Police Brutality in Pr0v1d3nc3

Message Bookmarked

Bookmark Removed

http://cache.boston.com/bonzai-fba/Third_Party_Photo/2005/04/19/1113896595_8662.jpg
http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2005/04/19/man_arraigned_in_officers_death/
Esteban Carpio was led into court yesterday wearing what officials described as a ‘‘spit shield’’ intended to protect others from blood and other fluids. Providence police say Carpio was injured when he jumped out a window and in a struggle with police. Relatives allege police brutality. (Pool Photo)

― Open your eyes; you can fly! (ex machina), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 16:32 (twenty years ago)

http://www.livejournal.com/community/providence_ri/67554.html?#cutid1

"Some of the cops who removed the family were inconsiderate of their obvious horror, and some of them were wearing what appeared to be sap gloves, the function of which in a courtroom setting I can't imagine, other than to intimidate."

― Open your eyes; you can fly! (ex machina), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 16:34 (twenty years ago)

Sap Gloves:
http://www.tbotech.com/images/Gloves/sap-gloves-fist.jpg

― The Sensational Sulk (sexyDancer), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 16:36 (twenty years ago)

Well... it's pretty well assured that when you kill a veteran detective in a jail, the police are not going to be bringing you smoothies from the cafeteria. They probably just flipped out... and the beating is probably the best grounds for an appeal (coerced confession or something), because it sure seems like he's guilty of the copkilling.

― andy --, Tuesday, 19 April 2005 16:45 (twenty years ago)

Sure, but this isn't an isolated case -- the Providence cops are infamous as far as brutality goes.

― the krza (krza), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 16:51 (twenty years ago)

http://www.freemotionhiphop.com/grahamsmp3s/viktor.jpg

― mfdoom, Tuesday, 19 April 2005 17:10 (twenty years ago)

You gotta wonder if the mask was intended to cover his injured face and dehumanize him rather than to shield against fluids. Not that I'm taking the guy's side.

― Maria :D (Maria D.), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 17:26 (twenty years ago)

dehumanize him? nah, he did a fine job of that himself by fucking STABBING TO DEATH AN 84 YEAR OLD LADY AND KILLING A COP WITH HIS SERVICE REVOLVER IN POLICE HEADQUARTERS!!!

come on, people, this is pathetic. please find another poster boy for police brutality in providence, because you are doing the cause a real disservice by asking for ANY sympathy for this monster. I know there are plenty examples out there that reasonable people can get behind - but holding up this shithead will only make people sympathize with the cops.

― jimmy crackhorn, Tuesday, 19 April 2005 17:36 (twenty years ago)

he wasn't even necessarily a suspect in the stabbing, jimmy

― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 17:38 (twenty years ago)

not that i'm defending him for shooting a guy (cop or not), but let's not jump to conclusions here

― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 17:38 (twenty years ago)

What has he actually been convicted of?

― Thermo Thinwall (Thermo Thinwall), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 18:14 (twenty years ago)

He jumped from a 60 foot high window? 60 feet? That's fucking nuts, it's a wonder he can limp at all.

― andy --, Tuesday, 19 April 2005 18:21 (twenty years ago)

Use your brain, Jimmy: what's the fucking point of a line that goes "police brutality is bad (except when the scumbag deserved it)?"

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 18:35 (twenty years ago)

I mean, for Christ's sake, the police think everybody they beat the crap out of had it coming -- that's why they beat the crap out of them in the first place. It's fucking appalling that we even half-tolerate the idea that of course they're going to go nuts on the true low-lifes -- because as soon as you turn your eyes away, you're just throwing open the door for them to use their discretion in brutalizing whoever they feel like brutalizing. And cops aren't supposed to brutalize people in their custody; period; not period period period with a "but" lingering somewhere beyond, but just period, full fucking stop. You can throw up your hands and figure maybe this guy was asking for it (which I maintain is seriously appalling on your part), but the fact is that guys and cases like this tend to be the moments that expose big systematic flaws in the ways cops approach their jobs and their power; waiting for them to get so depraved that they break some innocent cute little white girl's face is both idiotic and irresponsible.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 18:41 (twenty years ago)

you say that it is "seriously appalling" that someone would think this guy was "asking for it", because he killed a cop with his service revolver. I strongly disagree with you.

― jimmy crackhorn, Tuesday, 19 April 2005 19:11 (twenty years ago)

innofuckingcent until proven fucking guilty

― same initials (initials), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 19:13 (twenty years ago)

beating a suspect to an unrecognizable pulp is NOT appropriate redress for a failure of operational security.

― andrew l. r. (allocryptic), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 19:19 (twenty years ago)

Jesus, Jimmy, you're exhibiting both really poor morality and really bad reading comprehension; I'm not sure which is more vile. I said it's appalling that you'd accept that there's any situation in which cops are justified in brutalizing suspects. You can't even argue with me about this, because it's law as far back as the constitution: the police have no more right to brutalize this guy than this guy has to stab old ladies. And my point is that as soon as you look the other way and give cops leeway to brutalize a guy like this, you're basically handing them permission to brutalize whosoever they fucking feel like brutalizing on any given day. Nobody should be willing to do that; we have standards, for fuck's sake, and the police of all people should be expected to hew to them even more closely than anyone else.

But hey, so long as they just brutalize black criminals, there will always be safe white assholes giving them boys-will-be-boys pats on the back and permission to go above the law.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 19:37 (twenty years ago)

So the guy breaks out a glass window and jumps out sixty feet to the concrete sidewalk below, and everyone looks at his injuries thinking, "Those pesky Providence cops have done it again!"

― Pleasant Plains /// (Pleasant Plains ///), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 19:39 (twenty years ago)

it was a grassy mound.

― same initials (initials), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 19:42 (twenty years ago)

Hey, I didn't even read the article: I'm just getting moralistic about Jimmy's dumb "probably deserved it" line.

P.S.: Now I have read the article, and he apparently managed to land on glass and run a decent distance away -- unless he landed on his face, I'd guess someone did some work in the station.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 19:43 (twenty years ago)

Look at that mask, dude. Unless this guy landed on his FACE after jumping out the window (in which case, he'd be DEAD), he was most certainly beaten, and probably with great enthusiasm.

― andrew l. r. (allocryptic), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 19:44 (twenty years ago)

oops, sorry to repeat your point, nabisco

― andrew l. r. (allocryptic), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 19:46 (twenty years ago)

Also, he was being questioned because he had a similar name to an actual suspect in the stabbing.

― Open your eyes; you can fly! (ex machina), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 19:55 (twenty years ago)

Really I shouldn't say "safe white assholes" which is totally jocky and inarticulate and race-baiting of me. But the thing is that I'm honestly disturbed by the fact that so many Americans are willing to give the cops leeway to practice vigilante justice. And I think that attitude has more than a little to do with the sense that the cops are on "their" side in some kind of little war -- that there's zero risk of their winding up on the business end of that vigilante action. Those people who don't quite have that assurance -- say, that black guy in Milwaukee who got beaten half to death just for walking into a party full of off-duty cops -- that guy whose friends called the police, and then when the squad car got there two cops jumped out and joined in on the beating -- well, let's just say that a lot of us aren't so comfortable with police getting lots of extra-judicial leeway, because in nearly every case it just creates a culture where they feel freer and freer to brutalize anyone they feel like brutalizing, safe in the knowledge that a whole bunch of middle-class people will never give much of a shit. Sorry to hound you, Jimmy, but I do think that attitude thoroughly reprehensible, and I kind of hope you choke on it.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:00 (twenty years ago)

Which isn't to say that I expect cops to be superhuman moralists who don't get a little tested when one of their colleagues gets shot. But that's enough of a test as it is; we don't have to condone their actions when they fail to control themselves. Condoning it is pretty much the same thing as endorsing it, and I only see one inhuman thing on this thread.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:03 (twenty years ago)

really poor morality is far worse than really bad reading comprehension.

otherwise nabisco absolutely OTM.

― hstencil (hstencil), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:05 (twenty years ago)

A black off-duty police officer was shot and killed by two fellow officers after he tried to help them break up a fight at a local restaurant, authorities said.

A man who brandished a gun was arrested and charged with murder. Police acknowledge that he did not shoot Patrolman Cornell Young but claim he caused the death.

― Open your eyes; you can fly! (ex machina), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:11 (twenty years ago)

Human Rights Watch on Providence Police Brutality

― andrew l. r. (allocryptic), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:17 (twenty years ago)

nabisco is far off the money. if you're innocent while being questioned (not under arrest) you don't kill an officer. this isn't an innocent-til-proven-guilty case.

― paulhw (paulhw), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:18 (twenty years ago)

"Human Rights Watch chose to investigate Providence, Rhode Island and the surrounding area because the police have received an unusually large number of complaints per capita, according to a nationwide report published by the Justice Department in 1991. The report cited three Rhode Island police departments as second only to New Orleans in the number of excessive force complaints. The relatively small communities - Providence, East Providence, and Pawtucket - each had complaint rates at least ten times as high as nearby Boston's. Only six state police agencies were included on the Justice Department list, and Rhode Island's ranked highest for complaints, with a rate of complaints four to twenty-five times higher than any other state agency."

― andrew l. r. (allocryptic), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:19 (twenty years ago)

FWIW, paul - I think the guy is mentally ill.

― Open your eyes; you can fly! (ex machina), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:22 (twenty years ago)

Also, when the cops were looking for this guy, they busted into AS220 and broke a show up.

― Open your eyes; you can fly! (ex machina), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:24 (twenty years ago)

paul what exactly makes a case NOT innocent-until-provy-guilty-worthy?

― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:25 (twenty years ago)

Fucking Christ what's with the retardation on this thread? Sorry to go put the guns on you, Paul, but try to read and think properly. For one thing, I have never once expressed an opinion on this guy's innocence or guilt. More importantly -- and I can't believe I even need to type this, like I'm chatting with four-year-olds -- whether or not a person is guilty of a crime, police have no right whatsoever to brutalize them! I don't mean to talk down, but you'd have to be a moron to forget this for even one second!

So here's another thing that's starting to disgust me: whenever police are accused of brutality, here or elsewhere, everyone's attention turns straight to the victim, straight to whether the victim was a criminal or not, whether he or she "deserved" it. Reminder: nobody, guilty or not, "deserves" it; they could be tried and convinced and sentenced to police brutality and it'd still be unconstitutional and illegal. Thinking anything else is right up on there on a par with saying rape victims were asking for it.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:26 (twenty years ago)

the police's function isn't to determine innocence or guilt, people.

― hstencil (hstencil), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:27 (twenty years ago)

Which -- again -- is not to say that I have any opinions about this case or draw any conclusions whatsoever from a brief-as-hell newspaper article. My only point is that "but he was guilty" is the stupidest response to accusations of police brutality that I have ever, ever, ever, ever heard.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:28 (twenty years ago)

That's terrible logic, Paul. Maybe the guy got scared (and it's certainly not like there's zero chance that the detective was roughing him up at that point), maybe he's mentally ill, maybe whatever. How the hell did he get the cop's service revolver (which would have been on his hip or under his arm, buckled in)? Just randomly leap across the room, unbuckle it and shoot? Why were there no cops in the room or watching? There an infinite number of things we don't know about the situation.

It's amazing how quickly people look to excuse violence committed by authority when the victim 'had it coming.'

― milozauckerman (miloaukerman), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:29 (twenty years ago)

xpost paulhw

from here: http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=683054

"Carpio's family said he had recently been experiencing mental problems."

The truth is, we have no idea what transpired in the Public Safety Complex before the detective was killed; it's likely we will never get the full story.

And what was the firearm doing in the interrogation room anyway? That's definitely not procedure, for obvious security reasons. What if it was held to his head to try and force a confession?

And it's called DUE PROCESS, by the way. Sorry if you want to make special exemptions for "really bad guys."

― andrew l. r. (allocryptic), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:30 (twenty years ago)

The guy was wearing a concealed holster and all the other cops left. It was an "informal chat"

― Open your eyes; you can fly! (ex machina), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:31 (twenty years ago)

DETECTIVE: You know what, scumbag? I have cancer.
CARPIO: Oh, man. I'm really sorry, dude.
DETECTIVE: It's all this stress. Scumbags like you. My body's eating itself from the inside.
CARPIO: That really sucks, man. But you gotta keep hope, keep up the fight.
DETECTIVE: No, no. I'm done. It's not worth it. It's all too much. And what with assholes like you stabbing old ladies...
CARPIO: No, seriously, that wasn't me.
DETECTIVE: Sure it wasn't.
CARPIO: I swear, man! Hey, what are you doing with that gun?
DETECTIVE: I can't take the pain anymore.
CARPIO: Oh god, for a second I thought you were going to shoot me.
DETECTIVE: You wish.
CARPIO: Listen, it's never as bad as it seems. You can get through this. You can ... wait, what do you mean, I wish?
DETECTIVE: Well, what are they gonna see when they come in here?
CARPIO: You're not really going to ...
DETECTIVE: Enjoy yourself, Carpio. Tell my wife I love her.

― spakeshear, Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:46 (twenty years ago)

That's quite a dark turn of mind you got there, spakeshear... creepy...

― andrew l. r. (allocryptic), Tuesday, 19 April 2005 20:59 (twenty years ago)

seven years pass...

You would think police would be professional and educated enough to backdown in the face of a lawsuit.

Today I read a news story about how police hacked cell phones of those who might have a strong case against them.

Police have absolute power in our society, they don't have to submit proof or even be logical. In the US, the best answer is to seek psychiatric help and deal with police power.

― โตเกียวเหมียวเหมียว aka Bulgarian Tourist Chamber (Mount Cleaners), Thursday, 7 June 2012 15:41 (thirteen years ago)

http://whomurderedrobertwone.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/alarma2.gif

― shit_ebooks (am0n), Thursday, 7 June 2012 15:46 (thirteen years ago)

Also in my experience police are misogynists. When I was in a car crash they made sexist comments about my appearance and fashion, like getting dressed up was for homosexuals.

Also I found out the guilty party in my crash was a beloved pet of arrogant police. So like a good respectful citizen I obeyed their superior judgment.

It's best not to cross the police, a gun makes you smarter than everyone else.

― โตเกียวเหมียวเหมียว aka Bulgarian Tourist Chamber (Mount Cleaners), Thursday, 7 June 2012 15:49 (thirteen years ago)

You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.