so Dubya wants to shut down Gitmo

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An interesting "admission": "No question, Guantanamo sends, you know, a signal to some of our friends -- provides an excuse, for example, to say, 'The United States is not upholding the values that they're trying encourage other countries to adhere to,"' Bush said.

also apparently we're holding people there that are "darn dangerous". Gosh, who knew?

Can we take bets on how long Gitmo stays open? It'd be refreshing to see a Dem candidate for pres make a campaign issue of closing it.

― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 14 June 2006 22:11 (nineteen years ago)

I could see him closing it as his big PR move of '08.

― The Jazz Guide to Penguins on Compact Disc (Rock Hardy), Wednesday, 14 June 2006 22:45 (nineteen years ago)

"Mission Accomplished"

― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 14 June 2006 22:47 (nineteen years ago)

It's the new humbler, gentler Dubya.

BTW, I imagine the admin feels Gitmo has been made obsolete by the US's system of secret prisons all around the globe.

― Abbadavid Berman (Hurting), Thursday, 15 June 2006 02:13 (nineteen years ago)

"No question, Guantanamo sends, you know, a signal to some of our friends -- provides an excuse, for example, to say, 'The United States is not upholding the values that they're trying encourage other countries to adhere to,"' Bush said.

Bush administration in hypocrisy shocker!

I imagine the admin feels Gitmo has been made obsolete by the US's system of secret prisons all around the globe.

Good point, but could it also be because the value of the camp remaining open is outweighed by the economic costs and damage to propaganda value? Bush admits that it sends the wrong message and also prevents the US from taking the moral high ground. Gitmo is incredibly damaging to public relations, and they also don't seem to be getting anywhere with prosecuting the detainees.

Bets are the camp will be closed before the next presidential election.

― salexandra (salexander), Thursday, 15 June 2006 04:40 (nineteen years ago)

What I love is the way the fact that people have committed suicide is "proof" that there are actual "dangerous people" there.

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Thursday, 15 June 2006 10:28 (nineteen years ago)

"Suicide??? THIS MEANS WAR!!!"

― mark grout (mark grout), Thursday, 15 June 2006 10:30 (nineteen years ago)

What I love is the way the fact that people have committed suicide is "proof" that there are actual "dangerous people" there.

And not that the suicides were acts of desperation because of the awful conditions of their imprisonment! Because people usually kill themselves for "good PR." Well they do if they are cunning evil-doers apparently.

― salexandra (salexander), Thursday, 15 June 2006 10:46 (nineteen years ago)

they probably just went on suicide bumming missions

― ken c (ken c), Thursday, 15 June 2006 10:51 (nineteen years ago)

Good point, but could it also be because the value of the camp remaining open is outweighed by the economic costs and damage to propaganda value?

not sure what value it has in the first place.

― Seriously, Try Punching This Guy in the Face and See What Happens (Enrique), Thursday, 15 June 2006 10:53 (nineteen years ago)

I meant from their perspective. Thought that was obv.

― salexandra (salexander), Thursday, 15 June 2006 10:56 (nineteen years ago)

guilt-free torture fun for the military generation

― ken c (ken c), Thursday, 15 June 2006 10:58 (nineteen years ago)

yeah i know' i have no idea what value they might find in it. what kind of intelligence is going to be gleaned from a) torture victims b) who haven't been outside of cuba in 4 1/2 years?

xpost

― Seriously, Try Punching This Guy in the Face and See What Happens (Enrique), Thursday, 15 June 2006 10:58 (nineteen years ago)

But it's not really about intelligence anymore is it? It seems like they just want to stop these "terrorists" from being released or sent back to countries where they will be released.

― salexandra (salexander), Thursday, 15 June 2006 11:00 (nineteen years ago)

they can't seriously believe that though.

― Seriously, Try Punching This Guy in the Face and See What Happens (Enrique), Thursday, 15 June 2006 11:50 (nineteen years ago)

details on their funerals and this little interesting bit at the back of the article:

Also Tuesday, the military ordered all independent news media off the base by 10 a.m. Wednesday, and had arranged a flight to Miami to expedite their departure.

A two-sentence email to reporters for The Miami Herald and Los Angeles Times, citing a directive from the Office of Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, stated: "Media currently on the island will depart on Wednesday, 14 June 2006 at 10:00 a.m. Please be prepared to depart the CBQ [quarters] at 8:00 a.m."

The correspondents came down to the base on Saturday to cover the aftermath of the suicides, at the invitation of the admiral in charge of the prison. The Pentagon canceled the invitation Tuesday night, despite protests from the newspapers.

― kingfish du lac (kingfish 2.0), Thursday, 15 June 2006 15:40 (nineteen years ago)

There are two voguish current terms which make American political discourse extremely irritating. They occur routinely in every press conference, every current-affairs broadcast, every congressional debate, and almost every editorial comment. The terms are "perception" and "signal." The first is used as either a displacement or an evasion. The speaker need not say that he thinks the consequence of policy X will be harmful. That would be definite nad thus too risky. It is usual, then, for him to intone that policy X "will be perceived" as harmful. This has two political advantages: it takes longer to say and thus sounds more important; and it is ambiguous, having all the moral weight of the statement "It's not me, it's the neighbors."

-- Christopher Hitchens, "Perceptions and Signals" (Feb. 18, 1984)

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 15 June 2006 15:42 (nineteen years ago)

xpost

i think that part of the problem now is that they've had these people locked up so long... They need to do something with them, but don't know what. Just release them? Creates even wrose propaganda than there already is ("And now it turns out they were completely innocent..."). Try them? Yes, ok, but where? Military court? US civilian court (Can't let the truth get out, unless we've got incredibly juicy details.) Home country (Eh, same risk of being released.)

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Thursday, 15 June 2006 15:45 (nineteen years ago)

I think he wants it closed the way he wanted all the votes in Florida and Ohio counted.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 15 June 2006 15:50 (nineteen years ago)

"exit strategies" are not DubyaCo's specialty.

― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 15 June 2006 15:55 (nineteen years ago)

I wish he had said "I'd like to close Guantanamao, but George W. Bush can't do that".

― DV (dirtyvicar), Thursday, 15 June 2006 16:09 (nineteen years ago)

oh man he should totally start talking in the third person.

― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 15 June 2006 16:30 (nineteen years ago)

I can't believe George Bush (or his bosses)
actually thinks he can garner goodwill by showing second
thoughts NOW. I mean, c'mon, get real man.

― Squirrel_Police (Squirrel_Police), Thursday, 15 June 2006 20:22 (nineteen years ago)

I've said it before - now that Dubya's upstaged his dad, he has no clue what to do, he couldn't "get real" even if he wanted to.

― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 15 June 2006 20:25 (nineteen years ago)

I am quite prepared to believe there is a portion of the public who will think he is a wonderful prez for FREEING these people - oh look isnt he kind, letting these poor men go free - conveniently forgetting all about why they wanted to lock them up to begin with.

― Trayce (trayce), Thursday, 15 June 2006 23:22 (nineteen years ago)

nine years pass...

Gregory B. Craig was White House counsel in 2009. Cliff Sloan was special envoy for Guantanamo closure in 2013 and 2014.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-president-doesnt-need-congresss-permission-to-close-guantanamo/2015/11/06/4cc9d2ac-83f5-11e5-a7ca-6ab6ec20f839_story.html

― skateboards are the new combover (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 11 November 2015 17:10 (ten years ago)

huh, not a legal argument I've heard before.

I wouldn't be surprised if this was some "last days in office" move by Obama

― Οὖτις, Wednesday, 11 November 2015 17:15 (ten years ago)

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