In NYC, do more blacks than whites change subway cars by walking in between the cars when the subway's moving?

It's an observation. Are whites more afraid to change subway cars by walking in between them when the subway's in motion?

http://www.detroitfocus.org/Issues/0502/ToddWeinstein/Photos/010.jpg

(b) One reason for this might be that the main people walking between subway cars are homeless people and teenagers/schoolkids, both of which groups are, in New York, mostly non-white. Especially the latter.

(c) I assume you're asking because you're worried that recent rule-changes that officially prohibit car-changing would thus have disproportionate racial impact, and you want to confirm before you start in with the protests.

Most of the car-switching I've ever seen consists of Puerto Rican, black, or Dominican kids who are just headed home from school, and move between cars because, you know, their entire 9th-grade class or whatever is straggled out along the length of the train. Plus I live on the Upper West Side, so it's usually kids who are headed up toward Washington Heights or possibly up to the Bronx, so they have a lot of time to kill socializing.

Apart from them and homeless people, I can't think of any particular types of people who routinely change cars. Maybe just "people who grew up in the city," which again = largely non-white.

So why are kids constantly changing cars? Hormones? Restlessness? Because it's fun? To impress each other? To talk to as many peole as possible?

-- shookout (shookou...), December 17th, 2005.

a bunch of upper middle class white people calling each other racists, sexists, and homophobes.

-- shookout (shookou...), January 19th, 2006.

Cosby may be nuts, but I've seen Dyson on numerous TV appearences, and he strikes me as an attention-craving hustler.

-- shookout (shookou...), May 17th, 2006.

As hung-up on race as Chang seems to be, he failed to notice that 8of the 21 pieces in the current, Matt Groening-edited edition are about artists of color.

-- shookout (shookou...), December 8th, 2003.

the idea that white people co-opted rock and roll is simlistic and stupid.

-- shookout (shookou...), March 23rd, 2005.

don't you know that people not in power can't be sexist or racist, etc?

That is pure white liberal theoretical liberal arts college crap.

-- shookout (shookou...), April 26th, 2004.

R. Kelly - "Happy People" (2 matching messages)

It's not as good as "I'm Gonna Piss on You.

So you like pedophile music?

-- shookout (shookou...), April 12th, 2004.

I really like Big Sur. It might be my favorite Kerouac book.

-- shookout (shookou...), February 1st, 2005.

NB "black people" is off-base here; "non-white" is a better description. And of course it's not so much that non-white people are more likely to car-switch; it's that car-switchers are largely non-white. Or actually I'd imagine it's more that car-switchers are largely working-class native New Yorkers.

Well then technically they should install a huge gate around the entire track like they have at a handful of stops (the shuttle btwn GC and TS is what I'm thinking of immediately), because more ppl have died or been injured from shoving/jumping/falling there than by walking car to car.

So sad ;_;

You're wrong, ord pooperton, all sorts of people play on the platform.

hello douchebag at Delancey Essex!

Asian musicians play on the platform

have you seen the tap dancer / trumpeter?

err, this is true -- I think my point was I usually see "OLD BLACK DUDE WITH GUITAR" or "ETHUSIASTIC NON WHITE DUDE WITH ACCORDIAN" walking around on the trains

Anyway: I actually do think white people are more afraid to change cars.

Train-walking = vocal-harmony groups (black) and mariachi-style singers (Latino)

Tunnels = Andean pipers, solo trumpet or violin (good reverb!), or young man with acoustic guitar singing early Beatles

The creepiest thing in the stations are the guys doing the Latin dancing with female dummies strapped to their feet. It looks like they're dancing with a corpse.

Dummy-dancing = yes, creepoid. Though not as creepoid as the great singing-saw lady at 42nd who for some reason makes this weird, blissful, and totally frightening face while she's playing.

i agree! xpost

No Woman, No Cry (Sorry, Bob)
Knockin' on Heaven's Dorr (Sorry, Bob)

rasta asked little kid what his teddy bear's name was, then improvised a song based around "Jackson, the Teddy Bear". kid was smiles ear to ears and i saw Dad palm him a twenty.

er, is NYC "largely" non-white? new Orleans (before Katrina), Detroit sure, but even today i think the sizable "white' pop is a rather large minority, any stats on that? (sorry for nit-picky). but you're right about maybe being a native thing, I would do this a lot back in the day(often due to seat, odor or ac issues, but sometimes just cuz i could)

But the demographic of "kids who ride the subway home from school through Manhattan" is definitely not-very-white.

(xpost yeah, Timmy, I think those enclaves have diminished somewhat, at least closer to the city core. But yeah, when it comes to white native New Yorkers who aren't just wealthy, the bulk of those I encounter are either Italian or Jewish.)

According to the census, whites have been a minority in NYC since the '80s. And the same will be true of NY state in a few years, according to the New York Times on 3/7/06

Page 1
New York Times
March 7, 2006
Whites to Be Minority in N.Y. Soon, Data
Show
By SAM ROBERTS
The influx of foreigners to New York and its suburbs and the continuing exodus of non-
Hispanic whites to other parts of the country have transformed the face of metropolitan
New York so profoundly that whites will constitute a minority of the region's population
within a few years, demographers say.
The shift would make New York the first large metropolitan area outside the South and
West in which whites do not make up a majority, according to an analysis of 2004
Census estimates by the Brookings Institution that was released yesterday.
The analysis also reveals a historic reversal: For the first time since at least the 19th
century, the black population of both the city and, to a lesser extent, the region, has
declined. In the five boroughs, according to the estimates, the number of blacks declined
by about 30,000 since 2000, dipping below 30 percent of the overall population, as the
migration of blacks to the suburbs and areas like the South outpaced immigration from
the Caribbean and Africa.
In contrast, the analysis found that while the greater New York region over all lost
162,000 non-Hispanic whites and several hundred blacks from 2000 to 2004, the region
gained 288,000 Hispanic people and 201,000 Asians — more Asians, in fact, than any
other metropolitan area.
Increasingly, the New York region's growing multiracial makeup reflects the changing
face of the inner ring of suburbs as many new immigrants bypass the city altogether or
migrate from the city to neighboring counties after a generation or less.
What makes the city and the region unusual, though, is that among the nation's 88
metropolitan areas with half a million or more people, New York is one of only three —
Houston and Honolulu are the others — where the proportion of blacks, Hispanics and
Asians each exceeds their share of the national population.
Whites have been a minority in New York City since the 1980's. But now that shift is
extending to the wider metropolitan area, driven by immigration and higher birth rates
among immigrants. Already, non-Hispanic whites are a minority of the metropolitan
area's population younger than 15.
"New York is still the classic melting pot, with a whole diverse array of immigrants
coming in, but the suburbs are now becoming part of this bigger melting pot," said
William H. Frey, the Brookings Institution demographer who conducted the analysis.
"The suburbs are now tasting this new diversity."
Page 2
His analysis found that whites declined to 52.2 percent of the population in 2004 from
54.2 percent in 2000 in the census-defined metropolitan area, which includes the city,
Long Island, the northern suburbs, northern New Jersey and northeastern Pennsylvania,
but not Connecticut.
"We went down 2.1 percent from 2000 to 2004," Dr. Frey said. "If we go another 2
percent before the end of the decade, you're there." He added: "The suburbs are now
contributing to this. They've all shown a decline in the percent of whites since 1990."
The approaching statistical milestone in the New York region has not been unexpected by
demographers.
"What this shows is that the pattern is spreading out," said Andrew A. Beveridge, a
demographer at Queens College of the City University of New York, "and the non-
Hispanic white population is continuing to dwindle."
"The New York metropolitan area is becoming more like the city, and the nation's
metropolitan areas are becoming more like New York," Dr. Beveridge said.
The trend was foreshadowed in an earlier analysis by New York's Department of City
Planning, which found that while the region's ethnic and racial numbers had been driven
for several decades by changes in the five boroughs, those changes were also being
mirrored in the suburban counties closest to the city.
"The inner-ring suburbs are emulating the city," said Joseph J. Salvo, director of the
department's population division.
What's happening in New York has already occurred in metropolitan areas in the West
and South, including Los Angeles, Miami, Houston and San Francisco.
The proportion of whites has also dipped to just over a majority in the San Diego,
Washington, Dallas and Las Vegas metropolitan regions as Asian and Hispanic people
disperse beyond central cities and their suburbs and as blacks migrate to the South. In
each of those areas, whites are already a minority of the population under age 15.
Atlanta led large metropolitan areas in black population growth and is poised to overtake
Chicago as the region with the second-highest black population in total numbers, after
New York.
In 1990, metropolitan Los Angeles and New York accounted for 30 percent of the
nation's Hispanic population. By 2004, those two regions were home to only 23 percent
of Hispanic people.
"For immigrant minorities, especially, friendship and family networks have drawn them
to traditional ports of entry, even during times when labor market considerations would
suggest they move elsewhere," Dr. Frey wrote. "Blacks, as well, have tended to follow
well-worn patterns, initially out of the South and, later, to a network of cities across the
North and West."
Page 3
But more recently, he concluded, "many lower-skilled Hispanic migrants are moving to
fast-growing areas of the country, in response to retail, service and construction job
growth, while higher-skilled minority migrants are following the same professional
opportunities that have attracted whites."
Copyright 2006The New York Times Company
Minorities avoid wilderness activities,
advocates look for fix
By MICHAEL HILL
Associated Press Writer
August 25, 2005, 11:01 AM EDT
Bunyan Bryant has camped by the shores of Lake Huron for decades and usually sees the
same thing: green trees, blue skies and white people.
"I seldom see other African-Americans or even other minorities camping," said Bryant,
director of the Environmental Justice Initiative at the University of Michigan.
"Sometimes they might be with another church group or something like that, but truly
speaking it doesn't happen."
It's the same story from New York's Adirondacks to Arizona's canyons: there's a lack of
ethnic and racial diversity in the outdoor areas where people hike, camp, mountain bike,
paddle and picnic. In a time when minority populations are growing, wilderness
advocates and administrators are reaching out to blacks, Hispanics and Asians to change
that.
"We're only serving part of the public now and we aspire to represent many, many people
who are not using all the public lands," said Neil Woodworth of the Adirondack
Mountain Club.
The Outdoor Industry Foundation this summer reported that 79 percent of people taking
part in outdoor activities like hiking and kayaking last year were Caucasian, 6 percent
were black and 4 percent were Hispanic.
Blacks and Hispanics combined make up 27 percent of the U.S. population.
The U.S. Forest Service found similar trends in Arizona, where whites accounted for 88
percent or more of the visitors to the six national forests in that state, even though
Hispanics make up about a quarter of the state's population.
Page 4
Economic and geographic conditions have something to do with it _ think of a city
dweller who lacks a car, or even the money to buy a tent. But money has become less a
factor as more blacks and Hispanics enter the middle class, said Alan Spears, associate
director of cultural diversity programs at the National Parks Conservation Association.
Advocates and academics say cultural factors can play a large part. Marta Maldonado of
Iowa State University's sociology department said the concept of "wilderness" is a
western European idea, not one necessarily shared by minority groups. As U.S. Forest
Chief Dale Bosworth noted in a speech early this year, "the face of conservation has
traditionally been rural and white. "
For blacks descended from sharecroppers, camping might have associations of living on a
farm and of poverty, Bryant said. Hispanics whose families are new to this country might
have the same sort of negative associations with roughing it, Spears said.
While reasons for avoiding the woods can be different for different groups, there might
be a common feeling among minorities that it is unwelcome territory.
"It's all couched under a larger fear that maybe with some of these public lands, you're
going to run into white supremacists in camouflage clothing running seven-man assault
drills or something like that," Spears said.
Whatever the reasons, advocates for public land use are concerned. Aside from wanting
to make sure the widest range of people take advantage of natural areas, the Adirondack
Mountain Club's Woodworth noted that minorities represent a growing constituency who
will be weighing in on land use policies.
Woodworth's group has a number of programs aimed at introducing minority children to
the outdoors. The Breakfree program run by its mid-Hudson Valley chapter takes high
school students in Poughkeepsie out to climb mountains, camp overnight or paddle up the
Hudson.
"We have to make the effort to say `You're welcome here,"' said Breakfree's Tom Lint.
Similarly, the National Wildlife Federation's Earth Tomorrow program targets inner-city
kids in Houston, Atlanta, Detroit, Seattle and elsewhere. The kids fish, hike or listen to
talks on endangered species.
Federal officials also have been trying to make parks more hospitable to a wider array of
people.
Improvements to the Applewhite Picnic Area in California's San Bernardino National
Forest include bilingual signs, hosts that speak Spanish and larger picnic tables to
accommodate bigger groups. Now, about 80 percent of people using Applewhite are
Hispanics, an increase from years past, said Deborah Chavez of the service's Pacific
Southwest Research Station.
Page 5
Chavez notes that it can be difficult to promote park areas to Hispanics since they tend to
respond more to word of mouth than advertisements and brochures.
That's why so many advocates focus on outreach: once people start showing up in
wilderness areas, the problem often takes care of itself.
"Once you get people to the Grand Canyon," Spears said, "you don't have to do a lot of
talking."
___
On the Net:
Environmental Justice Initiative: http://eji.snre.umich.edu/index.html
The Outdoor Industry Association: http://www.outdoorindustry.org/
U.S. Forest Service: http://www.fs.fed.us/
Adirondack Mountain Club: http://www.adk.org/
National Wildlife Federation: http://www.nwf.org/

another thing white guys in business suits are apt to do: spread out their fucking newspapers to the fullest as they're reading them, no matter how full the car is.

No, just referring to the old expression -- "dog bites man, that's not news; man bites dog, now that's news."

This would have been news either way, but obviously there's something odd and inverted about a black man throwing a rock through a white person's window because there are too many of them around and "there goes the neighborhood," etc.

but, officially, yeah, nobody's supposed to walk thru even the unlocked ones on the number lines either.

kids mainly walk thru cars for the adventure component, yeah, and i think that yeah you'll have lots more black and latino kids riding the subway to/from school than white ones for a thousand reasons having to do w/ demographics and the weird way the ny school system works in assigning kids to schools and etc.