is delusion an essential component of interpersonal relationships?

Message Bookmarked

Bookmark Removed

just wondering

― sundar subramanian, Wednesday, 11 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Yes

― Mark Morris, Wednesday, 11 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

― anthony, Wednesday, 11 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Perhaps

― Josh, Wednesday, 11 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I believe you believe that.

― Ned Raggett, Wednesday, 11 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I think it's called "blind faith," actually.

― David Raposa, Wednesday, 11 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

You all like me, right?

― Ally C, Wednesday, 11 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

But of course, Ms. C. A more insidious question to ask - "Am I likable?" (I, of course, refering to the universal I, the all-seeing I, that I floating on the top of the pyramid on the back of the dollar bill.)

So much for the one-liners.

― David Raposa, Wednesday, 11 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

It's either delusion or paranoia, you pick.

― Ally, Wednesday, 11 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

depends i guess - most times, I delude myself that humanity is worth interracting with; more of the time, I delude myself that I am worth interacting with....do animals count?

― Geoff, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I keep reading Ally's line as, "It's either delusion or paranoia, you prick." Which sounds enjoyably rough-hearted.

― Ned Raggett, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Only of the good ones...

― Sterling Clover, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Not necessarily, but appearing to be deluded is.

― tarden, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

No, absolutely not. In fact, delusion is one of the most harmful things to interpersonal relationships. Just think of the pricks I wouldn't have wasted time with, if I hadn't been deluded that they actually liked me back.

― masonic boom, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

But surely that's the point: in order to have a relationship with these pricks, you had to delude yourself about them (essential not equalling good for you)

― Mark Morris, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Delusion is a central part of *bad* interpersonal relationships, then.

Good, healthy, and constructive interpersonal relationships do not need delusion.

― masonic boom, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Well of course there is the delusion that we can know what other people think of us - but without maintaining this piece of self trickery it would be nigh on impossible to work in the world. Friendships are pretty much based on a degree of mutual trust which may or may not be deserved but we must delude ourselves to think that is - else the friendship would have no basis.

If you are knowingly deluding yourself, then are you really deluding yourself at all? Lying to others though about these things is never a good idea. Lying about sewage farms is a good idea.

― Pete, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Is the point proved by David R having the pleasant delusion that Ally C is a Ms?

― the pinefox, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Delusion is an essential component of EVERYTHING.

― chris, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I call you all Ms. And you better like it, bitches.

― Ally, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

That's Ms Bitch to you

― Geoff, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

What, are you saying I'm nasty?

― Ally, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

If it'll make David like me, I'm a Ms.

― Ally C, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

no, it's just no one calls me sir, it's madam, and if you want to call me MS, well then it's MS Bitch.

― Geoff, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Well, shit & golly, I plum fuckered up someone's gender!

AllyC, I like you tons, regardless of which chromosome you got stuck with. Hell, I like all y'alls. Apologies to all that I have offended, and especially to those whom I will soon offend. You know who you'll be. Brace yourselves for the inevitable.

― David Raposa, Thursday, 12 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

You're all fucking right. Delusion is an essential part of interpersonal relationships. Delusion is an essential part of EVERY DAY LIFE!!! If we stopped being deluded about basic things like... "everything is going to work out OK" and "I think humanity is basically nice" and "I think that the things that I do will matter after I drop fucking dead, like every other person in this dump will eventually do" then for fucks sake, we'd throw ourselves out windows in a mass suicide of existential dread.

I was sane once. It was the worst 6 months of my life! Fuck that. I've spent my entire life fighting against reality, and goddammit, doctor, I've finally won out.

― masonic boom, Friday, 13 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

two years pass...

yes, yes it is

― possible m (mandinina), Monday, 8 December 2003 03:11 (twenty-one years ago)

When you are sane, you do not spurn delusion, but indulge it playfully to make life more interesting.

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Monday, 8 December 2003 03:22 (twenty-one years ago)

Yes, I'm drunk, and pretentious.

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Monday, 8 December 2003 03:25 (twenty-one years ago)

colin OTM

― the surface noise (electricsound), Monday, 8 December 2003 03:26 (twenty-one years ago)

About which post, Jim?

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Monday, 8 December 2003 03:31 (twenty-one years ago)

ABOUT EVERYTHING

― the surface noise (electricsound), Monday, 8 December 2003 03:40 (twenty-one years ago)

well not the pretentious bit

― the surface noise (electricsound), Monday, 8 December 2003 03:40 (twenty-one years ago)

but what if people judge you as insane for playing with delusion? does that mean playing is an essential part of a relationship?

― possible m (mandinina), Monday, 8 December 2003 03:45 (twenty-one years ago)

*checks watch*...are you sure about the drunk bit too?

― gaz (gaz), Monday, 8 December 2003 03:52 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm getting there..

― possible m (mandinina), Monday, 8 December 2003 03:54 (twenty-one years ago)

gaz, I had one beer at lunch and it's made me quite sozzled, for some reason.

Who's going to tackle possible m's thorny question?

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Monday, 8 December 2003 04:06 (twenty-one years ago)

is it bad to be judged as insane even if you aren't?

― the surface noise (electricsound), Monday, 8 December 2003 04:10 (twenty-one years ago)

it can be used as a weapon against a person

― possible m (mandinina), Monday, 8 December 2003 04:13 (twenty-one years ago)

or is delusion only not recognizing the subjective nature of interpersonal relationships? is anything *real* even possible?

― possible m (mandinina), Monday, 8 December 2003 04:15 (twenty-one years ago)

whats yer shoe size colin?

― gaz (gaz), Monday, 8 December 2003 04:22 (twenty-one years ago)

Nine and a half.

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Monday, 8 December 2003 04:23 (twenty-one years ago)

but what if people judge you as insane for playing with delusion? does that mean playing is an essential part of a relationship?

-- possible m (neorealist...) (webmail), December 8th, 2003. (mandinina)

Come on people, it's a very important question. I need to know the answer too. Please divulge.

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Monday, 8 December 2003 05:48 (twenty-one years ago)

sorry, those are two separate questions: But, then, if one playfully indulges in delusion (assuming one is sane), and delusion is an essential part of interpersonal relationships, does that mean that playing is too? i may be drunk by now, does that make sense?

― possible m (mandinina), Monday, 8 December 2003 06:01 (twenty-one years ago)

This isn't a direct answer, but in some sense, anyone in any relationship is constantly making up for the inaccuracy, and maybe the artifice, of their first impression. That isn't a bad thing, but it might be a yes.

― Tep (ktepi), Monday, 8 December 2003 06:01 (twenty-one years ago)

(xpost; I'm not sure if it's more or less a yes now.)

― Tep (ktepi), Monday, 8 December 2003 06:02 (twenty-one years ago)

possible m, I think playing only becomes delusional if you play properly. I think madness lies in the attempt to act deluded when you're not.

On the other hand, it needs to be pointed out that once you've dispensed with the consensus hallucination, and discovered the transcendental pointlessness of all things, including relationships with loved ones... you might want to say, 'So what if it's pointless? I'm going to do it anyway, for the hell of it'. That is game playing, but with a good heart and no misgivings.

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Monday, 8 December 2003 06:10 (twenty-one years ago)

if only everyone saw it that way...

― possible m (mandinina), Monday, 8 December 2003 06:11 (twenty-one years ago)

Possible m, I think it may be worth thinking about it this way: there's no point to anything, therefore there's no point to anyone losing their delusion. I am not joking when I say that several of my nearest and dearest are completely deluded - and I like it that way.

If the universe wants to divide itself up and play 'I am more than one cognizer' as a game to pass the millenia, then it is more fun for it to do so if it absorbs itself in the game to the extent that it forgets it's just the one lonely being.

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Monday, 8 December 2003 06:16 (twenty-one years ago)

I couldn't imagine living my life WITHOUT delusion.

― latebloomer (latebloomer), Monday, 8 December 2003 07:04 (twenty-one years ago)

Christ, this thread is depressing:

God, if only I had had the slightest idea.

OK, that's it. I've just crossed the line from "depressed but coping" into truly fucking hateful and miserable.

― THAT Kate (kate), Monday, 8 December 2003 10:06 (twenty-one years ago)

I think this sums it up for me (btw life in general requires delusion -- I cd not have got out of bed at 7am today without some idea that things would improve someday), anyway:

You think you've got it
Oh, you think you've got it
But got it just don't get it
Til' there's nothing at a-a-a-a-all
We get together
Oh, we get together
But seperate's always better when there's feelings invo-o-ol-o-ol-lved
If what they say is "Nothing is forever",
Then what makes, then what makes, then what makes
then what makes, then what makes Love an exception?
So why you, why you, why you, why you, why you
Are we so in denial?
When we are not happy here

― Enrique 3000 (Enrique), Monday, 8 December 2003 10:19 (twenty-one years ago)

Hey Kate! Welcome back! Missed you.

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Monday, 8 December 2003 12:31 (twenty-one years ago)

You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.