U.S. Govt should not fund transit security; the states should, claims head of Homeland Security

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Of course, it doesn't matter that most u.s. states are BROKE AS SHIT, and that most susceptible targets are cities that heavily vote for the other guy...


Chertoff: States Foot Transit Safety Bill

By LARA JAKES JORDAN, Associated Press Writer
28 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - The federal government can provide only limited help to states and local governments to protect transit systems from terror attacks, and local officials must be largely responsible for the costs of improved subway, train and bus security, Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff said Thursday.

His comments, one week after the bombings on London's subway and bus systems, prompted criticism from Senate Democrats who represent large metropolitian areas.

Chertoff said attacks that could produce the most casualties are his highest priority. He said the federal government should financially support the nation's commercial airlines because the aviation system is largely a federal responsibilty, while mass transit systems are mostly owned and operated by state and local authorities.

"The truth of the matter is, a fully loaded airplane with jet fuel, a commercial airliner, has the capacity to kill 3,000 people," Chertoff told Associated Press reporters and editors. "A bomb in a subway car may kill 30 people. When you start to think about your priorities, you're going to think about making sure you don't have a catastrophic thing first."

Asked if this meant communities should be ready to provide the bulk of the protection for local transit systems, Chertoff said, "Yep."

Sen. Charles Schumer (news, bio, voting record), D-N.Y., later said Chertoff's statements "just make one's jaw drop" and demanded an apology.

"To say that the federal government has much less of a responsibility for mass transit systems because only 30 people might be killed on a subway bombing is one of the most appalling things that we've heard from any government official from any party in a very long time," Schumer said in an interview.

[...]

State and local officials are grappling with how to pay for upgrades to protect commuters and other mass transit riders in their communities. Technology to protect mass transit systems in the nation's 30 largest metropolitan areas could cost an estimated $6 billion, according to industry representatives.

[...]

Chertoff drew a comparison between lifestyles and attitudes in the United States and Europe that he said play a part in preventing terror attacks.

"I'm not going to single out particular countries, but in continental Europe, there are generations where you have these second, third-generation persons, descendants of immigrants, who are not considered to be truly in the fabric of the country," he said.

"One of the great things about this country is there is a lot of social mobility," Chertoff added. "It's hard to imagine a country that is more welcoming and more willing to accept people in which people can rise. And I think that tends to reduce the amount of frustration."

He also acknowledged that "we're never going to have people who are disaffected, you know, we've had all kinds of people historically who do bad things and commit acts of terror." Still, Chertoff said, but that "our welcoming social fabric, our civil liberties and our sense of equality and openness is still one of the very powerful tools we have and something we want to be careful not to diminish..."

Dubya-appointee in being incompetent partisian and parroting conservative mindset talking points shocka

kingfish (Kingfish), Thursday, 14 July 2005 18:46 (twenty years ago)

And coming so soon after London, saying that, basically, a subway bomb or two isn't that big a deal is just...jiminy crickets. Every time I'm positive the Bush administration can't surprise me anymore, they do.

gypsy mothra (gypsy mothra), Thursday, 14 July 2005 18:53 (twenty years ago)

(But also, right, the fact that mass transit riders undoubtedly voted heavily against Bush is the major issue here. The idea that they're supposed to be representing and protecting the whole actual country is antithetical to the Rovian strategy of divide and conquer.)

gypsy mothra (gypsy mothra), Thursday, 14 July 2005 18:55 (twenty years ago)

(also also, someone needs to do headline: "Feds to Subway Riders: Drop Dead")

gypsy mothra (gypsy mothra), Thursday, 14 July 2005 18:56 (twenty years ago)

I think perhaps it works out better this way, in the long run. The last thing I want on my daily commute is to have to deal with TSA staffers, or hearing on the news that the TSA has been tracking hundreds of thousands of farecards without permission, or some shit like that.

I really want to know what increased subway/bus/train security means! What are these magical devices you're going to install, fuckers? What will they do for us? Are they like the dogs at the airport? Them bitches is high-tech!

TOMBOT, Thursday, 14 July 2005 19:00 (twenty years ago)

Also OF COURSE the federal government wouldn't be BROUGHT TO A FUCKING COMPLETE STANDSTILL if something were to happen to the ORANGE AND BLUE LINES belonging to the WASHINGTON METROPOLITAN AREA TRANSIT AUTHORITY.

I wonder how Chertoff's people get to work?

TOMBOT, Thursday, 14 July 2005 19:02 (twenty years ago)

Of course, it doesn't matter that most u.s. states are BROKE AS SHIT

I'm confused though. How are states not the U.S. government as well and how are they broke as shit but the federal government considered rich? It's like when people say "The American people can't afford health insurance...the only solution is a univeral healthcare system (funded by the American people!)". The money is coming from the same people, relatively speaking. States are in no worse shape than the fed. government (which cooks the books more than Enron).

How could you expect the Fed. government to protect local transit anyway? Declare Martial Law? Wouldnt local officials have more knowledge about the best ways to stop certain things and monitor them than some hacks in Washington thousands of miles away?

How does everyone expect the federal government to do a better job protecting someone from hopping on a bus in downtown L.A. and blowing everyone up?

Cunga (Cunga), Thursday, 14 July 2005 19:09 (twenty years ago)

kicker is, i think you'd still have to deal with the TSA folks being around. The point is not that they won't dump the security in there, the point is that they feel no reason to pony up any dough for it.

Unfunded Mandate 2K5.


xpost:

How are states not the U.S. government as well and how are they broke as shit but the federal government considered rich?

the state of Oregon, where i now live, is about a billion in the hole right now.

kingfish (Kingfish), Thursday, 14 July 2005 19:11 (twenty years ago)

How does everyone expect the federal government to do a better job protecting someone from hopping on a bus in downtown L.A. and blowing everyone up?

"expecting the federal govt" to do this is a bullshit framing, tho, one that you're gunna hear a lot. who controls the bucks? who controls the intelligence?

this isn't necessarily a question of having national guard troops from wherever on every single train(tho they'll probably be about in NYC/DC at least), it's more a question of adequately funding the local efforts that are there.

kingfish (Kingfish), Thursday, 14 July 2005 19:15 (twenty years ago)

again, the important part is the headline, and this fragment from the first para:

local officials must be largely responsible for the costs of improved subway, train and bus security,

kingfish (Kingfish), Thursday, 14 July 2005 19:26 (twenty years ago)

OK kingfish I am officially not discussing this with you any further, you've left the building again.

TOMBOT, Thursday, 14 July 2005 19:29 (twenty years ago)

it happens, from time to time

kingfish (Kingfish), Thursday, 14 July 2005 19:43 (twenty years ago)

waitaminute, what do you mean, "again"?!

kingfish (Kingfish), Thursday, 14 July 2005 19:49 (twenty years ago)

who controls the bucks? who controls the intelligence?

What intelligence is there for something like a suicide bomber strapping C4 to his chest and taking himself out on a bridge? Unless there is some kind of knowledge of a collaboration you can't really predict it. How much more could someone in Washington know about that or what the most vulerable areas in a given city are than someone who specializes in that very knowledge locally? I don't think anyone really "controls" that intelligence. In some cases the Feds know more about a conspiracy but the local authorities are probably better equipped for stopping it or knowing the threat in many cases.

the state of Oregon, where i now live, is about a billion in the hole right now.

So there are no new programs taking money from the state until you're out of debt?

Cunga (Cunga), Thursday, 14 July 2005 19:51 (twenty years ago)

So there are no new programs taking money from the state until you're out of debt?

actually, I'm not sure on that part. Causistry would know more about that than i. I just know they're digging around in certain programs to get buy. Funding levels forpublic schools have been a particularly contentious issue.

kingfish (Kingfish), Thursday, 14 July 2005 19:56 (twenty years ago)

Dear WMATA,

Please fund security for 300,000 federal employees who ride your system daily.

Kisses,
Chertoff

Brian Miller (Brian Miller), Thursday, 14 July 2005 20:29 (twenty years ago)

Cunga, states have their own budgets. The Federal government has its own budget. Some of the state's budget is paid for by grants from the Fed. govt. and some is not (i.e. state sales tax, income tax, etc). Am I missing your question, though?

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 14 July 2005 20:55 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, states have had a double-whammy for the last few years -- their own tax receipts were down on account a' the economy, but federal aid is being cut all over the place because A.) Bush looted the Treasury for tax giveaways to the rich and richer; and B.) most of the spending increases have been going to the Defense Dept.

But as for "what can be done" to protect mass transit, I don't know because I'm not a transit safety specialist. Is anybody here? It's not hard to imagine that there are some things that could be done structurally and so forth to minimize the consequences of any attack. And it's also not hard to imagine that a lot of those things have yet to be done.

gypsy mothra (gypsy mothra), Thursday, 14 July 2005 21:08 (twenty years ago)

(also, state tax receipts are picking back up this year, but not fast enough to cover for the combination of federal cuts and rising Medicaid/etc.)

gypsy mothra (gypsy mothra), Thursday, 14 July 2005 21:09 (twenty years ago)


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