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Holy Shit OS X 10.3.8 is fucking my PB in the ass

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1.25 g4
512M ram
80G HD

since installing version 10.3.8 my I can't manage to keep my HD from filling up. Unaware of the problem I've already deleted a ton of apps and the entire developers' toolkit, plus a lot of crappy albums. I added a LaCie external to my wish list to remind me to buy one ASAP and tonight I have discovered my system.log file is 27 GB in size. I rebooted last night!!

FUCK YOU APPLE

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 04:29 (twenty years ago)

wtf? is this 10.2.8 all over again?

― s1ocki (slutsky), Friday, 4 March 2005 04:32 (twenty years ago)

http://www.macfixit.com/article.php?story=20050302005252306

― s1ocki (slutsky), Friday, 4 March 2005 04:34 (twenty years ago)

yeah he has the iShock driver.

― Allyzay Dallas Multi-Pass (allyzay), Friday, 4 March 2005 04:35 (twenty years ago)

But is it worth it overall to get a Mac? All these people who complain really love them, right? (I'm thinking of switching, but I sorta feel like I should get my next computer from HP cos I want them to beat Dell.)

― youn, Friday, 4 March 2005 04:39 (twenty years ago)

yes!! i'm a switcher who's never regretted it

― s1ocki (slutsky), Friday, 4 March 2005 04:40 (twenty years ago)

PHEAR THE X.X.8 RELEASE

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 4 March 2005 04:48 (twenty years ago)

I'm a better windows sysadmin than I am at Macs now. I blame the government for this. I can't believe I had to go look at tech support pages to find out how to kill a misbehaving driver and delete the system log. Jesus christ. At least it's over for now.

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 04:50 (twenty years ago)

I had an easier time diagnosing problems on fucking SOLARIS than I do on this bitch

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 04:51 (twenty years ago)

we may bitch once in a while, but windows world is fucking hell compared to what we work with.

― cutty (mcutt), Friday, 4 March 2005 04:52 (twenty years ago)

I can't believe I tossed the developer toolkit folder, I had PLANS for some of that crap

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 04:53 (twenty years ago)

I'm beginning to come around to the idea that it's all in what you're used to and what you like, and I'm liking OS X less and less every day.

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 04:55 (twenty years ago)

I suppose when you've got an OS that's usually rock solid you get used to never having to use the diagnostic utilities, and that was my problem here, like at work on XP Pro I usually run terminal window and process manager about 3-4 times a day and shit

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 04:58 (twenty years ago)

It is good to check the fluids in a car on a regular basis not because they need to be checked so often but because you should KNOW HOW TO DO IT WITHOUT CONSULTING THE MANUAL

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 05:00 (twenty years ago)

I don't understand the shame in looking at a tech support page.

― Fish fingers all in a line (kenan), Friday, 4 March 2005 05:05 (twenty years ago)

i bet he doesn't like to ask for driving directions either!

― cutty (mcutt), Friday, 4 March 2005 05:07 (twenty years ago)

the shame is in the fact that solving this kind of garbage on OTHER, LESS ATTRACTIVE, MORE BUREAUCRATICALLY INCLINED operating systems is WHAT I GET PAID MEGABUCKS TO DO.

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 05:09 (twenty years ago)

oh.

― Fish fingers all in a line (kenan), Friday, 4 March 2005 05:10 (twenty years ago)

oh, you're one of those people i should be afraid of, or shy around.

― youn, Friday, 4 March 2005 05:13 (twenty years ago)

we may bitch once in a while, but windows world is fucking hell compared to what we work with.

Hell? My XP Pro laptop never crashes, never has driver issues and runs like a dream. No hell here.

― Trayce (trayce), Friday, 4 March 2005 05:14 (twenty years ago)

Everybody feels that way, even the other people I work with. What am I doing wrong? I'm not a prick like that dude Mark is! God is he ever a prick.

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 05:14 (twenty years ago)

Trayce shut up

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 05:15 (twenty years ago)

feh ;P

― Trayce (trayce), Friday, 4 March 2005 05:18 (twenty years ago)

I wasnt meaning to make light of yr PB issues Tom, soz.

― Trayce (trayce), Friday, 4 March 2005 05:19 (twenty years ago)

you hurt me in my backlit keyboard

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 05:21 (twenty years ago)

If it makes ya feel any better, since I installed a fucking ATI Radeon card into my other pc and my oh so helpful partner installed SP2 without asking me, the pc hangs on startup every other time I boot up, and crashes in some games. Fskcing microsoft I hate SP2.

― Trayce (trayce), Friday, 4 March 2005 05:27 (twenty years ago)

my computer has no problems besides it hates iTunes like Hitler hated Jews, apparently.

Sorry I was reading that Byrd/Nazi/Republican thread right before I clicked this.

BUT IT'S TRUE.

― Allyzay Dallas Multi-Pass (allyzay), Friday, 4 March 2005 05:31 (twenty years ago)

Yep, this is biting me. MIDI messages going into my MIDIMAN 4x4 are filling up my console.log. I have to leave my machine on overnight, every morning I have to reboot to delete that console.log file. Whoops.

PCs are making rapid advances on Apple -- cheaper, less prone to viruses, and the software development, out of nowhere, has started to stablize. Meanwhile on Macs, it's like living in a room where the ceiling drops another foot every six weeks i.e. every time Software Update fucking pops up and tells you to download a new OS -- gosh I wonder which of my essential applications is going to become unusable this time. People are confused, because it's the applications that are crashing -- but it's because the OS is impossible to develop on.

I still love my Mac at home, safely on 9.2

― milton parker (Jon L), Friday, 4 March 2005 05:43 (twenty years ago)

Panther Cache Cleaner, a little app made for this problem. One thing apple could learn from XP is to have OS restore points so you can at least roll back to a working system.

Milton, you're crazy, The difficult bit of the OS to develop on are the Carbon hangovers from OS 9. The Cocoa environment is a developers dream.

― Ed (dali), Friday, 4 March 2005 06:14 (twenty years ago)

I'm guessing what he means is that the OS updates so often that it's difficult for a developer to anticipate whether his app will crash in the next upgrade.

― Fish fingers all in a line (kenan), Friday, 4 March 2005 06:45 (twenty years ago)

that's all I mean. I'm not a developer myself, I'm in QA, it's just become impossible to even guess where the bugs are going to be coming from, every OS demands a full regression of everything, it's undoubtedly a dream to design something new from scratch now

― milton parker (Jon L), Friday, 4 March 2005 06:55 (twenty years ago)

Apple ought to be aiming to throw out Carbon over the next couple of years and have just one API, but that's not going to be easy. There's still a lot of carbon gubbins in the OS, not least QuickTime, but they should transition to a single API so they only have one to support (plus java I guess).

― Ed (dali), Friday, 4 March 2005 07:02 (twenty years ago)

I've never had an Apple update break a third party app though. All I've had is sytem services go (disk image mounting in 10.2.3) and had to be careful with firrmware on firewire drives. Oh and fink has been broken a couple of times but mainly due to moving between gcc versions and you can't exactly blame Apple for that.

― Ed (dali), Friday, 4 March 2005 07:05 (twenty years ago)

Can you get logrotate running on OS X?

Changing between gcc versions is always a nuisance - every year or two, they decide to break binary compatibility.

Hell? My XP Pro laptop never crashes, never has driver issues and runs like a dream. No hell here.

Similarly, I've had no problems at all, ever,* with my work desktop XP Pro machine. Then again, it doesn't have much in the way of nifty widgets, it's got a boring old i8xx graphics chipset, etc, etc.


* touch wood

― caitlin (caitlin), Friday, 4 March 2005 08:41 (twenty years ago)

since installing version 10.3.8 my I can't manage to keep my HD from filling up. Unaware of the problem I've already deleted a ton of apps and the entire developers' toolkit, plus a lot of crappy albums. I added a LaCie external to my wish list to remind me to buy one ASAP and tonight I have discovered my system.log file is 27 GB in size. I rebooted last night!!

I don't understand this. :-(((( What does it MEAN? I have 13,3,8. I must since I have just bought a new Apple. Now I'm freaking out. Should I toss the comp out the window into the pristine snow?

― nathalie barefoot in the head (stevie nixed), Friday, 4 March 2005 08:52 (twenty years ago)

No. You'll spoil the snow.

― caitlin (caitlin), Friday, 4 March 2005 08:53 (twenty years ago)

Nathelie, I shouldn't worry, but if it's the same model as Tom's I'd hold off installing 10.3.8. chances are it will work just fine. It does on my Mac, but every update a few users get bitten on the arse by the update.

logroate is avilible in the unstable branch of fink (Mac OS X source and binary package management based on apt-get, dselect etc.).

― Ed (dali), Friday, 4 March 2005 09:17 (twenty years ago)

It was only a third party device driver that was causing all the trouble. Kind of a bitch getting rid of it but it appeared to finally be fixed as of this morning. One thing to note, if your system.log file is 27GB in size, it's best not to try and clear it out from console.app, use the terminal and manually rm it instead. Console tries to actually display the contents when you select it, which results in a wrestling match for memory the likes of which God has never seen.

Also, when you hit 95% utilization on a HD fromatted with HFS+ or whatever the shit they're using now, it apparently can cause filesystem corruption issues. I assume I avoided this by sheer luck.
Another thing to note is that preferences may not be saved if your drive is full so even if you think you've changed something/corrected a problem you can find that the machine reverts to old shit after reboot.

I totally agree about rollback points. Fucking inane not to have that.

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 14:11 (twenty years ago)

MS Recommend not goin below 20% free space with NTFS, but I've not had any problems until getting below about 8%.

I've not had a any file system corrupption sailing close to the with with HFS+ (and only once with NTFS) and my hard drive maxes out all the time due to over greedy swap files.

― Ed (dali), Friday, 4 March 2005 14:18 (twenty years ago)

the restore points on winxp don't always work -- sometimes they mysteriously disappear right when i need 'em.

― jbr (Jody Beth Rosen), Friday, 4 March 2005 14:26 (twenty years ago)

As opposed to updating from 10.2 to 10.3, which some apps require, I don't understand why people feel the need to update 10.x incrementally if everything is running fine.

― 57 7th (calstars), Friday, 4 March 2005 14:47 (twenty years ago)

hmmm i seem to have lost about half a gig of free space in the hour or so since i rebooted my machine despite doing nothing apart from browsing ilx.

what does that MacFixIt article say?

― jed_ (jed), Friday, 4 March 2005 14:57 (twenty years ago)

i updated to 10.3.8 about 2 days ago.

― jed_ (jed), Friday, 4 March 2005 15:00 (twenty years ago)

In your experience Ed would you say the Windows swap file exhibits more gluttony than OS X? Because frankly knowing that the log was filling my HD up until I had no more writable space available and seeing that I was still able to run applications without crashing and hanging I must admit I was kind of impressed (not that that's actually impressive in light of half a gig of fucking actual real RAM but technology nowadays etc etc)

Jed use your Activity Monitor in the Applications/Utilities folder and tell us what you see.

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 15:06 (twenty years ago)

When I killed it for the last time the iShockXDriver was using 61% of my CPU. That's many, many errors a second.

― TOMBOT, Friday, 4 March 2005 15:08 (twenty years ago)

Windows swap files are limited by the size you set them two. OS X ones grab what they like and if you have less than 1.5gig of free space you are in trouble after a while.

Loosing half a gig of free space ten minutes after bootup is not unusual. If it keeps on knicking space past 2gig be worried.

― Ed (dali), Friday, 4 March 2005 15:14 (twenty years ago)

Here at work it's OS X land, but my own machine is still dual-boot. The majority of my work is done in 9.2.2, but I reboot into X for things like Melodyne and Ableton Live. I won't bother with a total switch into X until I pick up a G5 next year.

― Tantrum (Tantrum The Cat), Friday, 4 March 2005 15:32 (twenty years ago)

you guys are talking about sex, right? ;-)

― nathalie barefoot in the head (stevie nixed), Friday, 4 March 2005 15:33 (twenty years ago)

you guys are talking about sex, right? ;-)

Yes.

― Tantrum (Tantrum The Cat), Friday, 4 March 2005 15:44 (twenty years ago)

It was only a third party device driver that was causing all the trouble.

Bingo! Here's where all these "Microsoft issues" come from. Little wrong with XP itself, it's the billions of combinations of third party drivers which cause problems.

My car doesn't work because I filled it up with diesel instead of petrol - Ford, I blame you.

― Chewshabadoo (Chewshabadoo), Friday, 4 March 2005 16:15 (twenty years ago)

Someone at school was also having problems with 10.3.8.... He said that iTunes keeps crapping out on him and other weird stuff. I haven't had any problems myself, though.

― Aaron W (Aaron W), Friday, 4 March 2005 16:21 (twenty years ago)

As opposed to updating from 10.2 to 10.3, which some apps require, I don't understand why people feel the need to update 10.x incrementally if everything is running fine.

I'm coming around to this way of thinking. I updated from 10.3.4 to 10.3.7 a few weeks ago, and suddenly my startup time was 5+ minutes. One it starts, it runs fine, but wtf?

― Curious George Rides a Republican (Rock Hardy), Friday, 4 March 2005 16:37 (twenty years ago)

Yeah - with my upgrade, I've been having trouble with starting it up (15 minutes plus) and putting it to sleep (screen is black when it starts up again). And heaps of fan issues (fan going while it's sleeping). Ran Disk Warrior, cleared logs and ran Panther Cache Cleaner, but still no improvement. I avoided the 10.3.7 upgrade and figured, stupidly, that those issues had been worked out with 10.3.8. I've never had any issues with the OSX and upgrades before, so this is a pain. Grr.

― Guymauve (Guymauve), Friday, 4 March 2005 16:50 (twenty years ago)

I've been running all the 10.3.x updates as they have been released and the only problem I've had was the screen brightness not adjusting correctly after the 10.3.8 update.

Tossing the .plist preferences file fixed that.

Also, get Yasu for periodic system cleaning

― Elvis Telecom (Chris Barrus), Friday, 4 March 2005 19:50 (twenty years ago)

every time you run an update you should do a repair permissions in DISK UTILITY.

― cutty (mcutt), Friday, 4 March 2005 20:35 (twenty years ago)

I don't know what any of this means.

― adam.r.l. (nordicskilla), Friday, 4 March 2005 20:48 (twenty years ago)

It's just Tom shouting and mentioning his salary again.

― adam.r.l. (nordicskilla), Friday, 4 March 2005 20:53 (twenty years ago)

>every time you run an update you should do a repair permissions in DISK UTILITY.

in fact I've taken to just doing this randomly. it always seems to fix something.

my god I am so sick of apple, the last three years. it's almost like they are where Windows were at in 1995-8. and meanwhile, XP has kind of gotten itself together, both on the virus and stability fronts. how could this be?

― milton parker (Jon L), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:13 (twenty years ago)

I don't understand where all of these criticisms of the OS are coming from (not that XP is bad). 10.3 has reached a pinnacle in stability for me, I've never had such a reliable, and well integrated system. XP is pretty stable but it is a mess, configuration is a chore and there is no close integration and bags of legacy crap that ought to have been dumped years ago.

― Ed (dali), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:21 (twenty years ago)

ed, i'm with you.

― cutty (mcutt), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:23 (twenty years ago)

this thread should be retitled:

"Holy Shit iShock Driver is fucking my OS X 10.3.8 in the ass"

― cutty (mcutt), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:23 (twenty years ago)

what's ishock driver

― adam.r.l. (nordicskilla), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:24 (twenty years ago)

it's what was fucking tombot in the ass.

― cutty (mcutt), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:26 (twenty years ago)

ally

― adam.r.l. (nordicskilla), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:27 (twenty years ago)

iAlly

― adam.r.l. (nordicskilla), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:28 (twenty years ago)

repair permissions

What does this actually repair?

― Fish fingers all in a line (kenan), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:31 (twenty years ago)

my powerbook

― adam.r.l. (nordicskilla), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:33 (twenty years ago)

I just ran the permissions repair. Buncha buncha "errors" that it fixed. I wonder they were.

― Fish fingers all in a line (kenan), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:35 (twenty years ago)

"Occasionally in OS X some key file ownership and permissions get changed for whatever reason by applications and more frequently, program installers.  When ownership and permissions get changed, things just don't work as they should.  The symptoms might be programs quitting unexpectedly, preferences not being remembered, programs not launching, etc. This is where Repair Disk Permissions utility comes in.  This utility, which is part of the Apple Disk Utility program, corrects the ownership and permissions according to Apple specifications.  Frequently, this corrects many system and program errors. Repair Disk Permissions is a OS X specific utility and UNIX does not have such issues.  Hopefully, this a concern and procedure that will go away in the future."

― cutty (mcutt), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:36 (twenty years ago)

this solves 60% of peoples problems in my experience. running tech tool and diskwarrior often doesn't hurt either. and your mac will stay in wonderful shape.

― cutty (mcutt), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:37 (twenty years ago)

check yr wardrobe

― adam.r.l. (nordicskilla), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:37 (twenty years ago)

cutty, that's wonderful. Thank you. I hope this clears up all the mystery program crashes that happen to me almost daily. As it is, I've just been restarting the computer a lot.

― Fish fingers all in a line (kenan), Friday, 4 March 2005 22:48 (twenty years ago)


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