Can anything stop Cameron becoming the next PM?

Essentially what I'm saying is that Labour under Blair are in a comparable position now to the Tories under Thatcher in 1990ish. They still managed to win the next election, partly through "let's give this new guy a chance" and partly through just not trusting Kinnock as a potential Prime Minister. I get the feeling Cameron is still perceived of as 'nice but lightweight', which doesn't win elections.

So they'll all go and vote Ukip (or BNP), making it much harder for the Tories to win in the marginals.

The sooner people realise Cameron is a lying, two-faced sweet-talking scumbag (not unlike most politicians, I'll grant you) the better.

I think they'll vote Conservative - isn't that what Cameron's betting on? No matter how 'left' he goes the old school tories desperately want to be back in power where they truly believe they belong so they'll vote for him in the (probably) correct belief that he'll be more right wing when he gets into power.

"yeah, but it doesn't make any difference who I vote for, does it?" comes the tedious reply.

I don't think there's not enough of them for that to be significant. More significant are those New Labour voters who are basically Tories, and there's rather a lot of them. See also, the Liberal vote collapsing and going to the Tories.

But that's the real reason they're not voting, because they don't perceive that they're vote will make any difference, not because they're bone idle. I doubt there's many people out there thinking "God I desperately want Labour / The Tories / AN Other to win this election, but I just can't be fucked to walk a hundred yards and put a cross on a piece of paper, oh woe is me!"

Tedious it may be but for a lot of people, that's absolutely correct.

They won't do anything come a General Election

You try finding a left wing party to vote for, for a start

Is it really a two horse race in ur constituency? I mean, round here pretty close.

Agreed, I'll do something, but I don't think I'd be able to bring myself to vote Labour. Lib Dem counts as a protest vote around here anyway so maybe them, it's as valid as a spoiled ballot and it'll make their candidate feel a whole vote better.

I vote Lib Dem and have considered jopining the party in the past. One reason is that i am very pro-European and they seem to be the only party who really share my stance. I am pro-EU *to a point* but feel that the only real chance to reform it is to be as involved in it as possible.

in the absence of a fair electoral system of my own invention (which I plan to write a book, or at the very least start a website to promote) I consider voting Lib Dem to be the least of multiple evils.

We could end up with a situation where things swing back and forth between Labour and the Tories every four years for a while, because I really can't see Cameron winning by a 1997-style landslide. But I agree with Tom that the LibDems will be the big losers here.

NO IT'S NOT! If it's a lot of people and they ALL vote for someone, that person gets in.Sixty thousand people sitting at home saying "ho hum, I really like that independent candidate, but there's no point voting for him because he won't get in unless 59,999 other people vote for him" = wrong wrong wrong on so many levels.

"Lumping Nader in with Galloway is a vile slur on Nader!"
I meant more in the 'splitting the leftie vote to allow the right in' sense of things.

If it's a hung parliament I wouldn't bet on the LD's siding with Labour. Locally they've tended to go wherever they can.

Who gets to snap up Plaid Cymru?

I think it's highly unlikely that everyone who doesn't vote has the same political viewpoint and would want the same independent candidate to get elected.

leaflets with Matt DC's grinning face on

???

The other key factor here is a whole new generation of voters who are too young to really remember living under a Tory government and with a vivid memory of everything Labour has fucked up.

This is true. You could be well into your early 20s by now and have no memory of Margaret Thatcher.

But people don't vote for independent candidates other than single issue campaigns (eg hospital closures) for most people it's a two way choice between labour and conservatives and for a few, liberals. To many people the colour of the government is more or less irrelevant in how it would impact their day to day life. Not that it's not a justification not to vote but that's the realpolitik of the current political climate.

Yes, that really hindered Tony Blair didn't it?

xpost precisely

And they had Brown and Prescott to assuage the old school.

Support maybe, approval debatable

O RLY?

And they had Brown and Prescott to assuage the old school.

Robin Cook, too.

jack straw??! god almighty.

I'd rather have Straw than...just about everybody else on that list

Boris at 5/1 is just the bookies laughing all the way to the bank, surely?

William Hague 2

Er, what? Is that for real?

― grimly fiendish

Odds taken from oddschecker.com - it's a Ladbrokes book that I can't access without registering but oddschecker is usually very current.

Straw would only be next Labour leader in case of total meltdown, say a Tory majority of 100+ seats. He'd be a steady hand during a rebuild.

I'll say it here categorically now: if Cruddas becomes next Labour party leader, I will join the Labour Party and actively canvas for them. A truly great politician with some sensible and workable ideas for bridging the unfairness gaps in this nation.

xxxp

I'd rather have Straw than...just about everybody else on that list

Can't parse this any other way than "bonghits", tbh.

You know that it in Magical Mystery Tour, where Buster Bloodvessel (Ivor Cutler) stands at the top of the aisle, and tells the travellers that "everyone is to enjoy themselves, within the bounds of common british decency" ?

That's Jack Straw as Prime Minister.

okthxbye

Liam Fox 16

LOL. Tories must be praying that DC doesn't get hit by a bus one night while cycling home to Notting Hill.

The general feeling in the Tory party is that Hague is the best leader they have had since thatcher he just lead 10 years too soon, make of this what you will.

http://www.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2533771/tory-leadership-odds.thtml

This is OTM from the comments:
The problem with these kind of lists is that you get to see just how devoid of talent the Tory party is.

You've got a man who has previously failed in the position as favourite (which is like Newcastle constantly bringing back Kevin Keegan as manager and expecting different results)

Problem with Dom's promise is that people who give a fuck about ideas for bridging the unfairness gaps in this nation are a tiny wee minority of Labour 2.0 hence Cruddas = next to no chance

But now we're all living in 1948 again, it might be possible

The world is going to have to get a lot, lot worse before people start voting for crazy ideas like economic fairness.

Cruddas has apparently built a proper PLP coalition though amongst backbenchers... forget where I saw the article outlining this.

xxp

The bookies obv. thing he has some chance

Bookies base their odds on how the betting is going. Remember Cruddas won the first round of deputy leadership votes last year so he has a significant (but still minority) support within the party.

David Davis was on Desert Island Discs on Sunday. Among his choices was "Another Day In Paradise" by top Tory philanthropist Phil Collins.

Did he have any Kinks in there?

"Dead End Street" - to symbolise the path his career is taking

We're all going to be so disappointed when Miliband gets it.

I persist in the hope that he blew it (David Davis style) over the summer

He also picked "Get The Party Started" by Pink because it reminds him of his daughter.

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44740000/jpg/_44740953_dd_466getty.jpg

DD ride, anyone?

(Actually: I'll pass, if it's OK by you.)

Also, Cameron tottering on his pedestal and Clegg leading the Lib Dems towards oblivion gives me a small hope that the days of the Blairclone might be over - unlikely, I admit

No chance for Professor Out Of Vision On Lookylikey Milliband at the moment.

They can't both be DD.

xxxxpost

I don't think either of them are, the one on the right is hiding william hague and a beach football under her shirt.

i swear i knew the one on the right. she didn't strike me as a tory when i knew her. or have as large breasts

xps
Phil Collins denied he was a tory on Room 101. I didn't believe him.

DD's full list.

1. Pachelbel's Canon in D Major
2. Get the Party Started - Pink
3. Another Day in Paradise - Phil Collins
4. Ashokan Farewell - Ungar and Mason
5. Un Bel Di from Madame Butterfly - Puccini
6. Stealing my Democracy - Mundy-Turner
7. Brothers in Arms - Dire Straits
8. Main Theme from Schindler's List

I admit that the Mundy-Turner was new to me but what a lyrical masterpeice it is...

I’m as angry as I can be, ‘cause you made such a fool out of me
You dragged me into an illegal war,
Lied about what we’d be fighting for,
So how can I believe in you anymore?

CHORUS (You’re) Stealing my Democracy, Cutting Back on Freedom,
Stealing my Democracy, A little more each day

Well you made yourself some handy laws, so you don’t have to listen to me anymore
I can march in thousands through these city streets, singing about common sense and peace
And you can arrest me without a release
CHORUS

I’m sick of your media spin, papering over the mess we’re in
You say it’s all about what the terrorists do,
But who in the world will protect me from you?
Will anything worthwhile be left when you’re through?
CHORUS

My parents fought for humanity, not this facade you’re selling me
They bought me the right to disagree with you and anything you do

One day I’ll get you out, and there’ll be an end to this fear and doubt
I hope to heaven that I can find someone with the good of the people in mind, Someone who believes in peace in our time, instead of
Stealing my democracy….

Wot, no "Yesterday Man"?

That Pink song is about taking ecstasy isn't it? DAVIES IN DRUG SONG SHOCKA!!!

hmm, how about disrupting the state opening of parliament like some kind of rag-week toffs?

(or, whatever it is today)

Shouldn't they be protesting outside Scotland Yard instead, since it seems to have been the Met who authorised Green's arrest?

http://www.newstatesman.com/uk-politics/2008/12/cameron-obama-europe-president

Sweet!

That article piles it on a bit heavily in the second half so I'm kind of dubious about it.

Okay I wouldn't normally do this but:

david skitmore
05 December 2008 at 07:10

Cameron's a lightweight!!! and Obama's a great fantastic brilliant world statesman. The left do so love their leaders, it will all end in disappointment. Obama will end up another washout left-wing politician just like president Mugabe.

LOLz

That article piles it on a bit heavily in the second half so I'm kind of dubious about it

Yeh, but I really want to believe it, all the same.

what in the living fuck is this

http://www.chickyog.net/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/zanulabour-231x300.png

Tory call for anarchy?

Clapped out E-head who gets pranked by fake internet reports more than Animal Collective fans has opinions4u, story at 10.

"oo, where can I get one of those cooool masks?"

That'll be a 20 point lead now then.

Cynical? Moi?

he probably hired the steven lawrence killers to do it.