monday, 4 October 2004 12:14 (twenty-one years ago)

Was there a rule against writing notes on your arm?

― dave225 (Dave225), Monday, 4 October 2004 12:15 (twenty-one years ago)

the comments basically point out that any bulge under his jacket was:

a. the microphone transmitter
b. his bulletproof vest

and that the "let me finish" was probably to a visual prompt from the moderator and not the light, which wasn't on at the time...

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Monday, 4 October 2004 12:27 (twenty-one years ago)

you're saying that he was talking to a light? both candidates often continued talking briefly after the last one went on, Kerry more than Bush admittedly.
No, I'm saying that a not-too-brilliant and highly flustered man was responding to someone telling him to hurry it up (either the light or a visual or whatever). You've never responded verbally to a nonverbal prompt?

Every time I start to feel a little bit of sympathy with Kerry supporters from something stupid like the cheat-sheet, something like this comes along to make me realize that you lot are just as stupid (or dishonest) and prone to whining and conspiracies as the other side.

― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Monday, 4 October 2004 12:51 (twenty-one years ago)

Stupidity on all sides shocker!

― Sean Carruthers (SeanC), Monday, 4 October 2004 13:01 (twenty-one years ago)

kingfish-where did you find that button? it is the most adorable thing ever. i must have!

― Emilymv (Emilymv), Monday, 4 October 2004 13:01 (twenty-one years ago)

found it at Pandagon.net

just check the link addr.

― Sir Kingfish Beavis D'Azzmonch (Kingfish), Monday, 4 October 2004 15:58 (twenty-one years ago)

"Every time I start to feel a little bit of sympathy with Kerry supporters from something stupid like the cheat-sheet, something like this comes along to make me realize that you lot are just as stupid (or dishonest) and prone to whining and conspiracies as the other side."

Yes well the major difference is that the PRESS in the US reports on shit like Kerry's cheat sheet while all the left's silliness is basically relegated to threads like these and goofy pamphlets.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Monday, 4 October 2004 16:07 (twenty-one years ago)

It's more frustrating to me (as someone on 'the left'). Every time I feel some kinship with the centrists and their candidate, such as laughing together at the kooks and fools, someone either lives up to the lib'rul cliche or engages in the same kooky/foolish behavior and reminds me that the only real difference seems to be party affiliation.

― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Monday, 4 October 2004 16:13 (twenty-one years ago)

the little button/icon thing is done by Travis Williams, at http://travisty.net/

also,

http://www.pandagon.net/mtarchives/thenote.jpg

― kingfish, Monday, 4 October 2004 16:33 (twenty-one years ago)

Kerry whacks Bush on stem cells:

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=5&u=/ap/20041004/ap_on_el_pr/kerry_20

I had no idea Michael J. Fox has Parkinson's. He seems far too young.

― o. nate (onate), Monday, 4 October 2004 17:36 (twenty-one years ago)

This is a fun little toy. "Hard work" was mentioned eleven times.

― Pleasant Plains (Pleasant Plains), Monday, 4 October 2004 17:38 (twenty-one years ago)

Alex Keaton with a Democrat!

― kyle (akmonday), Monday, 4 October 2004 18:09 (twenty-one years ago)

MJF has been doing a lot of parkinsons awareness stuff ever since it came out that he had it, particularly to do with the "it's not just old people who suffer" side of things.

fergal henderson from st john (our favourite offal restaurant) has it as well...

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Monday, 4 October 2004 18:28 (twenty-one years ago)

milo, i never would have posted that stuff if you hadn't run so lovingly into Drudge's arms. similar goes for 80% of the stuff I post on ILX

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Monday, 4 October 2004 23:23 (twenty-one years ago)

it's ok for you, but not for us.

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Monday, 4 October 2004 23:23 (twenty-one years ago)

the comments basically point out that any bulge under his jacket was:
a. the microphone transmitter
b. his bulletproof vest

and that the "let me finish" was probably to a visual prompt from the moderator and not the light, which wasn't on at the time...

yes, this reading of 'let me finish' is totally plausible, but also based upon assumed facts. i choose for myself not to make the assumption either way, but i'll assume there were no visual clues if someone else assumes that there were.

i also base nothing on the thing on his back, which I assumed was unrelated. Bush has $250 million plus; i think he could afford an earpiece that doesn't require one.

meanwhile, Bush had his own cheat sheet

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Monday, 4 October 2004 23:26 (twenty-one years ago)

OMG milo, Kerry called Fox "Michael Keaton"! He's gonna lose! Roffle!

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Monday, 4 October 2004 23:27 (twenty-one years ago)

You can download an audio copy of the first debate from iTunes for free now, I see.

― Girolamo Savonarola, Monday, 4 October 2004 23:54 (twenty-one years ago)

Gabbneb, "run lovingly into Drudge's arms"? Are you fucking illiterate?

Kerry cheated!!! - http://www.drudgereport.com/dnc57.htm

This is too funny to say anything about, but you know Rush and co. are going to take it completely serious.

― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Tuesday, 5 October 2004 00:02 (twenty-one years ago)

Gabbneb has the tendency to read the most negative meaning possible into the statements of the people he's arguing with; surely we're at the point where this can be recognized, acknowledged and clarified without rancor and cursing?

― Dan Perry '08 (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 5 October 2004 01:30 (twenty-one years ago)

awww, can't we have just a little cursing?

― Sir Kingfish Beavis D'Azzmonch (Kingfish), Tuesday, 5 October 2004 01:55 (twenty-one years ago)

especially when they're using bad grammar, Dan

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 5 October 2004 02:39 (twenty-one years ago)

And yet no one else had trouble figuring it out.

― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Tuesday, 5 October 2004 02:41 (twenty-one years ago)

right, i'm ducking the issue. i am fucking illiterate. real professional hazard.

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 5 October 2004 02:43 (twenty-one years ago)

I was, of course, being completely literal in suggesting that you are incapable of reading and/or writing.

― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Tuesday, 5 October 2004 02:48 (twenty-one years ago)

now, boys...

― latebloomer (latebloomer), Tuesday, 5 October 2004 02:53 (twenty-one years ago)

the tendency to read the most negative meaning possible into the statements of the people he's arguing with

Maybe we all do this and it's a matter of temperament or personal style as to whether or not we let the other person know. Occasionally, my mother even surprises me.

In the next debate, I hope Kerry can lay out a visionary plan, that he can make all his points add up to something that inspires people. In the last debate, I thought Bush was strongest, even though he wasn't offering anything concrete, when he tried to strike that note. Kerry has a lot to go on. For example, today I read that moderate Jews and Arab Americans, like others, are concerned about the protection of civil rights and the potential for abuse under the Patriot Act. It's not just no racial profiling and criticizing Ashcroft. It has to be more than that. Last time, Kerry showed his analytical skills to advantage. He shied away from asserting the relevance of personal characteristics, but since so much is contingent and depends upon compromise, that's what people have to go on.

― youn, Tuesday, 5 October 2004 06:45 (twenty-one years ago)

You can download an audio copy of the first debate from iTunes for free now, I see.

CASSETTE BOY TO THREAD!!!!

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Tuesday, 5 October 2004 08:04 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.isbushwired.com/

― morris pavilion (samjeff), Wednesday, 6 October 2004 20:49 (twenty-one years ago)

No really. It's starting to creep me out.

http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/rids/20041012/i/r2362703777.jpg

― Pleasant Plains (Pleasant Plains), Tuesday, 12 October 2004 20:56 (twenty-one years ago)

Is McCain making out with Jenna Bush?

― milozauckerman (miloaukerman), Wednesday, 13 October 2004 00:15 (twenty-one years ago)

"Sorry my dad ran those racist push-polls against you in South Carolina. How about some sugar?"

― milozauckerman (miloaukerman), Wednesday, 13 October 2004 00:19 (twenty-one years ago)

seven years pass...

CNN / GALLUP POLL ON WHO WON DEBATE
Kerry: 53
Bush: 37

CBS POLL ON WHO WON DEBATE:

Kerry: 44
Bush: 26
Tie: 30

ABC POLL ON WHO WON DEBATE:

Kerry: 45
Bush 36:
Tie: 17

― frankE (frankE), Thursday, September 30, 2004 10:06 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Kerry seems to be enjoying this romping

― Space Is the Place (Space Is the Place), Thursday, September 30, 2004 7:30 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

― pplains, Thursday, 4 October 2012 14:10 (thirteen years ago)

Never Forget (Poland)

― pplains, Thursday, 4 October 2012 14:10 (thirteen years ago)

Haha

― Raymond Cummings, Thursday, 4 October 2012 14:13 (thirteen years ago)

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