TS: American Beauty vs. Ice Storm

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― Remy (x Jeremy), Thursday, 21 April 2005 23:53 (twenty years ago)

ice storm but both kinda meh.

― hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 21 April 2005 23:57 (twenty years ago)

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B000056BSG.01._PE_SCMZZZZZZZ_.jpg VS http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B00003CWL6.01._PE25_SCMZZZZZZZ_.jpg

― Remy (x Jeremy), Thursday, 21 April 2005 23:57 (twenty years ago)

I shoulda thrown in Ordinary People, too.

― Remy (x Jeremy), Thursday, 21 April 2005 23:57 (twenty years ago)

oh christ, this is impossible. I dislike both of them tremendously. I'll say The Ice Storm, because it has nothing as stupid as "OMG my son is GAY because is appears he's giving a blowjob to the guy next door! Nevermind that half of my view is obscured by a WALL! GAY!"

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Thursday, 21 April 2005 23:58 (twenty years ago)

also, Kevin Spacey's move from essential character actor to worthless leading man was completely by American Beauty, whereas The Ice Storm reinforced my opinion that Sigourney Weaver is awesome.

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Thursday, 21 April 2005 23:59 (twenty years ago)

completed

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Thursday, 21 April 2005 23:59 (twenty years ago)

I just saw American Beauty today for the first time since, like, the theater. It's sorta impossible for me to understand why everybody's so impressed w. the performances in it ... I think they're awful crummy.

― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:00 (twenty years ago)

the ice storm.

without Happiness by todd s., american beauty wouldn't have existed.

yeah, the cast of the ice storm is stronger.

― jr. miss, Friday, 22 April 2005 00:02 (twenty years ago)

sigourney weaver is awesome, def.

― hstencil (hstencil), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:03 (twenty years ago)

Joan Allen and Kevin Kline are also fantastic. Everyone is, really. I guess the story itself doesn't do much for me. I'm not even sure why I said this was a tough call a few minutes ago. God, I hate American Beauty.

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:04 (twenty years ago)

the magic of the ice storm lies mainly in the quiet dignity of its web of characters, no joke.

― jr. miss now, Friday, 22 April 2005 00:06 (twenty years ago)

Amercican Beauty feels like a movie that would have been 'edgy' or 'current' in 1965. Like if Nicholas Ray had directed it, maybe. But it's just sort angsty and cartoonish now. And the Ice Storm (which I do like) manages to capture an unique tone and believable sense of character. I've always identified w. the Elijah Wood character in a way that's - probably - not healthy.

― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:08 (twenty years ago)

I liked American Beauty a lot more the second and third time I saw it. Haven't seen The Ice Storm. May I just say that I think Solondz is a cynical shitbag and might as well be a child pornographer? The ideologies of the two films are worlds apart. I hate that motherfucker, but that's OT, thankfully.

― Shatterproof Glass (dymaxia), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:08 (twenty years ago)

Dunno about that ... but I think American Beauty & Happiness ARE good for comparison. As far as I'm concerned, they're both pseudo-incisive melodramas about the Hidden Secrets of Suburban Males.

― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:11 (twenty years ago)

2 comic melodramas in offending Realist sensibilty shockah. American Beauty is 20 minutes too long but the homophobe/xenophobe next door punchline is the whole point: Mendes sez ver US=unpredictable neighbour fueled by H8.

Ice Storm's collapsing power-line is so clinically Deus Ex Machina that it's His-terical that its obvishness isn't noted = Carter admin's loss of control of power generation.

That car-key in the bowl joke is the nastiest/truest riff on misogyny ever filmed.

― Failin Huxley (noodle vague), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:11 (twenty years ago)

I don't really think Ice Storm or Happiness qualifies as comic melodrama, but maybe I'm just being curmudgeonly.

― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:13 (twenty years ago)

qualify.

― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:14 (twenty years ago)

AMERICAN BEAUTY IS TERRIBLE. Sorry for yelling.

― J (Jay), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:19 (twenty years ago)

Okelly Dokelly. Ice Storm, Happiness and American Beauty all run exaggerated emiotional curves = melodrama. The central characters learn and self-improve thru the action of the story (including dead Spacey) = comedy. Ergo, comic melodrama.

― Failin Huxley (noodle vague), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:23 (twenty years ago)

American Beauty is practically slapstick in some of its heavy-handed humor, whereas The Ice Storm seems to have this comedy of discomfort, but a more empathetic sort of discomfort. Happiness seems to have this comedy of sadistic discomfort.

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:29 (twenty years ago)

Ice Storm is the best. There's such a strong sense of mood in that. And great art direction.

― jaymc (jaymc), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:39 (twenty years ago)

I have a soft spot for this kind of movie, btw.

― jaymc (jaymc), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:41 (twenty years ago)

If I may play Mister Moviefone - I have selected: The Ice Storm - RATED R!

― Ken L (Ken L), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:54 (twenty years ago)

I am innocent of each, mercifully. Which one has more skin?

― Aimless (Aimless), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:59 (twenty years ago)

American Beauty is despicable. Horrible, horrible movie. I really can't think of any movie I've hated more.

So, it's the Ice Storm all the way.

― Moosie Grosvenor (Arthur), Friday, 22 April 2005 00:59 (twenty years ago)

― Failin Huxley (noodle vague), Friday, 22 April 2005 01:00 (twenty years ago)

Ice Storm! American Beauty suxx!

― scott seward (scott seward), Friday, 22 April 2005 01:01 (twenty years ago)

The Rick Moody novel is terrible, so I've never watched The Ice Storm (I've seen it, I think, but remember nothing, I didn't even realize Katie Holmes and Sigourney Weaver were in it until another thread).

American Beauty seemed rebellious and insightful the first time I saw it (at ~17), and embarassing every time after that. That last speech about swelling up like a balloon with the joy of life ugh.

― milozauckerman (miloaukerman), Friday, 22 April 2005 01:05 (twenty years ago)

part of the reason i liked the movie and the book is cuz i have vivid memories of growing up in connecticut in the 70's and it gave me cool flashbacks. i didn't think the book was terrible, but i probably like the movie more. but i am generally a sucker for snowy movies. american beauty just made me cringe. i'd much rather watch the ref. which was similar in some ways and funnier AND snowier. i do like six feet under though.

― scott seward (scott seward), Friday, 22 April 2005 01:11 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, exactly. American Beauty was an annoying message movie of some kind and I was surprised that the same guy had done the light-years better Six Feet Under. I grew up in NYC in the 70s and then went to college in Connecticut and the Ice Storm's sense of place and time seemed pretty accurate to me.

― Ken L (Ken L), Friday, 22 April 2005 01:29 (twenty years ago)

Movie of Ice Storm is way better than the book. Way less irony.

― jaymc (jaymc), Friday, 22 April 2005 01:31 (twenty years ago)

Not mad about any of them. Happiness is weirdly compulsive viewing but it is nevertheless the sound of someone trying so hard to shock that you just end up rolling your eyes and thinking, "Well, if that's what it takes to get noticed..."

The Ice Storm I definately enjoyed watching unfold. I'm not sure it is a film I'd rush to re-watch and I saw it some time ago, but I enjoyed the story. It has a good two second sex scene that I think was really sombre - yeah, some of it stuck in my mind so it had its very good moments.

American Beauty - caught it at the cinema and didn't get it. Saw it again on DVD - still didn't get it. The ending was terrible, the movie was a mess and awfully one note. And it was really quite silly.

― Nam.C., Friday, 22 April 2005 01:31 (twenty years ago)

Your life is one note, you cock-farmer.

― Failin Huxley (noodle vague), Friday, 22 April 2005 01:34 (twenty years ago)

woah. what a terrible post.

i basically agree with s. seward and Moosie Grosvenor - i can't think of a film i've hated more than AB except maybe The Usual Suspects. having said that it's been so long since i've seen AB that i cant really rememeber why i dislike it so much beyond a kneejerk antipathy to Spacey.

― jed_ (jed), Friday, 22 April 2005 01:41 (twenty years ago)

Your life is one note, you cock-farmer.
-- Failin Huxley (noodle_vagu...), April 22nd, 2005.

What a jolly japester you are. Who are you? Oh yeah - another anonymous internet fellow I've clearly made an impression on. Score one to me then. Cheers!

― Nam_c., Friday, 22 April 2005 01:49 (twenty years ago)

Cock.

― Failin Huxley (noodle vague), Friday, 22 April 2005 01:51 (twenty years ago)

Farmer.

― Failin Huxley (noodle vague), Friday, 22 April 2005 01:51 (twenty years ago)

Who are you?

I'm just a concerned citizen.

― Failin Huxley (noodle vague), Friday, 22 April 2005 02:08 (twenty years ago)

Why did I dislike it? Well, for all the reasons everyone else has mentioned (Kevin Spacey, all of the other performances, the heavy-handed humor). I thought the homophobic neighbor zinger was pretty corny. The acting styles were so different in a really grating way--Annette Bening and Spacey so broad and shrill, the kids so depressed and moony. I have to admit, though, the hoopla really added to my dislike of film (the sedate thinking man's picture type ad campaign, all those Oscar nominations, the buzz around town) so maybe it's not as bad as I remember. I don't know, even the "You're so busted" scene at the drive-thru really got on my nerves.

And I think maybe part of the reason I like the Ice Storm so much more than American Beauty is because, like Scott, I grew up in Connecticut in the 70s and it reminds me a little of my teen years. But, also, the director is so much more sympathetic to the characters! And it's so nice to look at.

― Moosie Grosvenor (Arthur), Friday, 22 April 2005 02:11 (twenty years ago)

and the music is better. even kevin spacey is good in this movie!

― jed_ (jed), Friday, 22 April 2005 02:13 (twenty years ago)

Spacey's quitting speech from AB still merits a childish giggle or two.

― milozauckerman (miloaukerman), Friday, 22 April 2005 02:15 (twenty years ago)

Wait, jed, you mean Kline, right? Cause I was thinking the same thing. He can be really likeable when he tones it down a bit. Can't say the same for Spacey, though.

― Moosie Grosvenor (Arthur), Friday, 22 April 2005 02:19 (twenty years ago)

jed, I thought I was the only one who hated The Usual Suspects.

― Ken L (Ken L), Friday, 22 April 2005 02:19 (twenty years ago)

oh no way. the "my boss is into hoors on company visa" plot point is deck-rigging of the worst worst kind. have some balls, alan ball; if your guy is going to quit, have him just quit, don't let him keep the $$.

AB has kept me from investigating "6 Ft Under." like, no way this is going to be good. i'm probably wrong, people have told me so.

― g e o f f (gcannon), Friday, 22 April 2005 02:22 (twenty years ago)

xxxpost

― g e o f f (gcannon), Friday, 22 April 2005 02:22 (twenty years ago)

plus later ms. bening flips out abt the camaro and joblessness, and he never tells her "well i'm still getting paid, the fuck cares??" totally weak.

― g e o f f (gcannon), Friday, 22 April 2005 02:24 (twenty years ago)

woops, of course i meant Kline... Spacey, no, never, please.

lets form a club, ken!

― jed_ (jed), Friday, 22 April 2005 02:24 (twenty years ago)

The Ice Storm. American Beauty felt a lot more contrived and overwrought (the exception being maybe the power line collapsing in the Ice Storm). Also, I can't remember the Ice Storm having anything similar to those terrible plastic bag sequences in American Beauty. I'm not sure if I cringed my way through AB -- probably more like giggled at all the inappropriate, supposedly heavy parts, getting dirty looks from the audience...

― the krza (krza), Friday, 22 April 2005 02:32 (twenty years ago)

I gotta be honest -- I have some quibbles w. The Ice Storm, but the electric-lines sequence isn't among them. I actually think that's anticipated from the very first scene, and exceedingly well-used.

― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 22 April 2005 03:26 (twenty years ago)

Skipping 9 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

Ice Storm by a mile. However, I remember Yi Yi being a millions times better than American Beauty at trying to say the same thing. AB was just so hackneyed and the characters (well played) were all some fantasy stereotype of some imagined American suburban darkness.

― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Friday, 22 April 2005 06:08 (twenty years ago)

Katie Holmes has never been hotter, true.

Jamey Sheridan as the awkward father! And Henry Czerny as the sleazy pal of Kline's. All good.

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Friday, 22 April 2005 06:09 (twenty years ago)

Family Guy parodied AB very well (god complains about the imagined significance of the trash).

― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Friday, 22 April 2005 06:26 (twenty years ago)

i am really surprised at the one-sidedness of this thread. i love American Beauty, didn't like The Ice Storm so much, but i guess that makes me some kind of retard. if i'm honest, i had my suspicions.

i don't tend to like films which are unrepentingly bleak. The Ice Storm was like that - people are scum the world is shit, bite me. whereas American Beauty had a bit of hope for redemption in there.

i think they were both very well made films, though.

― Lee F# (fsharp), Friday, 22 April 2005 08:17 (twenty years ago)

The Ice Storm is great, and you are all sexually retrded for not mentioning Christini Ricci's "I'll show you mine if you show me yours." I wish she'd been my neighbor when I was ten.

The Ice storm, along with The Godfather and Jaws, is also one of the few movies that are better than the book.

― shookout (shookout), Friday, 22 April 2005 10:02 (twenty years ago)

Not quite.

― Ken L (Ken L), Friday, 22 April 2005 10:22 (twenty years ago)

American Beauty seemed rebellious and insightful the first time I saw it (at ~17), and embarassing every time after that. That last speech about swelling up like a balloon with the joy of life ugh.

Exactly. It is the chief offender in diminishing returns. I can't even stand to think about it now, because the only thing that comes to mind is how fucking shrill Annette Bening was in it.

LET US ALL WEEP FOR THE SUBURBAN MAN!

― sugarpants: new and improved! (sugarpants), Friday, 22 April 2005 13:26 (twenty years ago)

The topless scene with the cheerleader chick (I can't think of her name right this second) is also incredibly gratuitous.

― sugarpants: new and improved! (sugarpants), Friday, 22 April 2005 13:27 (twenty years ago)

i was v disappointed by 'AB' at the time, but if you watch it as a comedy, it's okay but a bit sentimental. checy chase would have handled spacey's role better. 'ice storm' is great. it's set at thanksgiving 1973 btw, so nixon. energy crisis has just begun iirc.

― N_RQ, Friday, 22 April 2005 13:34 (twenty years ago)

Amercican Beauty feels like a movie that would have been 'edgy' or 'current' in 1965. Like if Nicholas Ray had directed it, maybe

I thoroughly dislike AB but this probably would have been great!

I have never seen The Ice Storm in it's entirety but I really liked what I have seen of it.

― Leon Future Coffee (Ex Leon), Friday, 22 April 2005 13:40 (twenty years ago)

My family really likes The Ice Storm, and it's an interesting lineup of actors for the time of its filming, doubt you could get them all together now. Not yet seen it, though, even though I enjoy much of Ang Lee's work. Not Ride with the Devil, though, yech.

Never was even slightly tempted to view AB and I have to admit everything on this thread is rather reconfirming that hunch.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 22 April 2005 13:43 (twenty years ago)

Ride with the Devil was super corny.

― Leon Future Coffee (Ex Leon), Friday, 22 April 2005 13:46 (twenty years ago)

And to top it all off, Jewel! What the flying fuck! Secret reasons why everyone went nuts over Crouching Tiger -- he had thankfully rebounded from major asshattery and Michelle Yeoh is Jewel's antithesis.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 22 April 2005 13:52 (twenty years ago)

Cripes I still remember seeing Jewel's name appear on a trailer for the film -- oh, the sinking feeling.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 22 April 2005 13:53 (twenty years ago)

'ride with the devil' > 'cold mountain'

?jewell > white stripes guy?

― N_RQ, Friday, 22 April 2005 13:54 (twenty years ago)

It's not difficult to be better than Cold Mountain, though.

― Leon Future Coffee (Ex Leon), Friday, 22 April 2005 13:56 (twenty years ago)

I actually have no problem with those calculations. (Have I ever mentioned how much Minghella bores me senseless?)

Hahahah XPOST!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 22 April 2005 13:57 (twenty years ago)

t.newman's AB score is responsible for the most irritating soundtrack trend in ages. also AB wants to be progressive but it's center is embittered by feminist gains; Ice Storm secretly takes place 30 years in the future on that front.

― jones (actual), Friday, 22 April 2005 13:58 (twenty years ago)

The end of Cold Mountain is hilarious though. It's almost up there with Showgirls in the unintentionally funny moments.

x-post

― Leon Future Coffee (Ex Leon), Friday, 22 April 2005 13:59 (twenty years ago)

Johnathan Rhys-Meyers > Brendan Gleason (though only just)

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Friday, 22 April 2005 13:59 (twenty years ago)

i really liked ride with the devil but i can't remember why :(

― jones (actual), Friday, 22 April 2005 14:10 (twenty years ago)

Because it has a man named Skeet in it?

― jocelyn (Jocelyn), Friday, 22 April 2005 14:12 (twenty years ago)

sigourney weaver is so great. i wd like to see 'rwtd' again. i think i know more about the history, now.

― N_RQ, Friday, 22 April 2005 14:13 (twenty years ago)

Skeet's career since then hasn't been much. Also, this is his current lead IMDB photo:

http://ia.imdb.com/media/imdb/01/I/24/36/12m.jpg

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 22 April 2005 14:13 (twenty years ago)

Yi Yi is so good.

― g e o f f (gcannon), Friday, 22 April 2005 14:17 (twenty years ago)

Thank you, Lee, for keeping me from being the only person on ILE who liked American Beauty.

The Ice Storm is still better but I still really liked AB.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 22 April 2005 14:19 (twenty years ago)

I thought hating American Beauty made me unusual. Apparently not. But The Ice Storm wins if only for that priest-on-the-make character.

― Nemo (JND), Friday, 22 April 2005 14:50 (twenty years ago)

everyone hates "american beauty" now, which is not a bad thing.

― Amateur(ist) (Amateur(ist)), Friday, 22 April 2005 14:51 (twenty years ago)

I guess I haven't talked to anybody about it since it came out, but when I saw it I was the only one among my friends who didn't like it. Huzzah for progress!

― Nemo (JND), Friday, 22 April 2005 14:53 (twenty years ago)

I don't really think either of these films are 'bleak,' but maybe I'm being obtuse? (mega xpost)

― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 22 April 2005 14:53 (twenty years ago)

it's an interesting lineup of actors for the time of its filming, doubt you could get them all together now

why? aside from the fact that christina ricci's slid down a few pegs in hollywood sinc then, everyone else is still highly respected

― kyle (akmonday), Friday, 22 April 2005 14:54 (twenty years ago)

Ice Storm II: Electric Boogaloo

― Nemo (JND), Friday, 22 April 2005 14:56 (twenty years ago)

Kyle: it was mainly the Ricci thing, I admit. ;-) But possibly in terms of dynamics of studio pitching, I figure (at the least, reverse Wood and Kline's relative profiles, as Wood has yet to film his Wild Wild West).

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 22 April 2005 14:59 (twenty years ago)

eight months pass...

"Hello and welcome to Moveefone. You have selected The Ice Storm -RATED R!"

― Redd Harvest (Ken L), Thursday, 22 December 2005 08:58 (twenty years ago)

"For showtimes today- PRESS ONE NOW!"

― Redd Harvest (Ken L), Thursday, 22 December 2005 08:59 (twenty years ago)

"For other showtimes- PRESS TWO NOW!"

― Redd Harvest (Ken L), Thursday, 22 December 2005 09:00 (twenty years ago)

"Why don't you just tell me the name of the movie you're looking for?"

― Paunchy Stratego (kenan), Thursday, 22 December 2005 09:01 (twenty years ago)

"If you know the name of theater which you'd like to attend- press the first three letters NOW!"

― Redd Harvest (Ken L), Thursday, 22 December 2005 09:05 (twenty years ago)

two years pass...

Is the Ice Storm deserving of a Criterion release?

― milo z, Thursday, 3 April 2008 04:40 (eighteen years ago)

yes

― Edward III, Thursday, 3 April 2008 04:42 (eighteen years ago)

also, american beauty vs. any movie = any movie wins

― Edward III, Thursday, 3 April 2008 05:04 (eighteen years ago)

american beauty vs. young einstein

young einstein is winner

― Edward III, Thursday, 3 April 2008 05:05 (eighteen years ago)

american beauty vs. captain corelli's mandolin

captain corelli's mandolin is winner

― Edward III, Thursday, 3 April 2008 05:06 (eighteen years ago)

american beauty vs. good burger

good burger is winner

― Edward III, Thursday, 3 April 2008 05:06 (eighteen years ago)

american beauty vs. swiss family robinson

swiss fucking family robinson is winner

― Edward III, Thursday, 3 April 2008 05:08 (eighteen years ago)

american beauty vs. good burger
good burger is winner

Like anyone would disagree with this example in particular. Even Morbius.

― Ned Raggett, Thursday, 3 April 2008 05:09 (eighteen years ago)

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y176/edwardiii/GoodBurgerCriterionCollection.jpg

― Edward III, Thursday, 3 April 2008 05:23 (eighteen years ago)

I hear the commentary track from Abe Vigoda is a hoot.

― Ned Raggett, Thursday, 3 April 2008 05:30 (eighteen years ago)

I'll buy that just for the cover art!

― Cosmo Vitelli, Thursday, 3 April 2008 06:32 (eighteen years ago)

http://mattzollerseitz.blogspot.com/2008/03/criterion-collection-426-ice-storm.html

― Gukbe, Thursday, 3 April 2008 07:12 (eighteen years ago)

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