TS: Conversations about mobile phones vs Conversations about house prices

As I’ve just purchased a new phone, I’d be more likely to talk about that. But after 15 minutes, that gets a little dull.

However, conversations about house prices and mortgages and interest rates and fixed and base rate trackers and pacers and tranche funds and crap is ALL EVERYONE AT MY JOB EVER TALKS ABOUT ALL DAY LONG so I can't really help it if it slips into my normal everyday conversations occasionally.

At the other end of the scale, I'm obsessed with trying to bargain hunt in various scab ends of Southern London. "Come on, living in West Norwood wouldn't be so bad... would it? Thornton Heath? I could learn to commute. Croydon?!?!? F*ck off, that's not even London!"

talking about how much your fucking house is worth/how much money you're making for doing absolutely fuck all/how clever you were to buy in so-and-so place at so-and-so time MAKES YOU A WANK. there is nothing more dull and offensive.

i have one very simple rule in life: if anybody uses the phrase "property ladder" within my hearing, i walk away.

did it dawn on you that my tongue might have been ever so slightly in my cheek there? jesus christ, i'm a homeowner: i have, at some point, had to talk about this!

however, if they want to share information and tips, they can do it without standing at the bar of a pub in the west end of glasgow, braying at the top of their smug fucking voices. that's what i'm talking about: the one-upmanship that comes with house-buying. "oh yes, and we bought this super little flat off byres road where little quentin can stay when he's at uni; i mean, he's only three months old right now but just think of how much it'll be worth." GAAAH I HATE THEM ALL.

buying houses.. more interesting if it's genuine info sharing like esp since i'm thinking about (UH OH) JOINING THE PROPERTY LADDER myself in the near future and since i know FUCK ALL about it, i'd like to known a bit about it e.g. by asking someone.

although you know... my ancient phone is now breaking apart as well it is really time i get a new one. OH NO WHICH PHONE TO GET??!?!? SOMEBODY HELP.

i don't understand why you would either, especially at the office, when there are important things like TV, the weather and holiday plans to talk about!?!?!??!

(My current bugbear is not people who buy flats for their kids - but the buy-to-let "I think I'll be a landlord" crowd who have made the studio/one-bed starter market almost impossible to crack. You can rent a studio or one bed for next to nothing, but buying? It's only £20k less than a freaking starter home! Mental!)

see, i have a three- (four?) year-old nokia 7650 and the only conversations i ever have about it are when people go: "shit, you've brought your TV remote control to the pub."

i can't find a phone i want more, though, so: end of story.

and ken, my advice would be to take almost everything everyone tells you about house-buying with a pinch of salt. i bought my flat in unusual (and unusually tedious) circumstances; 95 per cent of the advice i was given by everyone was unhelpful, dubious and in some cases downright insane. in the end i muddled through myself, losing four grand along the way (but then getting it back from a very contrite royal bank of scotland, huzzah).

the best advice i can give is to speak to a reputable mortgage advisor, pay attention to everything they say, make careful notes, weigh up all your options carefully, and don't do anything rash.

o god, i'm talking about houses.

yes, abso-fucking-lutely. i loathe all these self-satisfied "professional couples" who've suddenly decided they want to be landlords too. they have, as you say, buggered things right up.

I've got a gang of them upstairs just waiting for your call! in fact, go and look at our website (email me privately and I'll tell you how to get in without paying the registration fee)!

kate please tell me where i can rent a studio flat for next to nothing, because i'm moving there!!!

Streatham, dude! And you could bowl as much as you liked, too!

This is why I don't talk about it: I can't seem to set the functions!

Streatham, dude! And you could bowl as much as you liked, too!

oh but i want to live in london!

;)

no he isn't. he's on the express travelator to your butt, with his kicking foot extended.

(Actually, I don't care if you pay it back or not, we get paid regardless. In fact, come in and take out a million pound loan, get me the commission, and then default on it!)

http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/

At least according to these guys, and I'm inclined to believe them.

http://www.firsttimebuyerhelp.co.uk/articles/article.aspx?id=3

study internet schtick for a moment and you might see a hint of irony in my post.

Oh, and a wee black Wednesday type hike in rates will see what's left disappear in an instant.

I've lived on less. Wouldn't want to do it for ten years, but could do it.

Anyway, it is an extreme example, but I was making the point about interest being the killer.

If I pay rent for five years, I am essentially throwing my money into a big black hole, and whether house prices rise or fall, I have assets of zilch.

I wouldn't buy a property for investment, but as somewhere to live, yes, I am going to be doing this within the next year. (If I can stop buying Liberty shirts and gold frock coats long enough to save my deposit up.)

? it has an xray camera on it?

And all along, I listened to Calum and thought all I needed was loads of money. Sigh.

if the former, I take phone plans because i'm looking for one right now. if the later, I take housing prices because I dont care what stupid features my phone has.

well, i started the thread, and you know what? -- i'm gonna be liberal about this one.

i am interested in where kate is going to find these 120k houses 8)

If I pay rent for five years, I am essentially throwing my money into a big black hole, and whether house prices rise or fall, I have assets of zilch.

The second bit is true, but if you are stuck with negative equity uo are left with minus assets. If you save the money you have left over while you are renting, you are able to save for a larger deposit which will then mean a smaller mortgage, and therefore paying less interest in the future.

also, i want to hear more about nrq's friend.

If you buy a house that is valued at £150k and take out a £125k mortgage on it - then there is a housing price crash and your house is revalued at £100k, then you have negative equity of -£25k.

I think... I mean, really it's an accounting fiction because you still have the house - so long as you don't default on the loan, I assume - though it's skyrocketing interest rates which can add several hundred pounds to your monthly repayment that cause the defaulting and the reposession.

A house worth £100k with a mortgage of £125k has negative equity of -£25k.

God, my brain hurts. Does someone else want to do the Risk and Fee for me today?

-- toby (toby_insertmysurnameher...), September 7th, 2005.

hmm, well. archetypal "lefty" yuppie, lept from weirdly bourgeois co-habiting episode into bizarre world of sex-texts and mid-afternoon gym pick-ups.

It's cost us about £40k over five years to reduce the amount of capital we owe by £14k. It's a laff, innit?

If you're not moving it doesn't really matter, apart from preventing you from taking out any secured loans.

1. You are able to get fixed rate or cap the rate fairly low
2. You are able to afford a sizable down payment, to keep your monthly closer to a livable sum, and get equity in a hurry
3 AND MOST CRUCIAL. You are in love with the place and can imagine spending the next 10-20 years living in and maintaining it.

There's not just going to be a recession. There's going to be a fucking crash. Where do you think it leaves the rest of the world if the American Consumer stops spending the next five years of their income on giant toys at 10% APR?

People who buy now may well end up with negative equity, totally house poor, and possibly bankrupt with nothing save the shirts on their backs if or when (whatever you prefer) the world's financial markets realize they've completely fucked up by allowing so many marginal borrowers to take them for 6% and no down for loans capable of procuring a Bell helicopter.

The other option is that when the bell tolls the taxpayers of 2025 will wind up paying for it, when our governments go further into debt themselves to bail out failing lenders. Either way, property values normalize, meaning they tune in with rent prices. I don't think the reverse is going to occur, with rent prices going up to match house prices, because that would actually lead to an even worse depression. As in nobody actually has any disposable income anywhere. It would be a little like socialism actually, except with some people owning private property and being poor, and other people owning no property, and also being poor. In which case bloody revolution would break out and then Kurt Russell is going to have 24 hours to do something or other.

Inasmuch as cell phones are concerned, my workplace has taken on a "no camera phones" policy, which is completely insipid, because I see fuckers walking around with their RAZRs all the time in this bitch. Also, we have blackberries out the wazoo in this building, which is more than a little irritating at times when you're trying to talk to someone and they decide the e-mail they just received is more interesting than you and your problems.

Check (for 2-5 years anyway and then we'll jump to someone else).

2. You are able to afford a sizable down payment, to keep your monthly closer to a livable sum, and get equity in a hurry

Check (31%), sort of check and, er, check.

3 AND MOST CRUCIAL. You are in love with the place and can imagine spending the next 10-20 years living in and maintaining it

Check! Just get the asbestos out of the outhouse roof and we'll be laughing. Current occupants have been there since 1965 and raised four kids. If they can...

Cheers, TOMBOT.

I don't want to say I told you so...

Actually I do.

My wife & I bought our first house 2 weeks ago, we're moving in at the end of October. At 36 years of age I've finally got a whole house to do whatever the hell I like in. 4 bedrooms, a cellar, and a 5 minute walk to the city centre. CAN'T FUCKING WAIT.

"house are expensive, I can't afford one"

"mobile phones are pretty boring really"

it's a draw!

Either conversation is better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick. Marginally.

i know that on most levels these conversations are way boring but the thing is they tend to actually be really useful when youre shopping around for a phone/mortgage--you get to see what other people are doing and paying; what mistakes they made; what theyd recommend... sucks to have to do it i guess but better to have these conversations than to not have them and get fucked on yr payment plan or whatever

The other option is that when the bell tolls the taxpayers of 2025 will wind up paying for it, when our governments go further into debt themselves to bail out failing lenders.

loool