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WHAT THE FUCK WOULD IT TAKE TO GET OUT THE YOUTH VOTE? A GODDAMN PROPOSED BAN ON SNACK FOODS OR MANDATORY VOTING BEFORE ENTERING A MALL???

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seriously, what the hell is the problem? it is hard to imagine a scenario in which the youth vote could have more reason for motivation. this must go beyond the "slacker" stereotype. and surely it can't be the belief that voting doesn't matter. are we a generation of disinterested ego maniacs?

― Emilymv (Emilymv), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:49 (twenty years ago)

shorter lineups.

― Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:49 (twenty years ago)

I think the issue is that "the youth vote" is just as divided as "the adult vote".

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:50 (twenty years ago)

this is surely a new record for topic/threads ratio

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:50 (twenty years ago)

Dan OTMFM. There *is* no magical proof that 'the youth vote' = a decisive Kerry victory.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:51 (twenty years ago)

i haven't even STARTED reading the personal weblogs out there. i may as well quit my job.

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:51 (twenty years ago)

I don't buy that the "youth vote" is divided so evenly that it wouldn't of benefitted Kerry.

― bnw (bnw), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:53 (twenty years ago)

i have seen evidence that the youth vote went at least 56-44 kerry. will try to find link.

― Emilymv (Emilymv), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:54 (twenty years ago)

Why? In MA, I encountered just as many 18-year-olds who were ardent Bushites as there were Kerryites and I Work with a whole bunch of people who are under the age of 27 whose most charitable comment about Kerry is that he is "a scumbag", AND THIS IS IN MA.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:54 (twenty years ago)

aren't votes supposed to be confidential?

― ken c (ken c), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:55 (twenty years ago)

Exit polls.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:56 (twenty years ago)

oh yeah!

― ken c (ken c), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:56 (twenty years ago)

Whether they support Kerry or Bush, the idea that many of them don't vote is puzzling.

― dave225 (Dave225), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:58 (twenty years ago)

i know that i read several articles at some point in the middle of the night that sited exit polls showing that though the youth turnout was lower than expected, it was overwhelmingly in support of kerry. by a larger margin than for gore in 2000.

― Emilymv (Emilymv), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 15:59 (twenty years ago)

The Bay Area must be at the forefront of the anti-war, anti-Bush movement and yet, while my wife was in line at the polling station yesterday, cars kept pulling up, mostly driven by people in their mid to late 20s, to ask what people where in line for. They were all asking "what are you waiting to get?" and when they got their answer, they would invariably just shrug and drive on.

― adam... (nordicskilla), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:01 (twenty years ago)

We need to tie voting in with txting and downloading mp3's & porn, somehow.

― bnw (bnw), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:01 (twenty years ago)

hey not for nothing but josh marshall just posted this:

"Before getting to comments on last night's election, I want to make a correction about last evening's comments about the youth vote, comments which were incomplete and partly misleading. Young voters showed up at a far higher level than they did four years ago. But everyone else did too. And so the proportion of the electorate made up by the youth vote did not increase. At least not dramatically -- look at the specific numbers for details. For the Democrats, this was clearly not a good thing. But that doesn't mean that young voters didn't turn out in record proportions."


... so, you know, let's not be so quick to point fingers, eh?

― maura (maura), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:02 (twenty years ago)

the draft in 2007

― Sir Kingfish Beavis D'Azzmonch (Kingfish), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:02 (twenty years ago)

i think that they estimate youth turnout at 17%. even if overall numbers are higher, that is a pathetic percentage.

― Emilymv (Emilymv), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:04 (twenty years ago)

It is disgusting that the youth vote figures didn't get any higher than in 2000. Like everything in life, the people with the most free time on their hands bitch the most, and then do absolutely nothing about it.

Young leftists don't vote because it doesn't effect them, plain and simple. They are typically middle class & not likely to join the military, so they don't worry about going to war. They don't pay property tax, and can't think ahead enough to consider that someday they'll have a career & will be giving up a huge chunk of their salary & working until they're dead because Social Security and Medicare will be a thing of the past.

The only thing that appeals to young voters is when a bill is up to make bars close earlier or legalize marijuana. Otherwise, they say "it doesn't make a difference", because to their carpe diem mindset, it really doesn't.

Well kiddos, a big bootfull of reality is about to come kick you square in your lazy, apathetic ass in about a decade.

― jay blanchard (jay blanchard), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:06 (twenty years ago)

Kingfish OTM

― TOMBOT, Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:13 (twenty years ago)

Actually, I think a draft would be a great thing for this country (he says secure in the knowledge that by the time it's instituted he would no longer be eligible for it).

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:14 (twenty years ago)

You evil wonderful man (he said with similar thoughts).

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:18 (twenty years ago)

I told Kerry to lower the drinking age (via state incentives). It's not like he was going to score with the evangelicals anyway.

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:21 (twenty years ago)

I think saying that "the youth" are apathetic is an oversimplification. Perhaps changing age restrictions on candidacy might encourage those who feel that they aren't going to be represented no matter who is elected to change that opinion. Then again, perhaps what you have going on is the death throes of an outdated system.

― mouse (mouse), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:21 (twenty years ago)

changing restrictions on age of candidates is a horrible idea. and i hardly think that the age of the candidates is what is holding anyone back from voting.

― Emilymv (Emilymv), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:26 (twenty years ago)

Emilymv, where are you getting this 17% number from, the exit polls? Cause in that case 17% = 18-29 year olds' share of all ballots cast, NOT the percentage of ALL 18-29 yo's who could vote and did.

― c. (synkro), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:36 (twenty years ago)

You think so? I don't see how you can say that when a major complaint of non-voters is that none of the candidates from which they are allowed to choose represent them. but then again, like I said before, maybe people in general are just gradually phasing out the whole process.

― mouse (mouse), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:38 (twenty years ago)

x-post

― mouse (mouse), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:38 (twenty years ago)

but age difference between young voters and the candidates running has to my knowledge never been voiced as a reason for them not voting. it is just not the same as sex, race, etc. and it seems that most people want to vote for a candidate older than themselves (which is why many pres. hopefuls dye their hair grey and such).

― Emilymv (Emilymv), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:41 (twenty years ago)

oh, and i just read that about the 17%. i am really having trouble finding numbers and links. if anyone else can, please post. all i am sure about is that the consensus seems to be that the youth turnout was much lower than expected.

― Emilymv (Emilymv), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 16:44 (twenty years ago)

it wasn't. it went up in raw numbers. but the proportion stayed the same, because turnout in every demographic was up.

― maura (maura), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 17:27 (twenty years ago)

Young voters preferred Kerry, but turnout wasn't high

― Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 17:33 (twenty years ago)

Emilymv, was it CNN? These numbers seem to match those you've posted here:

VOTE BY AGE
BUSH KERRY NADER
TOTAL 2004 2004 2004

18-29 (17%) 44% 54% 1%

30-44 (28%) 51% 47% 1%

45-59 (30%) 50% 49% 1%

60 and Older (25%) 53% 46% 0%
----

17 + 28 + 30 + 25 = 100%

― c. (synkro), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 17:39 (twenty years ago)

we had 88% voter turnout in oregon, at least (for all ages)

― Sir Kingfish Beavis D'Azzmonch (Kingfish), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 18:00 (twenty years ago)

I am a young person and I voted, and most of my peers did as well.

― Ian John50n (orion), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 18:10 (twenty years ago)

actually, i'm now seriously seeing the benefits of the oncoming draft. it should hopefully cut the militaristic urge a bit, which is why i think the coupla democrat congressmen introduced the bill this year or last year.

― Sir Kingfish Beavis D'Azzmonch (Kingfish), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 18:11 (twenty years ago)

17 + 28 + 30 + 25 = 100%

that just show you the percentage of ballots cast by each age group. it doesn't show the percentage of registered voters in each age group that voted.

― statto zebedee (zebedee), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 18:20 (twenty years ago)

er, that came out unclear - i meant: what percentage of voters were in each age group

― zebedee (zebedee), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 18:22 (twenty years ago)

from N's link:
"The youth voter pool is immense -- 40.6 million Americans are between 18 and 29, comprising 1 in 5 eligible voters"

so not obvious that this age group was that much more apathetic than any other.

― statto zebedee (zebedee), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 18:31 (twenty years ago)

Alba's article claims 34% or 18-24 year-olds voted and that their turnout was about the same this time around. So all the hype toward getting more young people out didn't work. Also, considering that the national turnout rate was ~60% (a big increase over 2000), it's even more pathetic.

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 18:33 (twenty years ago)

I am a young person and I voted, and most of my peers did as well.

you voted for Bush though didn't you? DIDN'T YOU????

― kyle (akmonday), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 18:34 (twenty years ago)

Hmm, the 18-24's I know are overwhelmingly pro-Bush, if they exhibit any political leaning at all. Many don't seem to remember (or hope for) anything better, and have come of political age since Sept. 11, 2001.

― briania (briania), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 18:37 (twenty years ago)

The last traces of the youth movement are finally fading. We've lived with it for so long that we haven't realized that, historically, for the attitudes of the young to oppose those of older people or the general population isn't necessarily a given. I think the, like, geist of young adulthood continues to be the most changable component of society, and the trend towards decadent infantilism starting from like 55 years ago (or whatever) remains, except that it's progressed so far (ie: regressed its objects to such an extent) that the urge to rebel (which was always a base and stupid thing in itself anyway, no matter how good its politics happened to be) is being replaced by the idea of "daddy knows best" that preceded it and ran underneath it the whole time.

― Dan I., Wednesday, 3 November 2004 19:17 (twenty years ago)

We've lived with it for so long that we haven't realized that, historically, for the attitudes of the young to oppose those of older people or the general population isn't necessarily a given

I think this may well be spot on.

― Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 19:18 (twenty years ago)

that just show you the percentage of ballots cast by each age group. it doesn't show the percentage of registered voters in each age group that voted.

Zebedee - That was my point exactly, I'm just trying to pin down the 17% people keep citing (it's been mentioned on other threads as well); I think that figure is a misreading. It doesn't necessarily contradict Emilymv's main point, though.

Remember, all these numbers are coming from exit polls, and we've seen how reliable those are.

― c. (synkro), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 19:42 (twenty years ago)

"actually, i'm now seriously seeing the benefits of the oncoming draft. it should hopefully cut the militaristic urge a bit, which is why i think the coupla democrat congressmen introduced the bill this year or last year."

i'll ruminate on this as i'm being pumped full of hot lead on foreign soil.

― \(^o^)/ (Adrian Langston), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 19:51 (twenty years ago)

Hide behind the linebacker next to you.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 19:53 (twenty years ago)

the youth vote were the only age group that actually voted for Kerry. Why don't we get mad at those fucking 30-44 year olds?

― Shmool McShmool (shmuel), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 19:58 (twenty years ago)

yeah fuck them too

― kyle (akmonday), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 19:58 (twenty years ago)

Wait, that wasn't a joke? The US is actually going to bring in compulsory military service?

― sundar subramanian (sundar), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 20:43 (twenty years ago)

No. People just keep saying it will.

― Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 20:44 (twenty years ago)

I hope they do it so there will actually be a hot issue that will cause states to have reason to secede.

― Carey (Carey), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 20:46 (twenty years ago)

a bill really was introduced early this year/last year to re-introduce conscription.

― Sir Kingfish Beavis D'Azzmonch (Kingfish), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 21:06 (twenty years ago)

Yes, but it was introduced by democrats to shake things up, not to because they actually wanted to reinstate the draft. It only got 2 votes, iirc, from the two who introduced it.

― stephen morris (stephen morris), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 21:08 (twenty years ago)

I've been wondering whether getting out the youth vote caused the gay marriage ban to pass as overwhelmingly as it did in Oregon.

― Casuistry (Chris P), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 21:44 (twenty years ago)

nope.

here is the exit poll (oregon's same sex vote was the closest):
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004//pages/results/states/OR/I/02/epolls.0.html

― artdamages (artdamages), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 21:58 (twenty years ago)

How on earth do you do an exit poll in Oregon? There's nothing to exit.

― Casuistry (Chris P), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 22:01 (twenty years ago)

I've been wondering whether getting out the youth vote caused the gay marriage ban to pass as overwhelmingly as it did in Oregon.

I think it had more to do with the bigots finally defining the issue in a way (pro-marriage) that otherwise reasonable people could support. I mean, it wasn't TEACHERS WANT TO INSTRUCT YOUR KIDS IN THE WAY OF BUTTSEXXX this time. I also suspect that the rest of the state was really motivated to beat the shit out of uppity Multnomah County on this. (xpost)

Apparently they were scared though.

― c. (synkro), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 22:12 (twenty years ago)

Why on earth would you want any state to secede from the Union?!

― Curt1s St3ph3ns, Wednesday, 3 November 2004 22:21 (twenty years ago)

What union?

― Carey (Carey), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 23:17 (twenty years ago)

the union of marriage.

― Allyzay Science Explosion (allyzay), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 23:19 (twenty years ago)

the missionary position.

― Carey (Carey), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 23:20 (twenty years ago)

the union of the snake

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 23:21 (twenty years ago)

actually them gays found out a way to do it in the missionary position. I seen it on TV.

― Carey (Carey), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 23:22 (twenty years ago)

i'm pretty sure that's bad for your back though

― cinniblount (James Blount), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 23:22 (twenty years ago)

Actually it would be awesome if we had a royal family for our new country. and they all have to be descendents of Sidney Poitier or Jake Gyllenhall.

― Carey (Carey), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 23:23 (twenty years ago)

Preferably both! The first products of inter-racial homosexual union.

Blue Mink's 'Melting Pot' (No.3 in 1969!) would be the national anthem:

Blue Mink


Melting Pot

Take a pinch of white man
Wrap him up in black skin
Add a touch of blue blood
And a little bitty bit of red Indian boy
Oh like a Curly Latin kinkies
Oh Lordy, Lordy, mixed with yellow Chinkees, yeah
You know you lump it all together
And you got a recipe for a get along scene
Oh what a beautiful dream
If it could only come true, you know, you know

What we need is a great big melting pot
Big enough enough enough to take
The world and all its got And keep it stirring for a hundred years or more
And turn out coffee coloured people by the score

Rabbis and the friars
Vishnus and the gurus
We got the Beatles or the Sun God
Well it really doesn't matter what religion you choose
And be thankful little Mrs. Graceful
You know that livin' could be tasteful
We should all get together in a lovin machine
I think I'll call up the queen
It' s only fair that she knows, you know, you know

What we need is a great big melting pot
Big enough enough enough to take
The world and all its got And keep it stirring for a hundred years or more
And turn out coffee coloured people by the score



― Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 3 November 2004 23:42 (twenty years ago)


I thought that you were joking / When you said "I want to see you
To discuss your contribution / To the future of our nation's heart and soul
Six o'clock, my place, Whitehall" / Well I arrived just after seven
But you said "It doesn't matter" / "I understand your situation
And your image, and I'm flattered / Oh and I'd just like to tell you
That I love all of your albums / Could you sign this for my daughter?
She's in hospital, her name is Miriam / Now get down to the gist:
Do you want a line of this? / Are you a (sniff) / socialist?"
"Doin' fine, yeah! / Buzzin' all the time / Just one hit / And I feel great
And I support / The welfare state / Oh, you must be socialist
'Cos you're always off out on the piss / In your private member's bar
Oh yes you are / Yer superstar / Well you sing about common people
And the mis-shapes and the misfits / So can you bring them to my party
And get them all to sniff this? / And all I'm really saying
Is come on and rock the vote for me / All I'm really saying
Is come on roll up that note for me / The gist of all of this is
Do you want hits or d'you want misses? / Are you a socialist, yeah
Socialist, yeah / Socialist, yeah / Oh yeah"
"Yeah, you can be just what you want to be
Just as long as you don't try to compete with me
And we've waited such a long time
For the chance to help our own kind, so now
Please come on and tow the party line / Oh you owe it to yourself
Don't think of anybody else / And we promise we won't tell
Oh we won't tell, and we won't sell" / No we won't / No we won't
No we won't

― LeCoq (LeCoq), Thursday, 4 November 2004 04:43 (twenty years ago)

blowjobs. anal. pussy-eating.

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 4 November 2004 04:44 (twenty years ago)

actually them gays found out a way to do it in the missionary position. I seen it on TV.

-- Carey (flembac...), November 3rd, 2004.

Yeah that's how they were doing it in the fake Lloyd Banks porn clip. Huge black cocks with pearly white cum, that's my mans right dere

― LeCoq (LeCoq), Thursday, 4 November 2004 04:46 (twenty years ago)


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