Blair's "Justice Gap" Crap

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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/5108158.stm

"It's no use saying that in theory there should be no contradiction between the rights of the suspect and the rights of that law-abiding majority.

"In practice there is such a conflict and every day we don't resolve it, the consequence is not abstract, it's out there, very real, on our streets."

What the fuck does this even mean? It seems like a guarded way of saying "well, the Police know who the real villains are, we should stop letting all this nonsense like evidence and fair trials get in the way of sticking whoever we like in jail". Is he posturing or is he really going to introduce some excitingly authoritarian legislation?

And leaving aside the easy task of frothing about that Tory cunt, what are the biggest problems facing the legal system today? Are we on the verge of anarchy or do too many people take newspapers and TV news too seriously? From where I'm sitting I can't see this tidal wave of criminality about to engulf us all. But maybe I'm a symptom of our moral decay, seeing as how much I'd like to shiv Tony in the face.

― Half loaf, half pompadour (noodle vague), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:14 (nineteen years ago)

Ah, just venting.

― Half loaf, half pompadour (noodle vague), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:15 (nineteen years ago)

Until someone has been tried and convicted they are, as Mr Blair says, a SUSPECT. Not a criminal whose rights needs to be balanced with those of their alleged victims.

Christ, you'd think that being a lawyer who's married to a lawyer he's know that sort of thing, but apprently not.

― Hello Sunshine (Hello Sunshine), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:20 (nineteen years ago)

He knows it, he doesn't care about it

― Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:23 (nineteen years ago)

I think he's trying to say that the home office might look like it's a horrible mess but don't worry, that's just an admin thing, we're doing something about the thugs and terror and hoodies and paedopervs and foreigners on our streets.

I really do believe that all these elements are part of the same thing in his head.

The biggest problem for the legal system, to my totally unqualified eye, is that the government doesn't get what it's for. Which is an unpleasant thought, especially considering TB and his wife and lots of his ministers are lawyers.

― beanz (beanz), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:24 (nineteen years ago)

I don't understand the concept of "victims' rights". In theory you have the right not to be made a victim, but clearly that has nothing to do with reality. So what do victims' rights advocates want? The right to give somebody who steals your car a good shoeing? It's totally meaningless.

― Half loaf, half pompadour (noodle vague), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:24 (nineteen years ago)

xxxpost ditto

The problem (for the govt) is that the person who is the subject of crime is not the victim of crime: strictly speaking the victim is society. And society does the weighing of justice and the punishment etc. It's not just semantics - Hence rule of law, no vigilantism etc. What should be put into the system - and increasingly is already - is sensitivity towards the feelings of people subjected to crime.

― beanz (beanz), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:27 (nineteen years ago)

I think it means he's watched to many "Death Wish" movies. Welcome to America, England!

― 100% CHAMPS with a Yes! Attitude. (Austin, Still), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:29 (nineteen years ago)

And it was another hideous Tory git who was responsible for those "Death Wish" movies!

― Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:30 (nineteen years ago)

Michael Winner's given me far more hours of harmless entertainment than the PM.

― Half loaf, half pompadour (noodle vague), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:34 (nineteen years ago)

urg

...TOO many...

― 100% CHAMPS with a Yes! Attitude. (Austin, Still), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:35 (nineteen years ago)

I'm worried we're going to end up with elected judges as a result of this NoW-felching excercise.

Which will make Dagenham an interesting place to live when the BNP get to dominate the judiciary.

― Hello Sunshine (Hello Sunshine), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:40 (nineteen years ago)

what are the biggest problems facing the legal system today?

overstuffed prisons because of the sheer number of minor criminals whose situation society makes no effort to alleviate, and by imprisoning them actively makes them worse.

tidal wave of crime? maybe not, but there is more violent crime innit.

― Roughage Crew (Enrique), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:41 (nineteen years ago)

I still blame Thatcher

― Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:44 (nineteen years ago)

this is one of those things where i do feel a bit of a root-causer. there are probably cheaper and more effective ways of making britain a less violent place than locking up thieves and dealers (ie makming people less likely to become either).

― Roughage Crew (Enrique), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:47 (nineteen years ago)

I neither know or trust the stats on crime, violent or otherwise, but yeah violent crime is prolly on the rise. What most reporting of this overlooks is that the victims of violent crime are predominantly from the same section of society as the perps, and the two groups are far from mutually exclusive. But even suggesting that trying to sort out some of the social problems amongst our underclass will reduce crime is seen as near-treasonable liberal pandering in top New Lab circles.

― Half loaf, half pompadour (noodle vague), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:50 (nineteen years ago)

Oops, I said the same thing only wordier, like.

What's alarming is that 20 years ago we'd just be repeating Labour dogma, but now it's almost unthinkable to suggest environment leads to criminality. (Unthinkable amongst the fuckwits representing "social democracy", anyway.)

― Half loaf, half pompadour (noodle vague), Friday, 23 June 2006 11:53 (nineteen years ago)

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