please help ease my mind about looking for another job

Message Bookmarked
Bookmark Removed
I have to face facts -- this job is going to be the death of me if I stay at it much longer. I hate it more all the time. The opportunities I have been promised are not going to come to pass in any meaningful way. I have been given the opportunity to learn to lay out the whole magazine with InDesign, and be able to put on my resume that I now have practical experience with this, but I don't think my boss is very committed to the idea. He is reluctant to pay for the software (he refuses to order it from anywhere that will make him pay tax on it; he does this with everything he buys, apparently), and will be even more reluctant when he finds out how long it may take me to learn it, no matter that I have told him that it may take a while. He hears nothing he does not want to hear. He is far more interested in my doing bafflingly complex and lengthy administrative tasks for his latest project, a "non-profit" organization that has no members and is a boondoggle from start to finish, not least of all because he's unwilling to spend any money on it. It should have been clear to me all along, and I don't know why it wasn't -- there's a reason why I work in an office of three people. It's not because my boss is ambitious, generous, and easy to work with. Mostly, my job is to stroke his ego. That's all any of this is -- a vanity project. The magazine, all of it. A few weeks ago, I was thinking that it would be worth it to stay and learn what I can, to stick it out no matter how unpleasant working for this goofball is. But so I stay, so what then? Now I have experience with the software, but no portfolio of any designs to be proud of, because he wants the magazine to look a certain way, and that way is quite bad. I will be doing work that I know is bad, just for... what? The experience of doing bad work? Or am I missing something?

Also -- I'm extremely worried about how to explain to my next prospective employer that I want to continue doing what I have been doing, but not at the same place. How do you someone that? I can't tell them my current employer is a goofball -- that reflects not on him, but on my people skills (and there's a bit of truth to that). I can't tell them that I don't make enough money, even though I am severely underpaid. That makes me sound mercenary and flighty. And I can't tell them that I don't like the work, because the work is largely exactly what I want to be doing, nominally anyway. I'm "Assistant Editor." Sounds impressive, even. So why am I leaving? They will want to know.

I always crumble at job interviews and tell the truth. Maybe there's a bullshit speech with a grain of truth in it that I could be rehearsing in the mirror in between flurries of sending out my resume? I need to move on, for my health and for my financial well-being, but I don't want to shoot myslf in the foot career-wise before I even have a real career.

This is the part of life that I'm worst at.

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:46 (twenty years ago)

Kenan, you should tell any prospective employers that you're looking for new challenges. Which is the truth: this job isn't allowing you to meet your full potential as a designer. You want something that provides you more opportunities. Simple.

jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:49 (twenty years ago)

hm, good luck. Maybe say that you want to work for a larger company? I'm shitty at this too.

teeny (teeny), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:51 (twenty years ago)

How long have you been working there? If it's more than, say, six months then you tell prospective employers "the truth" = "I worked there for a while but now I want to move onto something more challenging". You worked there long enough and gave the job a fair chance -- that can only reflect positively on you.

xpost

MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:54 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, just tell them you are looking to develop your career and the opportunity is not there in your current job - it's not even a lie! I dunno, do they often ask why you want to leave your present job? They know you are looking for a new job if you're at an interview, I guess they just want to know what experience you have, and what kinda guy you are. Good luck!

jel -- (jel), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:55 (twenty years ago)

Good luck indeed, as I am in a bit of the same boat. Basically the job is autopilot now, and while that's no bad thing per se, the combination of rote work, no pay increases due to UC budget folderol and other factors has wearied me. But I'm looking forward to the potential interviews upcoming, since I feel I have done and learned a lot here, and can apply it to different things elsewhere -- it's a bit of a flexible skill set, but it can work.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:57 (twenty years ago)

How long have you been working there? If it's more than, say, six months then you tell prospective employers "the truth" = "I worked there for a while but now I want to move onto something more challenging".

I'm going on eight months, and that *is* the truth. I think I'll try that. :)

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:03 (twenty years ago)

if nothing else it is really nice to get out there and see how much you're worth on the open market. nb this may be depressing, but you might be surprised at what kind of opportunities are out there.

teeny (teeny), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:04 (twenty years ago)

wow it seems like you've been there longer than that, k

jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:04 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, that's true, Teeny. I'm planning on asking for a good little bit more money at my next job, so as not to undersell myself. I think "assistant editor" combined with a salary requirement befitting an assistant editor will look good. Assistant editor with an honest estimate of what I currently make will make me look like a chump.

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:08 (twenty years ago)

(God... my boss is in the next room burning some more bridges as we speak. A local magazine printed his letter to the editor as a letter to the editor, not as an editorial as he requested. He's in there *screaming* at someone. And this is is the same man who wants to start a political activist organization -- he has no friends! No one at the Governer's office will even take his calls anymore.)

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:15 (twenty years ago)

it's ok to say you weren't making enough money at your old job!

s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:19 (twenty years ago)

I'd rather let that be kind of an unspoken thing.

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:20 (twenty years ago)

"....I don't think it's a healthy work environment. I'm looking for a place where I can be part of a creative and productive team..."

There's a bit of honesy in there.. Also 8 months to decide that you're ready for new challenges seems a bit short. How hard have you tried to take on new challenges on your own? Are you waiting around for the company to hand them to you? (These are rhetorical questions.. Things an employer might think. I'm not accusing you of not trying to make the most of your job.) Also, the work "Challenges/challenging" always seems a bit contrived to me - like it's what your career advisor told you to say.

diedre mousedropping (Dave225), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:28 (twenty years ago)

Hm...

How hard have you tried to take on new challenges on your own? Are you waiting around for the company to hand them to you?

Well, sir, I do have constant outside projects in web development, and manage two websites on the side. Neither of these are paying jobs, however. And at a company as small as the one I work for -- only three employees -- the opportunities for growth are very limited.

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:33 (twenty years ago)

Also, the work "Challenges/challenging" always seems a bit contrived to me

Oh, me too, but that's why I'm so bad at interviews. In lieu of feeling full of shit, I end up not seeming full of shit enough. Employers want a little bit of shit, I think. I just can never gauge how much.

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:34 (twenty years ago)

xpost .. That's a good answer.. It's a good way to explain why you're looking for a new job.

I guess it depends on your industry. I can't stand getting bullshitted in an interview, not that I do a whole lot of them. But I don't like negativity either. But examples of people doing more than they were asked (including doing outside/volunteer work) as ways to learn on their own and improve themselves/the company is important (to me. But learning & improvement is my business.)

Advertising/design is a whole different world...


diedre mousedropping (Dave225), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:46 (twenty years ago)

I think they expect the “I need more challenges” song and dance. I had an interview last week and when asked why I was looking for another job, I said I was tired of commuting, the lady acted like I was insane to give up a job over that.

:/ :/ :/

jill schoelen is the queen of my dreams! (Homosexual II), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:48 (twenty years ago)

I hate hate hate interviewing. I hope it's a really long time before I have to go back out there. That said, I'm really glad I went through another hellish round to get the job I have now. It's not a very impressive position, but I get paid a lot more and there's a lot less stress. (And I can see the Sears tower out the front window)

Sarah McLusky (coco), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 18:08 (twenty years ago)

Kenan, I feel your pain about being chained to the boss's awful aesthetic. My biggest source of income has been the same magazine for about six years now, and I don't know if I could design something simple and elegant if I were forced to at gunpoint. Honestly, if the editor/publisher were to keel over dead, I think I'd be unemployable as a designer, at least until I did some studying in the design field and unlearned all the horrible habits I've had to adopt. Fortunately, the client is an extremely nice and generous person, and only keeps me busy every other month. Good luck with your crazee bossman -- he sounds like the asshat I used to work for in Redding, except Asshat is doing ten years for embezzlement.

Curious George (1/6 Scale Model) (Rock Hardy), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 18:12 (twenty years ago)

Something to consider is that you may end up in a worse situation. For example, my housemate does Flash work at a design agency. One of the illustrators on staff asked for a raise, and instead of being told "no" was told "you're fired."

In my opinion, bosses (especially bosses who have a personal stake in the operation) are always going to be hard to deal with. It's how you relate to them that ends up determining your experience. My advice is to make the best of it for a while longer and see if you can maybe get the guy to change his ways a little bit. Can you talk to him reasonably?

Of course, I'm eternally optimistic. The dude probably deserves to be told off.

dan m (OutDatWay), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 18:15 (twenty years ago)

Can you talk to him reasonably?

Hm. Not really. Sometimes I can make him feel bad, so he gets all fake-nice to me for about two hours, but his abrasive personality is not going to change. One of the most instructive conversations I overheard recently is recounted on the "whose boss is the biggest ass" thread -- a lawyer that he recently hired was trying for *days* to explain to him why he did not have a legitimate case, very patiently, much more patiently than I would have been able to pull off, and the conversation ended when my boss threatened to fire him. "Do you want to continue this conversation or terminate our relationship?" he asked. And all the guy was doing him was EXPLAINING THE LAW. It wasn't a matterr of opinion at all.

So, yeah, he's really about the most unreasonable person I can imagine. Paranoid, too. I could go on for days. Dude's just a nut.

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 18:20 (twenty years ago)

My current job, I talked about wanting to be challenged in the interview - it was a way into saying things like "I've had my IQ tested at over 200 and I was ridiculously far ahead of everyone else all through my degree, so I want something that will allow me to use those abilities." I'd thought through in advance a lot of points I wanted to work in, things that showed a range of my good qualities, and ways of working them in as answers to some of the most common kinds of questions.

If you have a point-by-point person specification for a job, these days (at least in the UK) that means they'll ask you in one way or another about all of those points, so do plan how you will convince them you are good at teamwork, managing your own time, planning your work, dealing with conflicts or whatever.

I've been interviewed a lot over my decades in the job market, and I've done some interviewing, and I've taken some very good interview training, so I think I know a lot of what sells by now, and how to deliver that.

Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 18:21 (twenty years ago)

Kenan - I was in your place about three months ago. Three (honest) reasons I gave in my last job interview:

"It's an incredibly depressing place to work. Office morale is very low and people barely speak. I want to work somewhere more dynamic."

"I've hit a bit of a glass ceiling - I've been here three years, accomplished as much as I can and there's nowhere to go from here."

"The company is haemmorhaging cash and I'm worried it isn't going to be here in six months time."

I got the job, and I haven't looked back since.

Matt DC (Matt DC), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 18:22 (twenty years ago)

He sounds a lot like the owner of a place I used to work. Fortunately, my direct boss was a totally reasonable, friendly guy. Kind of kept management in check.

Is this a "small" business (is he the owner?)

dan m (OutDatWay), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 18:32 (twenty years ago)

It's so small, it's barely a business. It's him, editor of the magazine, which is more a trade publication really; his wife, managing editor and the person who does all the real work; and me, web designer and assistant editor. Now there's a fourth person, whose ostensible job is to manage the new upstart nonprofit. Like myself, he is not really being allowed to do his job, and in fact has to put up regular fights to be able to do what he knows needs to be, lest he be buried in meaningless adminstrative busywork that the boss literally makes up from day to day. His organization skills are completely nil, but don't dare tell him that. He'll sack the fucking lot of you.

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 18:49 (twenty years ago)

Let me just say this again to get it out of my system: MY BOSS HAS NO BUSINESS BEING ANYBODY'S BOSS.

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 18:51 (twenty years ago)

Nothing's going to change in a family business. Or it's going to happen very s l o w l y . . .

dan m (OutDatWay), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 18:52 (twenty years ago)

I hate looking for work. I'm in a current situation (of my own making, really) in which my last job ended January 7th, I took two months off to write, and now I'm stuck in the middle of the spring without work, and the likelihood is I'll start working again maybe in one month.

THe worst part about this is my sort of work relies completely on networking and recommendations from people I've worked with before, because it's rare that jobs in my field are posted on Craig's List, for example. I despise seeking work, because it involves e-mailing people I'm not friends with, acting friendly, and then asking if they know of any jobs or if they could pass along my resume.

I'm quite likely going to find another job in this field soon, but I'm seriously considering taking on something full-time. Freelance work is a nightmare; three or four month jobs, no benefits, horrible hours, and the constant stress of not knowing where your next paycheck will be coming from, or if there will even be another job waiting for you!

Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 18:56 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, that's no good. For that kind of stress, you may as well work for commission.

Don't hold your breath for benefits, though. I don't have any. Actually... should I bring up the lack of benefits at my next interview? I mean, if I know they offer benfits?

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 19:00 (twenty years ago)

right now I'm trying to distract myself by saying I've got fairly good unemployment compensation which could carry me through the summer if needed, and at the same time I'm working on these side projects which--if all goes well--could become full-time projects. But of course, that's nowhere near guaranteed by any stretch of the imagination, so I'll have to find another day job. Bah.

Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 19:04 (twenty years ago)

GROUP HUG

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 19:06 (twenty years ago)

i think so. benefits can be important..dental, eyeglasses, all of that can be ridiculously expensive if you're paying for them on your own. it seems like a good reason in itself to see if there's something better, if you're not well compensated AND lack benefits.

though obv you have plenty of other reasons as well.

JuliaA (j_bdules), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 19:07 (twenty years ago)

Kenan, You normally don't have to bring up bennies. First, they'll ask you questions or just say, "So, talk about yourself..." Then, after you've had a chance to wow them, they'll go into the, "Now, let me tell you a little bit about the job..." Then they might ask you what benefits you're currently receiving, or not, and then they'll probably go into the "HEre's what we have to offer..." schpiel.

Sarah McLusky (coco), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 19:08 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, you're right. They're not going to give benefits just to you.

happy fun ball (kenan), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 19:10 (twenty years ago)


You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.