Are you too tentative?

No, I don't think I really do second-guess myself too much, but I do have a hard time "labeling"/identifying my (negative) emotions. When does sadness become depression for example? I'm still unsure whether labeling an emotion is always the right thing, because then you suddenly move into "new" territory. Sometimes its best not to guess at all, just go with the flow.

Hmm, yeah.

From my layman's and admittedly superficial perspective, I would venture that the sadness--->>depression dynamic can be distinguished between release and holding onto...as well as acknowledgement vs defending against.

In other words, sadness usually involves the release of crying, and then, hopefully, in the process of release, the feelings dissipate, and one returns to an equilibrium of sorts. However, if one gets stuck in the mucky feelings, then one may find one's self in depression-land.

Or, to expand upon my second thought there, sadness involves the acknowledgement (and subsequent processing) of uncomfortable feelings, even in spite of the organism's (if I may use over-clinical terminology) tendency to avoid such feelings. Depression, on the other hand, results when one either consciously or unconsciously refuses to face these uncomfortable emotions, and then one's whole system becomes blocked-- hence the sluggishness and stuck sense of lethargy which characterizes the experience of depression.

god i second, third, infinitly guess myself to death sometimes. It's sould destroying and more often than not usually results in nothing getting done.

But then I sometimes wonder that if I ever did have a shorter cut off point, would I still be alive today?

Here I go again..

I also don't like sticking "words" to emotions because they you suddenly get a lot of (extra) baggage. This is why I dislike therapy and/or *researching* any type of (mental) condition.Once you read/know about the symptoms I begin to doubt whether I have'em or not. This is when I second/third guess myself too much.

Sadness was a bad choice of words (hah!). Is there a difference between "bluesiness" and depression. When is sadness/negative state of mind a part of you? Are you really able to radically change your emotional state. (What I mean is: is it possible to really go from an optimist to a pessimist or vice versa).

Also, I really hated (although that is a strong word) my parents telling me I was/am stubborn.
Once you tell someone you are, then you're stuck with that label.

(xxxpost)

That's a tangent which presents much food for thought, but I guess my original question is more concerned with the whole act of second-guessing which many of us do in everyday situations, regardless of whether they have social components or not. That is to say, we're undoubtedly here on this planet; we're here, that in itself should be "sufficient". ...but yet why do some of us neurotically doubt or try to evade the truth of who we are? Why do we constantly look for cues from others who might confirm or disconfirm our self-images? Why this looking to outward sources of authority in regards to our own intimate felt existential sense of being, when we are already "here"? (i.e., we've shown up, we exist, that should be confirmation in and of itself, no?)

If this reads as being a projection of my own projected adolescent-ish hyper-self-consciousness, then I readily admit that I am guilty as charged...

I suppose what I am really asking is, why do we (some of us, anyhow) have such problems living our lives according to our own innate sense of felt authenticity?

Ah yes, well, then, no, I don't really look for confirmation that much (anymore). I used to though, especially asking my parents who/what I was. Now I rarely do. I wonder why... I don't really feel the need to look at others as to who I am because that's their perception so are they the "right judges?" No, they're not. We're a puzzle: each small piece is what others (and I) think who/what I am.

not to a 'neurotic degree' but I certainly would like to be a bit more decisive, particularly at work

(What I mean is: is it possible to really go from an optimist to a pessimist or vice versa).

Also, I really hated (although that is a strong word) my parents telling me I was/am stubborn.
Once you tell someone you are, then you're stuck with that label.

Yes, I actually do believe that one can do such things. And I know that this may incur a lot of flack, but I also believe that one can snap out of depression in an instant. I'm not adopting some $cientology across-the-boards anti-meds thing here, nor am I denying neurological/genetic/biological components to depression, etc....

However, I have experienced in myself, the (many-times, as I think you are saying, negative) power of, labeling your emotions or having them be labeled as such and such, and consequently the solidifying effect which seems to result. Um, what I mean is, I have felt horrible at times; like suicidal-ideation variety of horrible, and then snapped out of it simply by taking (even if by accident) some step which led me to see how much the doledrums that I was in at the time was essentially a constructed state of sorts, and ultimately as fragile as any "happy" feelings that I've felt (or any other emotional tendencies, for that matter).

And I agree, being labeled as "stubborn" or what have you, can present a huge stumbling block in and of itself. For example, I'm guessing that we all might agree that shame is a toxic emotion... though, crucially, I think, anyway, it's one that's pretty much based on others' labeling our behaviour as "wrong" or "bad" or whatever. In order to see ourselves through the punishing nature of feeling shame, I reckon that we have to go through a deconstruction process of sorts in regards to those particular feelings...

xxpost

I think that's great...especially if you've furthermore overcome, or are at least aware of the tendency to project your parents' judgements of you onto everyone else in the world that you come into contact with...

Personally, I don't even think I've reached kindergarten, as far as all that's concerned!

But then I sometimes wonder that if I ever did have a shorter cut off point, would I still be alive today?

Here I go again..

Ha, yeah, it's a conundrum of sorts, to say the least. But I guess that we have to have some sort of fundamental trust in some fundamental part of ourselves. That's what I'm thinking, anyway. I think that, in that regard, Jung was definitely onto something. God knows that I've had dreams at night which have indicated to me that at least some part deep-down inside me knows what's up.

I don't know if I can answer this...

I'm not sure either...

I'm going to wait for the commission to present its findings before presuming to comment and I suggest the right honourable gentleman does the same!

Seriously though - dell, I find it very hard to follow what you're writing. But if I hear you right, you're mainly talking about second- and third-guessing yourself. And driving yourself crazy because of it.

But wouldn't be more of a characteristic of people who are LESS tentative? That is to say, if you never do anything decisive or interesting, there's nothing to second-guess!

You're otm, Tracer...and, honestly, my sloppy writing here is not helping matters.

Hmm, that's interesting the way you flipped around the question. But I guess I'm thinking more of pre-emptory second-guessing, more than after-the-fact stuff, if that makes sense.

Well, I guess it would be second-guessing after the fact rather than before, but would that still go under the heading of being too tentative? I often don't have trouble knowing what I want to do, and doing it, but then I spend way too much time and energy thinking I should've done (or, even worse, wanted to do!) some other thing - I guess I'd call that general insecurity.

xpost ok then we have figured out the difference!

Then I guess my answer is "no".

"What authority are you looking for to grant some sort of go-ahead or confirmation as far as how you present yourself to the other human beings?"

When I was a little girl I thought the Holy Ghost was telling me everything or giving me all my confirmation, to the point where with every decision or action I made (even small ones like opening the door), I'd try to figure out if it was me or the holy ghost or both coming up with this. Fortunately I got over it bcz it was really schizophrenic and worrying and distracting.

perhaps, but i could be wrong

waht?

sometimes, when i'm procrastinating (like now)

Ahahaha, Oh Abbot, we have crazy stories, both of us. Those books about demonic possession & angelic spiritual warfare came out while I was in jr high and gave me some crazy anxiety about not being able to control my own thoughts. Which of course as soon as I worried about it, my brain sent out more and more blasphemous things for me to worry about.

Also at some point someone told me that after yr death the entire list of your life's sins is read allowed for everyone in Heaven to hear before you can be forgiven of them. I actually stopped some perfectly normal activities for a year or two b/c of my shame to have them be public knowledge after death. And after my grandma died I used to ponder how much longer it would take for that reading, how long it takes to condense a life. Religion, mang, it fucks you up.

ALLOWED?? I shd have been more tentative about letting my fingers run away with my brain.