For mystics only (calling all Friends, Mormons, Rosecrucians, Gnostics, Kabbalahists, Taoists, Sufis, Tibetan Buddhists, Transcendental Unitarians, fans of William James, Pamela Travers, Zen Buddhist

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Do you believe it is possible by dint of violent, egocentric, or oppressive thoughts to effect or pollute the supra-human space, however you define it?

― remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 17 March 2006 01:16 (twenty years ago)

om?

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Friday, 17 March 2006 01:18 (twenty years ago)

That seems obvious to me.

― kateorsini, Friday, 17 March 2006 01:21 (twenty years ago)

You're doing it right now.

― dr lulu (dr lulu), Friday, 17 March 2006 01:24 (twenty years ago)

DO NOT TEMPT ME TO POST PICTURES OF SRI HAROLD KLEMP

― Curt1s St3ph3ns, Friday, 17 March 2006 01:30 (twenty years ago)

I was thinking about this in relation to traffic-induced anger. As in: if driving home I get mad at Driver X and just-briefly imagine getting out of the car and whalloping her/him, though never act on it and never see Driver X again… is there any way I could actually be harming X? What about if I return multiple times to thoughts of harming X? What if, theoretically, I carried a secret animus for the rest of my life against X? If it became (in some strange obsessive universe) the core of my being, my hatred for X? Is it possible that I would be defiling some sort of shared psychic-psychological-inter-supra-mystic-collective-un/semi-conscious-entheogenic space and depriving or sullying the existence/soul/experience of Driver X?

― remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 17 March 2006 01:34 (twenty years ago)

I think you'd just be harming your own psyche with your frankly irrational obsession with Driver X. Driver X would be in no way aware of your animosity for him/her, and if she/he were, through some entirely theoretical and unsubstantiated psychic super highway, I'm sure she/he would be mature and adult enough to get over it.

― chap who would dare to be a stone cold thug (chap), Friday, 17 March 2006 01:39 (twenty years ago)

It was

(1) theoretical. I hardly even drive.

and

(2) "through some entirely theoretical and unsubstantiated psychic super highway" kind of indicates that you're not exactly a believer in any type of mysticism, which was sort of prerequisite to answering the question in a non-kneejerk way.

― remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 17 March 2006 01:45 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, I was basically being faececious. *runs and hides*

― chap who would dare to be a stone cold thug (chap), Friday, 17 March 2006 01:48 (twenty years ago)

a young monk and an older monk were walking on a path up the mountain to the monastery. at a river crossing, they found an old woman who was unable to navigate the slippery stones on her own. at the older monk's direction, the young monk helped him lift and carry the woman across the stream. the monks continued walking. as the hours went by, the young monk grew more and more agitated. finally he couldn't take it anymore and said, "forgive my impudence, master, but our vows specifically forbid any physical contact with women. and yet we carried that woman." the older monk looked at him with surprise. "are you still carrying her?" he asked. "i set her down on the river bank."

― gypsy mothra (gypsy mothra), Friday, 17 March 2006 01:49 (twenty years ago)

oops, sorry!

― remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 17 March 2006 01:53 (twenty years ago)

Nice story, gypsy. Answer is definitely yes to me. Besides the harm to oneself such negative thought may cause, other people do pick up on these things and may avoid interacting with people giving off those vibes, or if they do, are more likely to be guarded/hostile in response.

― ALLAH FROG (Mingus Dew), Friday, 17 March 2006 02:03 (twenty years ago)

Philip K. Dick's theory of 'zebra' is kind of important here, I think:

"ZEBRA (VALIS): ‘a vortex of intelligence extending as a supra-temporal field, involving humans but not limited to them, drawing objects & processes into a coherency which it arranges into information. A FLUX of purposeful arrangement of living information, both human & extra-human, tending to grow & incorporate its environment as a unitary complex of subsumations.’"(pg. 72)

― remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 17 March 2006 02:19 (twenty years ago)

I was hopeing that monk story would be a cheeky joke, like this - Two monks are carrying a woman across a stream. Suddenly the woman says "From whence hath sprung up yon fifth pillar of support upon my tailbone!?" "That is my cock" advised teh monk while laughing.

― Mr Jones (Mr Jones), Friday, 17 March 2006 11:21 (twenty years ago)

Nope, violence is part of the whole thing. Desire is both the cause and answer to all of our problems (much like what Homer said about alcohol, yes) and violence is part of desire.

― Rude Awakening, Saturday, 18 March 2006 01:51 (twenty years ago)

i think that anger is a lot like an ox in the mire--the more you practice it, the longer and more intractable the rut becomes, in yr head, and it keeps up and up, you get angrier at more and more people, and some times its viral, but mostly its yr own mire

― anthony easton (anthony), Saturday, 18 March 2006 03:15 (twenty years ago)

Yup, and when you get sick of it, you'll look to change it. The adversary becomes the redeemer.

― Rude Awakening, Saturday, 18 March 2006 03:22 (twenty years ago)

indeed, the shit becomes the turkey sandwich

― latebloomer is a belly with a guy pierce in it (latebloomer), Saturday, 18 March 2006 09:47 (twenty years ago)

...or tofurkey sandwich, whatever floats your boat

― latebloomer is a belly with a guy pierce in it (latebloomer), Saturday, 18 March 2006 09:49 (twenty years ago)

As long as you (forgetfully) incarnate in human form, anger, fear, suffering, anxiety, pleasure and joy will inevitably arise. You'll never get rid of these states.

However, as Saint George says, "sunrise doesn't last all morning,
a cloudburst doesn't last all day...all thigs must pass".

― Bob Six (bobbysix), Saturday, 18 March 2006 09:52 (twenty years ago)

Sure, but those thigs can sure hold up traffic on a thigpass. Still, I suppose we shouldn't run them over.

― ratty, Saturday, 18 March 2006 11:49 (twenty years ago)

The terms of the question require a false dichotomy. There is no supra-human space in that there is no division or difference between human space and any other space. The most interesting thing about human conciousness is its propensity for building mistaken beliefs about itself.

In like wise, to a mystic, pollution (in the religious sense) is a highly peculiar idea. It has only a formal existence, in the same way that, in a game of basketball, touching the ball while it is above the cylinder of the rim is defined as a "violation", whereas touching the ball in every other circumstance is not only "pure" ans "sanctified", but absolutely integral to the game.

By analogy, actions based on the delusions of human consciousness are a very small and quite special subset of all the actions of the universe. They are already allowed for and absorbed into the rules of the the universe as a whole, in that they inherently produce their own corrections (the actual meaning of karma).

― Aimless (Aimless), Saturday, 18 March 2006 16:51 (twenty years ago)

You're not a mystic, so fuck off. The thread's not for you, genius.

― At War With The Mystics, Saturday, 18 March 2006 16:53 (twenty years ago)

Your wish is my command. I have already fucked off. Now what?

― Aimless (Aimless), Saturday, 18 March 2006 17:10 (twenty years ago)

http://www.ecto-web.org/~spookcentral/gb2_screencap14.jpg

― Ghostbusters 2, Saturday, 18 March 2006 23:24 (twenty years ago)

http://www.amhr.org/aa/Achad2.jpg

― All The Time In The World, Sunday, 19 March 2006 00:36 (twenty years ago)

http://imgsrc.hubblesite.org/hu/db/1996/07/images/a/formats/web.jpg

― All The Time In The World, Sunday, 19 March 2006 00:42 (twenty years ago)

one month passes...

The Six Ways:
1.) Hell, 2.) The Hungry Ghosts,
3.) Animals, 4.) Malignant Spirits,
5.) Men, and 6.) Heaven Dwellers.

All are passings thoughts,
formless forms
in a forgotten dream.

― John Sakowitz, Wednesday, 19 April 2006 15:43 (twenty years ago)

I have always liked that division of beings in buddhism. I also like the way the human realm is considered more advanced than the heavenly realm. That's a classy touch! It's also true.

― ratty, Wednesday, 19 April 2006 20:11 (twenty years ago)

They hunger to posess your body.

― Bnad, Wednesday, 19 April 2006 20:16 (twenty years ago)

http://www.thewatcherfiles.com/images/ufo-cartoon.JPG

― latebloomer (latebloomer), Wednesday, 19 April 2006 21:54 (twenty years ago)

Remy, did you want to know this for a screenplay?

― Casuistry (Chris P), Wednesday, 19 April 2006 22:56 (twenty years ago)

three years pass...

Really like this thread.

― a full circle lol (J0hn D.), Thursday, 24 September 2009 09:21 (sixteen years ago)

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