"middlebrow," particularly regarding film

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Re Tombot's disgust with the term in Brokeback Snub thread: It's generally assumed that people who use "middlebrow" automatically mean as a dis. I don't. The quintessential middlebrow American filmmaker of the last 50 years might be Sidney Lumet, and I'd put his best (Dog Day Afternoon and Prince of the City) alongside any film from last year, including Munich, The New World or 2046. He's m-b because he can make movies that are rich and bursting with good acting, but doesn't do anything with film grammar (or attempt to) that hasn't been done before.

(And he's got a new courtroom satire! with Vin Diesel!)

Except for maybe A River Runs Through It, Robert Redford has failed to live up to his onetime promise as a King of Middlebrow. If Judd Hirsch could be successfully expunged from Ordinary People in favor of a tolerable actor, I'd say it deserved its '80 Oscar win over Raging Bull.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:29 (nineteen years ago)

Curtis Hanson

― Adamrl (nordicskilla), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:30 (nineteen years ago)

haha I was going to start this thread today but then I didn't.

― TOMBOT, Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:33 (nineteen years ago)

I like monobrow films.

― Adamrl (nordicskilla), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:33 (nineteen years ago)

The most unfairly-maligned genre since hairy back films.

― Adamrl (nordicskilla), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:34 (nineteen years ago)

for me no style, genre, use of actors, intended audience, or intended effect is automatically bad. but then i have been accused of being so open minded my brain falls out. i prefer to try to determine a work of art's inner integrity, it's own coherence or rules of expression, before judging it as suceeding or failing. the drawback to this is it is often VERY hard to determine if something is good or bad.

― ryan (ryan), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:34 (nineteen years ago)

so my point: there are good and bad middlebrow films!

― ryan (ryan), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:35 (nineteen years ago)

Curtis Hanson: I won't object, despite the arty design of L.A. Confidential ... and given theway he made Wonder Boys more conventional than it had to be. But the rest of his filmography (besides Eminem) suggests lowbrow (The River Wild, Hand That Rocks the Cradle, Bad Influence) and not the good kind!

Oldskool naturals: George Stevens, Michael Curtiz, Wm Wyler.

I like monobrow films.

How is Dweezil doin?

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:39 (nineteen years ago)

how about directors who are perceived as highbrow but in fact are middlebrow? copolla, wilder, scorcese...

― ryan (ryan), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:40 (nineteen years ago)

i believe Sam Mendes and the English patient guy (too lazy to look up it up, Minghella or something) have made strong cases to be considered the new Kings of this. I hate the former, can tolerate the latter. Actually, Brits in Hollywood do this well, perhaps because Anglophilia and American Middlebrowism go hand-in-hand.

― Stanley Kramer, Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:41 (nineteen years ago)

scorsese wasn't middlebrow in the 70s, surely?

― J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:42 (nineteen years ago)

Middlebrow is no dis, agreed. Capote and most of Ang Lee's filmography qualify.

Joseph Ruben had a good streak for a while: The Stepfather, True Believer, Return to Paradise.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:43 (nineteen years ago)

Oh! Stephen Frears is definitely middlebrow.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:43 (nineteen years ago)

curtis hanson may be a middlebrow but more than that he's an incompetent

― s1ocki (slutsky), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:46 (nineteen years ago)

As likely argued in the Brokeback thread, middlebrow filmmakers can be counted on to reap Oscars (James L Brooks!).

I would never call Scorsese middlebrow; even his Leo Would-Be Blockbusters have had idiosyncratic or wondrous things in them. Coppola, high-middle. Wilder, yeah.

All of Ang Lee's filmography qualifies.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:46 (nineteen years ago)

not sure J.D. i could go either way.

― ryan (ryan), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:47 (nineteen years ago)

yeah Lee of course. Brokeback is in fact a very good middlebrow film id say.

― ryan (ryan), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:47 (nineteen years ago)

there is no way the hulk is a middlebrow movie!

― s1ocki (slutsky), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:50 (nineteen years ago)

i mean, whatever it is, it ain't middlebrow. i'm not even sure it's brow at all.

― s1ocki (slutsky), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:50 (nineteen years ago)

As with far right and far left politically, extreme highbrow and extreme lowbrow often intersect or become elusive: John Waters, Russ Meyer, the Kuchar Brothers -- Larry Clark? Stephen Chow, Jerry Lewis?

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:52 (nineteen years ago)

there is no way the hulk is a middlebrow movie!

All these candidates make frequent attempts to break the mold into which they've inserted themselves (e.g. The Hulk, Wilder's Love in the Afternoon)

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:53 (nineteen years ago)

god i hate love in the afternoon! haha

― s1ocki (slutsky), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:53 (nineteen years ago)

hahaha don't get s1ocki started on love in the afternoon!!

― J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:54 (nineteen years ago)

uh, x-post

― J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:54 (nineteen years ago)

i dont like Wilder in general! haha. he is a BAD middlebrow filmmaker!

― ryan (ryan), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:55 (nineteen years ago)

i'll still rep for lots of wilder.

― s1ocki (slutsky), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:55 (nineteen years ago)

ryan you nutter wilder is great! how can you argue with sunset blvd, dble indemnity and uh all the rest? except love in the afternoon?

― J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:56 (nineteen years ago)

Wilder is a BAD middlebrow filmmaker!

The Front Page yes, Double Indemnity no. (And Kiss Me, Stupid is a spirited pass at lowbrow, sort of.)

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:58 (nineteen years ago)

i will not justify my assertion!

― ryan (ryan), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 21:59 (nineteen years ago)

shaddup and deal!

― J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:00 (nineteen years ago)

ryan is not a mensch!

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:05 (nineteen years ago)

here is my argument: come on guys, you know Wilder sucks. just think about it. look into your heart, really, and tell me he doesn't suck. you know he does.

― ryan (ryan), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:07 (nineteen years ago)

doesn't do anything with film grammar (or attempt to) that hasn't been done before.

I don't know what 'film grammar' is (though it sounds like the film cognate of the kind of thing that's important to Guy Mann-Dude fans). Nor would I claim that Sidney Lumet focused on something other than storytelling-with-meaning. But is it possible that his directorial touches, like the slow lowering of the camera throughout 12 Angry Men, are simply unobtrusive?

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:07 (nineteen years ago)

what's Michael Mann?

― ryan (ryan), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:08 (nineteen years ago)

But is it possible that his directorial touches, like the slow lowering of the camera throughout 12 Angry Men, are simply unobtrusive?

See, but you'd have to watch every film made to make sure it hadn't been done before - otherwise, it's still middlebrow.

― o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:10 (nineteen years ago)

Woody Allen!

(/trolling)

― Adamrl (nordicskilla), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:11 (nineteen years ago)

But think about it!

― Adamrl (nordicskilla), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:12 (nineteen years ago)

Match Point was definitely middlebrow.

― Adamrl (nordicskilla), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:12 (nineteen years ago)

i dont like Wilder in general! haha. he is a BAD middlebrow filmmaker!

So? Wilder made a lot of awful films, and some worse than that; so did Hawks, Preminger, Wyler, Curtiz, Cukor, and all the other vassals of the studio system.

Woody Allen's a great example.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:13 (nineteen years ago)

Peter Bogdanovich.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:16 (nineteen years ago)

Wilder and Allen are most definitely WRITERS first, and if you don't find their comedies funny, well, "that tears it." But Allen certainly has developed a visual style, which I thought was the best thing about Match Point.

is it possible that his directorial touches, like the slow lowering of the camera throughout 12 Angry Men, are simply unobtrusive?

Sure -- you've got to be resourceful to make a one-set TV play work like that. Funnily made me think of Billy Wilder complaining that florid camera movements -- something like "Over the roof, down the chimney, in the fireplace ... POV: Santa Claus!"

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:19 (nineteen years ago)

How about some middlebrow foreign filmmakers?

Exhibit A: Francois Truffaut

― Chairman Doinel (Charles McCain), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:21 (nineteen years ago)

hawks actually made surprisingly few really BAD films.

― J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:25 (nineteen years ago)

Exhibit A: Francois Truffaut

Post-Jules et Jim certainly. Post-The Story of Adele H he did nothing of interest.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:25 (nineteen years ago)

I thought people were avoiding talking about Woody Allen because it was so obvious.

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:26 (nineteen years ago)

― Adamrl (nordicskilla), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:26 (nineteen years ago)

what about M. Night Shamalyan?

(I hate him, btw)

― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:28 (nineteen years ago)

he's somewhere between low middlebrow and high lowbrow.

― J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:28 (nineteen years ago)

(i started to say x-post but hey it works for truffaut, allen AND shy-whatsisname!)

― J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:29 (nineteen years ago)

I should add: Truffaut was always a middlebrow with highbrow aspirations (his essential conservatism eventually alienated his good friend Godard). His first film was The 400 Blows, for crissakes! Shoot the Piano Player and Jules et Jim were aberrations.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 8 March 2006 22:33 (nineteen years ago)

Skipping 86 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

I mean films where two or more of those guys are the exclusive draw, obv.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:11 (nineteen years ago)

I guess you could make an argument for Gene Hackman as the "exclusive draw" of the Tenenbaums but Owen Wilson and Ben Stiller pretty much make the movie for me. Also the fact that Owen wrote the thing probably helps power up his draw status in the Wes Anderson filmography...

I mean, you're right, Wilson-Vaughn-Stiller are the top of the lowbrow comedy by a long shot but the way you phrased that was rather unsneakily dismissive.

― Allyzay Rofflesberger (allyzay), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:14 (nineteen years ago)

i think part of the 'thing' with the frat pack is they obviously aren't 'just' 'lowbrow'; i mean, as allyzay said wilson co-wrote on wes anderson's first three films; i doubt you'd get rob schneider guesting on 'curb'; and vince vaughn's doing a movie with david o. russell.

― The Man Without Shadow (Enrique), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:19 (nineteen years ago)

Wes Anderson is the primary draw for his films, which is why he's had no big hits.

fer Chrissake, I'm talking about the FRAT PACK FILMS, ie the ones that are marketed as HEY, STRAIGHT (MOSTLY) GUYS -- BEER, TITS AND DICK JOKES!

I was being dismissive only in that it's the kind of stuff I'm not interested in (as Will Ferrell's '04 Bush ad parody is the ONLY time he's ever made me laugh). The first film of that pile I will probably end up seeing is Zoolander.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:23 (nineteen years ago)

morbius how could you say haggis is a lowbrow when he clearly fits almost everyone's description of middlebrow in this thread?

i think morbs' narrowish definition of MB at the top maybe has some merit (as applies to lumet, levinson etc). but over the course of this thread the term, and pretty much everything else in this poor world, has lost all meaning.

― s1ocki (slutsky), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:29 (nineteen years ago)

The homo-scared LA crowd THINK Haggis is a middlebrow; like their '50s equivalents probly thought Sirk was a borderline lowbrow.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:32 (nineteen years ago)

HEY, STRAIGHT (MOSTLY) GUYS -- BEER, TITS AND DICK JOKES!

yeah that's the sum total of the appeal of 'dodgeball', 'forty-year-old virgin', etc.

― The Man Without Shadow (Enrique), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:33 (nineteen years ago)

Owen Wilson's career is too much of conceptual prank on the industry to really be low brow.

― senseiDancer (sexyDancer), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:38 (nineteen years ago)

or he's just, you know, a talented comic actor who doesn't get too hung up shit.

― The Man Without Shadow (Enrique), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:41 (nineteen years ago)

or he just plays Dignan over and over. I know, there are many worse things.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:48 (nineteen years ago)

he doesn't really...

― s1ocki (slutsky), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:49 (nineteen years ago)

i mean, he has more or less the same "presence" in most roles but so do most comic actors. or most successful actors. i feel like i've said this on ilx at least 2382392 times right now (not specifically about owen wilson mind).

― s1ocki (slutsky), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:49 (nineteen years ago)

recent Oscar-winning lowbrows: Benigni, Haggis

See, these don't make sense to me, either. Benigni is a perfect example of middlebrow, since he's in a Foreign Film about the Holocaust, which lulls upwardly mobile middle-class audiences into thinking they are seeing something Serious and Intellectual and so they profess to love it, when there is really not much going on and it remains perfectly unchallenging. Haggis, too, with his Ensemble Drama about Racism.

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:50 (nineteen years ago)

How would you know, Morbius? You just admitted to avoiding 98% of his films. xpost

― Allyzay Rofflesberger (allyzay), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:50 (nineteen years ago)

Also the idea that Wes Anderson is the main draw for those films is laughable considering the reception his last film (you know, the one where he decided to "go a different direction" in writing) got...

― Allyzay Rofflesberger (allyzay), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:50 (nineteen years ago)

The homo-scared LA crowd THINK Haggis is a middlebrow

No one wants to admit they have middlebrow tastes, do they?

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:51 (nineteen years ago)

How would you know, Morbius? You just admitted to avoiding 98% of his films.

98% seems high ... from every clip and trailer of the ones I don't see? Kind of the way you know the tone of the Crash naysayers is "disgusting at best" without seeing that.

Ah, a shitload of work to do today, seeyabye.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 9 March 2006 15:58 (nineteen years ago)

Wes Anderson ...decided to "go a different direction" in writing

I assume the quotes mean Zissou wasn't a different direction, cuz it wasn't. And I'm pretty sure it grossed more than Rushmore if less than TRT.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 9 March 2006 16:00 (nineteen years ago)

Owen Wilson's career is too much of conceptual prank on the industry to really be low brow.

That's the best line I've read this morning.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 9 March 2006 16:03 (nineteen years ago)

Be that as it may, Bill Murray and not Wes Anderson was the draw for The Life Aquatic by any meaningful measure. At least any meaningful measure that translates into $$$.

― phil d. (Phil D.), Thursday, 9 March 2006 16:07 (nineteen years ago)

I wouldn't label Wes Anderson as middlebrow; does he have a brow at all? He's like failed surrealist Jacques Tati or something.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 9 March 2006 16:11 (nineteen years ago)

can we talk about filmmakers who are JR brow?

http://www.penguinscomedyclub.com/images/jr%20brow.jpg

― s1ocki (slutsky), Thursday, 9 March 2006 16:13 (nineteen years ago)

anthony you forget lots of ilx fave lobrow direx -- also the something about mary guys, etc.

i think speaking of bros that the cohens moved into middlebrow somewhere round fargo.

i agree with nrq on wilson tho -- he's just an effortless sort of character actor and he just likes to do that.

truffaut's doinel films are also rilly not that middlebrow as a whole unless you mean like updike middlebrow except with more fourth-wall tomfoolery which makes them covert roth rilly, which is hardly middlebrow at all coz of its risky preachy uneavenness, but truffaut is less uneven which is why they're more crypto-roth than real-roth.

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Thursday, 9 March 2006 16:22 (nineteen years ago)

americanize the brow system:
upper-middlebrow
solidly middlebrow
lower-middlebrow
bluecollarbrow
ghettobrow

― senseiDancer (sexyDancer), Thursday, 9 March 2006 16:36 (nineteen years ago)

Morbius, I think saying the tone of someone's actual written posts is "disgusting" is a little different from claiming a film is terrible without having seen it. If you honestly think what was disgusting to me about some of what has been said vis a vis Crash/BBM is some value judgement on either film, you are...what was it...? "Dumber than you appear to be"?

BUT THAT IS ANOTHER THREAD Let's talk about this JR Brow some more.

― Allyzay Rofflesberger (allyzay), Thursday, 9 March 2006 16:43 (nineteen years ago)

http://xo.typepad.com/blog/skittlebrau%20(Custom).jpg

― phil d. (Phil D.), Thursday, 9 March 2006 16:49 (nineteen years ago)

Here's to good threads
This one is kind of special
The films we adore
Must be something Mor-
Bius
Can scorn
So tonight, tonight
Let it be middlebrow

― The Day The World Turned Dayglo Redd (Ken L), Thursday, 9 March 2006 19:05 (nineteen years ago)

Watching this thread is just like watching the Powerball(TM) ping-pong balls bouncing around in their lucite cage and then popping out one by one and rolling slowly to rest so you can read the name of the movie or director written on them. Neat!

― Aimless (Aimless), Thursday, 9 March 2006 19:15 (nineteen years ago)

do you have any of that new beer with skittles in it, you know "Skittlebrau"?

― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 9 March 2006 19:16 (nineteen years ago)

eight years pass...

AO Scott thinks the surge in socioeconomic equality is killing middlebrow culture, and we are the poorer for it.

The natural affinity of the high and low, and their mutual suspicion of the middle, has been a remarkably durable idea, though it has never proven to be anything more than an idea, a nostalgic vision of ideal order. At heart it is a fantasy of aesthetic authenticity secured by static and hierarchical social distinctions. A world of landlords and peasants, of masters and servant, of patrons and workers is one in which art and life harmonize. In such a world, the middle will always be a place of vulgarity and ostentation, of the kind of money-grubbing, backslapping, self-conscious display Woolf (or at least her notional duchess) would flee to the basement to avoid....

More does not always mean better, but the years after World War II were a grand era of more. In Pikettian terms, the rate of growth exceeded the rate of return on capital, and the result was a culture as well as a society that became less stratified and more egalitarian.

High culture became more accessible, popular culture became more ambitious, until the distinction between them collapsed altogether. Some of the mixing looks silly or vulgar in retrospect: stiff Hollywood adaptations or comic-book versions of great novels; earnest television broadcasts about social problems; magazines that sandwiched serious fiction in between photographs of naked women. But much of it was glorious.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/03/arts/a-resurgence-in-inequality-and-its-effects-on-culture.html

Not sure I've seen that swell 1949 chart before either.

― son of a lewd monk (Dr Morbius), Monday, 4 August 2014 18:06 (eleven years ago)

bad post for a day when yr sploojin over a humongous kiddie movie i guess

― son of a lewd monk (Dr Morbius), Monday, 4 August 2014 23:44 (eleven years ago)

If Judd Hirsch could be successfully expunged from Ordinary People in favor of a tolerable actor, I'd say it deserved its '80 Oscar win over Raging Bull.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, March 8, 2006 4:29 PM (8 years ago)

Hope you've changed your mind on this.

― clemenza, Monday, 4 August 2014 23:51 (eleven years ago)

"if" mofo

― son of a lewd monk (Dr Morbius), Monday, 4 August 2014 23:55 (eleven years ago)

Do you think AO Scott actually read Capital

― polyphonic, Tuesday, 5 August 2014 00:01 (eleven years ago)

I see the "if," but what I'm saying is there's a lot more than Judd Hirsch that separates those two films. Anyway, another thread.

― clemenza, Tuesday, 5 August 2014 00:03 (eleven years ago)

ive read 120 pages of it, i think he prob did at least that

― son of a lewd monk (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 5 August 2014 00:08 (eleven years ago)

anyway

http://media.boingboing.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/png.png

― son of a lewd monk (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 5 August 2014 00:09 (eleven years ago)

shit, not big enough

― son of a lewd monk (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 5 August 2014 00:10 (eleven years ago)

if you open it in a browser it looks fine

― polyphonic, Tuesday, 5 August 2014 00:11 (eleven years ago)

I thought every Brooklyn resident had already downloaded that chart onto a smart phone.

― guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 5 August 2014 00:11 (eleven years ago)

quite a lot of that inverted now i suppose

― go ahead. make vid where u rap about this new TMNT movie. (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 5 August 2014 00:13 (eleven years ago)

as soon as we saw it in Harpers, on the trolley to Ebbets Field

― son of a lewd monk (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 5 August 2014 00:14 (eleven years ago)

re: the 1949 chart -

http://crookedtimber.org/2009/10/20/highbrow-lowbrow-middlebrow/
https://web.archive.org/web/20071020152554/http://www.americanheritage.com/articles/magazine/ah/1983/4/1983_4_42.shtml

http://crookedtimber.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/highbrow20002.jpg http://crookedtimber.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/highbrow20003.jpg

― etc, Tuesday, 5 August 2014 00:28 (eleven years ago)

rip Dwight Macdonald

― guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 5 August 2014 00:29 (eleven years ago)

I love the de-evolution of the Whistler title.

― polyphonic, Tuesday, 5 August 2014 00:31 (eleven years ago)

also if you even refer to me on so much as a film thread i will hunt you down

― son of a lewd monk (Dr Morbius)

― balls, Tuesday, 5 August 2014 01:27 (eleven years ago)

nobody mourning the loss of middlebrow on ilx huh

― son of a lewd monk (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 16 August 2014 05:41 (eleven years ago)

I do think the celebration of Boyhood suggests m'brow isnt quite dead yet

but it has to be released like an art film

― son of a lewd monk (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 16 August 2014 05:43 (eleven years ago)

that's a bit harsh but i wouldn't exactly fight you over it

― go ahead. make vid where u rap about this new TMNT movie. (forksclovetofu), Saturday, 16 August 2014 05:44 (eleven years ago)

it's not making art-film money!

― I dunno. (amateurist), Saturday, 16 August 2014 08:56 (eleven years ago)

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