Evil Taking Sides: Erik Prince or Viktor Bout?

Arg, could a mod please fix my typos in the thread title?

bump

I know it's hard to decide between a mercenary army and a guy who arms both sides of conflicts in developing countries, but surely the ilxmassive have some thoughts about these guys?

http://img240.imageshack.us/img240/9594/ilxmd0.jpg
http://www.gamesetwatch.com/massif.JPG

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The nerve of this fucking guy! Hiding in Thailand and trying to sell guns to the FARC?!
Who does he think he is? The "Merchant of Death"?

Also: being played by Nic Cage in a biopic btw

"We are extremely pleased," Acting Deputy U.S. Attorney General Gary G. Grindler said in a statement. "We have always felt that the facts of the case, the relevant Thai law and the terms of our bilateral extradition treaty clearly supported the extradition of Mr. Bout on these charges."

Also: Acting Deputy U.S. Attorney General Gary G. Grindler

(above post is about bout btw)

they are both SO FUCKING MALEVOLENT that it's hard to choose, but I'm gonna go with this guy.
What a disgusting motherfucker.

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE67J0V920100820

Acting Deputy U.S. Attorney General Gary G. Grindler
Acting Deputy U.S. Attorney General Gary G. Grindler
Acting Deputy U.S. Attorney General Gary G. Grindler
Acting Deputy U.S. Attorney General Gary G. Grindler
Acting Deputy U.S. Attorney General Gary G. Grindler
Acting Deputy U.S. Attorney General Gary G. Grindler

btw this is what he was trying to sell to the FARC:

According to the U.S. indictment, Bout told undercover agents in Bangkok he could supply them with 700 to 800 surface-to-air missiles, 5,000 AK-47 assault rifles, millions of rounds of ammunition, C-4 explosives, landmines and unmanned aerial drones.

Why were the Russians so anxious to keep Bout out of American hands? Known as “Africa’s merchant of death,” Bout is thought by U.S. officials to have built an empire worth perhaps $6 billion. According to a U.N. report, he supplied arms to Angola, the Democratic Republic of the Congo, Liberia, Rwanda, Sierra Leone, and Sudan (not to mention Afghanistan). “Bout had the ability to acquire the most sophisticated weapons systems that the former Soviet bloc could offer,” Braun says. “He could not have acquired the weapons systems he did without complicity at the highest ranks of the government and military in Russia.” Yevgeny Khorishko, a spokesman for the Russian Embassy, says, “Russian officials were never involved in any activities of Mr. Bout, if there were any activities—and there is no proof of that.”

I'm back to say that I am currently reading this book or
http://www.mywebsite.com/mylink.html about Blackwater and WOW Erik Prince is a malevolent piece of shit.

Nice facial expression, asshole.

http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/erik_prince.jpg

ugh i was so disgusted i messed up the link to the book but you can see how that might happen when there is this degree of repulsiveness involved
i mean really

I'm finally almost done with this book and I have gasped on so many occasions while reading it that I just...I don't even know where to start. I wish I could blame it all on Erik Prince, but that would leave out the hundreds (thousands!) of other assholes who have worked tirelessly to exploit other humans and turn this planet into a giant fiery shitball.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7228/6946067832_3f98cd3960.jpg

Strange things going on with Viktor Bout -- could he be offering himself up as a stooge prisoner to inflame international relations? I wouldn't it put it past the guy! I am 90% sure that he's malevolent to the core.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/07/world/europe/russia-denounces-us-sentencing-of-arms-dealer.html

For reference's sake -- my reference, I guess, since apparently this is where I blog about evil.

MOSCOW — Russia lashed out at the United States on Friday over the sentencing of a convicted Russian arms trafficker to 25 years in prison, calling the decision by a New York court “baseless and biased” and warning that it could hamper relations between Moscow and Washington.

Albert Y. Dayan, lawyer for Viktor Bout, exited the U.S. Federal Court in New York after the sentencing on Thursday.

A Federal District Court judge in Manhattan sentenced the arms trafficker, Viktor Bout, on Thursday. Mr. Bout was convicted last fall of conspiring to kill Americans after trying to sell weapons to undercover American agents posing as members of a rebel group, the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia, known as the FARC.

“The American justice system, clearly carrying out a political order, ignored the arguments of lawyers and multiple appeals from different spheres made in the defense of this Russian citizen,” Russia’s Foreign Ministry said in a statement.

Russia has vocally opposed every stage of Mr. Bout’s four-year legal case, which began in March 2008 when agents from the Drug Enforcement Administration arrested him in Thailand. American agents had reportedly enticed him there with an offer to buy millions of dollars worth of military equipment, including AK-47s, missiles and ultralight airplanes, a deal to which he apparently agreed.

Russian officials have described the case as a conspiracy that involved government collusion with the courts, the American media and even Hollywood. Mr. Bout is said to have been the inspiration behind the 2005 film “Lord of War,” starring Nicolas Cage.

“Long before the sentence against Bout was delivered, the government anointed him the ‘merchant of death’ and practically an international terrorist,” the ministry statement said. “The smear campaign unleashed by the American media had the goal of influencing the jury and the trial in the ‘needed direction.’ ”

The ministry said it would take steps to try to return Mr. Bout to Russia, though it did not say what those steps would be.

I'm sorry, correction -- this is from Bout's website:

Victor Bout is a dynamic, charismatic, spontaneous, well-dressed, well-spoken, and highly energetic person who can easily communicate in several languages including Russian, Portuguese, English, French, Arabic, among several others. He is a born salesman with undying love for aviation and eternal drive to succeed.

Bout's in the news a lot these days. Viktor's wife, Alla, has recently submitted a petition for extradition to Russia.
That's all for now.

?

you can submit a petition to extradite yourself?

I'm not sure, this is what my google alert told me

http://rt.com/politics/bout-russia-us-court-legal-574/

The family of Viktor Bout, the Russian national who was sentenced to 25 years in prison in the US, has submitted a petition to the Russian Justice Ministry for extraditing Bout to Russia.

­Viktor Bout's wife, Alla, told reporters on Friday she filed a petition with the Justice Ministry requesting that her husband be extradited to Russia to serve out his sentence.

A relevant petition from Bout himself or his lawyers is now required before the process may begin.

Bout’s dramatic legal journey began in 2008 in Thailand, where he was arrested and eventually extradited to the United States. There, he was charged with attempting to sell arms to the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC).

In November 2011, the Russian businessman, who owned an air transport company, was convicted by a New York federal court of “conspiracy to kill Americans and US officials, deliver anti-aircraft missiles and aid a terrorist organization.”

Meanwhile, lawyers for Bout, 45, say receiving a fair trial in the US for their client was “unlikely” considering America’s already preconceived notions, thanks in no small part to Hollywood's portrayal of Bout.

In 2005, Nicolas Cage played the part of ‘Yuri Orlov’ in the film Lord of War, which was said to be loosely based on the life and times of Viktor Bout.

The film grossed over $72 million dollars at the box office.

oh i get it

Mostly I think it's interesting how this is being framed as a Moscow-USA beef by Bout's people (and Moscow itself?)

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/About/General/2010/12/1/1291214177496/Suspected-arms-dealer-Vik-006.jpg

Former associates of convicted international arms dealer Viktor Bout exploited loopholes to set up a global trafficking ring with their sights set on selling weapons to war-torn countries like Sudan, Somalia, Iran and possibly Syria, an investigation has revealed.

The report, by Kathi Lynn Austin, a former UN arms investigator and executive director of Conflict Awareness Project (Cap) shows how close two of Bout's lieutenants came to establishing a fresh gunrunning network in the wake of his conviction last year, despite being under US government watch or subject to US sanctions.

At a press conference on Tuesday at the UN in New York, where representatives from 190 countries are midway through negotiations over the first Arms Trade Treaty, Austin said: "These brokers go to extreme lengths to reap profits from conflict, atrocity and UN sanctions-busting. As we speak, gunrunners are out there exploiting every loophole in a global arms trade that is out of control."

The six-week investigation describes how "classic techniques" of illicit arms brokers were used including flags of convenience, money laundering and establishing multiple layers of "shell companies" to evade detection and accountability.

The investigation also uncovered new techniques, including a switch away from a previous reliance on aging Russian aircraft to predominately western passenger planes.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jul/17/viktor-bout-associates-arms-smuggling

Sweeeeeet he's (1) in Illinois and (2) hanging with terrorists.

From http://english.ruvr.ru/2012_07_27/Bout-serving-term-with-terrorists-learning-arabic/

Jailed Russian businessman Viktor Bout is serving his term with terrorists and learning the Arabic language, his lawyer Albert Dayan told RIA Novosti.

The businessman, who has continually denied the charges against him, was sentenced to 25 years in April. Bout is serving his prison term in the United States Penitentiary, Marion (USP Marion) in Illinois.

Attorney General Eric Holder said earlier the United States may consider Bout’s extradition to Russia if it receives a request from the Russian authorities.

RIA

Oooooh good story about the guy who led the sting that eventually caught Bout

That Milione was the one who spearheaded the investigation would surprise those who knew him in the late 1980s. That was when the future agent was trying to make it big as an actor onstage and in television in New York. But after seven years of landing parts off-Broadway and in soap operas, Milione decided to pursue another lifelong dream: joining the DEA.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/crime/a-dea-agent-an-undercover-sting-and-the-merchant-of-death/2012/09/05/f0b59474-f306-11e1-892d-bc92fee603a7_story.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/rf/image_606w/2010-2019/WashingtonPost/2012/08/24/Others/Images/2012-08-23/16milione_1345767361.jpg

http://www.businessinsider.com/erik-prince-frontier-resource-group-2012-11

Prince told the South China Post:

"Africa is so far the most unexplored part of the world, and I think China has seen a lot of promise in Africa," Prince said during a brief trip to Hong Kong last week to meet potential Chinese investors and partners. "But the problem is if you go alone, you bear the country risk on your own. You have to get support and maintenance there."

Prince recently secured approximately $100 million through a private equity fund in order to establish operations of his newly founded Frontier Resource Group (FRG). The new company, according to Prince who holds the title "managing partner," will invest in critical African resource development projects.

Still got my eye on you, creep!!

The new company, according to Prince who holds the title "managing partner," will invest in critical African resource development projects.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/39/Leopold_ii_garter_knight.jpg/220px-Leopold_ii_garter_knight.jpg

I still haven't decided who is more evil but I gotta say that for bottom-feeding capitalism, Prince is indeed royalty.

Kinda less depressing there about Prince himself, so much as all the RAH RAH AMERICA WAR ON TERROR RAH RAH types who loved Blackwater/Prince would see absolutely nothing wrong with him buddying up to the PRC and going Soldier of Fortune in Africa.

It's his bread & butter -- rah rah war profiteering in the name of the righteousness/"efficiency" is what does, I think? I think the righteousness is what gives him an edge over Bout, but only slightly.

Happy anniversary, asshole! 10 years ago, a war started that earned you nothing short of bajillions of dollars. Hope you're happy!

Spending on the program jumped from $50 million in 2003 to $613 million in 2006. According to the Congressional Oversight Committee’s investigation, “In fiscal year 2001, Blackwater had $736,906 in federal contracts. By 2006, Blackwater had over $593 million in government contracts, an increase of more than 80,000%.”1

--Jeremy Scahill, Blackwater

While we're talking about money, how about this dollar amount spent on "defense"?

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/iraq-war-on-terror/the-iraq-war-how-we-spent-800-billion-and-counting/

While we're at it:

...the most noteworthy thing about the largely failed prosecution wasn’t the outcome. It was the tens of thousands of pages of documents—some declassified—that the litigation left in its wake. These documents illuminate Blackwater’s defense strategy—and it’s a fascinating one: to defeat the charges it was facing, Blackwater built a case not only that it worked with the CIA—which was already widely known—but that it was in many ways an extension of the agency itself.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/03/14/exclusive-erik-prince-on-blackwater-s-secret-cia-past.html

I now have the Sy Hersh book about the Iraq buildup AND the scahill Blackwater book, good (bad) times ahead for me.

You will never look at a visor mirror in the same way again. So many bad times ahead for you!

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7385/8813413418_f389e93da0.jpg

erik prince was just on the daily show to promote his new book and he made the hair on the back of my neck stand up -- what a practiced asshole he is!!

Bout's in the news a lot these days. Viktor's wife, Alla, has recently submitted a petition for extradition to Russia.
That's all for now.

― nicest bitch of poster (La Lechera), Thursday, July 12, 2012 10:21 AM (1 year ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

?

you can submit a petition to extradite yourself?

― du. duplass. duplass mich. (goole), Thursday, July 12, 2012 10:28 AM (1 year ago)

(a year late, but)

yeah, what's that alla bout?

lol
it's alla bout extradition

the disaster in ferguson has made me realize that thinking about munitions companies/security contractors/arms dealing is totally a freakout trigger for me. i can't even really think too hard about it because it makes me so overwhelmed and angry.
and yet the fact remains: some people are in the killing machine business and they think that's ok
it just makes me sick! it doesn't even have anything directly to do with either of the two people in the thread title, but same horrifying toxic concept: sell the killing machines. ugh.

as i type this, erik prince is warming up his cold hands and thinking of ways to capitalize on ebola

or healthcare
or germ suits

I had never seen this thread before! Lotta educating to do.

I'm not sure, this is what my google alert told me

I love that you have/had? google alerts for mentions of an arms dealer.

Erik Prince gets my vote btw but that's because of his connections to my home state and the amt of damage his wife and her family have done and are doing there (and nationally, through ALEC and similar).

you have to read the blackwater book
it gave me waking nightmares!

i haven't turned off my google alerts on these jerks

I move to add Paul Manafort to this thread https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Manafort

Back in court to argue for a new trial:

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-crime-bout-idUSKBN12V1TZ?feedType=RSS&feedName=domesticNews

He claims Andrew Smulian was a government informant and therefore there couldn't have been a viable conspiracy between them to sell weapons. Smulian served a year in jail, Bout will probably do twenty five.

It's highly unlikely that Bout will win but hopefully they have been building other cases against him on the off chance.

https://magazine.atavist.com/the-mastermind

this is engrossing!!

three episodes in and while the author in episode 1 or 2 seems to imply that this guy's business compares with that of guys like viktor bout and el chapo, so much of this story makes it seem like small potatoes -- there's the fact that this guy came up as an internet troll, his whole schlubby look, and then there's the "fargo"-esque hit job on the real estate broker and general nobody-ness of most of the peripheral characters. still, great reporting and can't wait to finish tonight

That's helpful, thanks! Might check it out over winter break.
Downside to this thread being bumped is imagining what sort of awful things Steve Bannon will do to place/more like keep himself in the esteemed company of the most evil humans working in the global evil industry today.

That, and Erik Prince's sister being named Secretary of Education.

i found this piece in long form's year-end countdown. it was #2

Aaaaaamd there's Erk Prince

Wondering if he'll be Secretary of Defense, if he has some kind of immunity.

Nooooooooo I already can't sleep :(

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/the-domestic-conspiracy-that-gave-trump-the-election_us_587ed24fe4b0b110fe11dbf9

Unfortunately for all our nightmares. Nothing we didn't know or couldn't have guessed.

Only now they have installed themselves at the highest levels of the government, which iirc they have been milking rather substantially for their own profit (in God's name??) at taxpayer expense.

I feel despondent about this but how I feel doesn't matter. They are in charge now and we have to figure out how to protect ourselves ;_; I'm going to get hyped at the march on Sat and keep my head up, as usual.

Erik Prince currently winning the evil-off.

got a flurry of google alerts today for both of them today :(

was reminded of Erik Prince when reading this first-person narrative https://www.autostraddle.com/i-was-trained-for-the-culture-wars-in-home-school-awaiting-someone-like-mike-pence-as-a-messiah-367057/

esp here

They don’t care if their war for Christ hurts humans they see as living wrongfully, because they are capital “R” Right and that’s what matters. Their Rightness, they believe, comes from God Himself. Their beliefs are callous and without empathy, prioritizing dogma over people. These beliefs are dangerous. Many of us who have come out as queer, trans, or even merely gone to college, have lost family because of this worldview. A single powerful person who is convinced of their own Rightness with no thought of introspection is dangerous. We now have a government full of them.

Aha!

Blackwater founder held secret Seychelles meeting to establish Trump-Putin back channel

And now

https://www.thenation.com/article/blackwater-founder-implicated-murder/

That's from 2009

Oh...

aggggghhhhhh erik prince is on npr right now giving his pitch for privatizing the war in afghanistan
he's describing describing describing the problem and then he inserts his miracle solution -- "hire people to go there for a long time"
fuck this evil person

Blackwater murder conviction thrown out, other sentences overturned. I represented 6 victims of these crimes. 1/ https://t.co/gs2I5kHLfS

— Paul Dickinson (@prdickinson) August 4, 2017

More on Prince pushing for private army in Afghanistan:

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/politics/presidential/20170804_ap_1333648611dd46b4868d591f4ed7c9ff.html

this guy sends me over the edge, i almost can't read about it anymore

Erik Prince on MSNBC, asked for precedent for his give-mercs-Afghanistan proposal: "East India Co, not that I'm advocating colonization..."

— Spencer Ackerman (@attackerman) August 8, 2017

NY Times gives Prince op-ed space.

GROSS

Disgusting.

doctor doom: doombots, not the fantastic four, will save latveria

for future reference here's how you promote your war profiteering in way that won't offend people. https://t.co/hjMWtYRUeW pic.twitter.com/j7hDRon0GJ

— Adam H. Johnson (@adamjohnsonNYC) August 30, 2017

all war pigs are war pigs

NYTimes's super secret op-ed editorial process https://t.co/cV3RKq2FCs

— Adam H. Johnson (@adamjohnsonNYC) August 30, 2017

oh cool, an editorial star chamber

Yes, the gravely serious and secretive editorial process that makes important decisions to publish things like Erik Prince's op-ed and a piece opining that Despacito is really important in Trump's America.

The fact that people like Erik Prince, Paul Manafort, others whose names I don't even know yet are scooching and elbowing their way into increasingly powerful positions is freaking me out
international misery exploiters
they are literally THE WORST

This Niger situation has to have Prince’s fingerprints all over it.

Source in Saudi Arabia says American private security contractors are carrying out'interrogations' on princes and billionaires arrested in crackdown

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5108651/American-mercenaries-torturing-Saudi-princes.html

This guy’s a contender:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Nader_(businessman)

Betsy DeVos is a greed wraith
I am aware she and Erik Prince are part of the same greedy horrible family and yet she distinguishes herself from the war profiteering/misery-based capitalism by actually taking things away from people. She is truly disgusting.

https://jacobinmag.com/2018/09/richard-devos-amway-multi-level-marketing-conservatism

i can't possibly read any more about this person or her family

Okay sorry you're right, it just makes me more infuriated. But so many people in my life want to "humanize" them or praise their philanthropy or get close to their power, I have a sort of compulsion to shout about them into the void.

i used to and then i realized how much it aggravated me, and that being aggravated to that degree (fairly extreme) was hurting me directly in ways that were harming me and i had to stop. in more peaceful times it seems tenable, but not right now. things are too awful!

no one in my life is trying to humanize/valorize them at all, so it's almost like self-abuse to roll around in their malevolence. for me, i mean.

Ugh -- this guy!
my god
i tried to read this and felt like i was drowning

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/07/us/politics/erik-prince-project-veritas.html

Yes although my first reax was:

Using a different alias the next year, the same undercover operative infiltrated the congressional campaign of Abigail Spanberger, then a former C.I.A. officer who went on to win an important House seat in Virginia as a Democrat. The campaign discovered the operative and fired her.

Sooooo not a very good underground operative then? The Dem candidate won the "important" race AND discovered the mole and fired them? Cool cool. I wonder how much money Erik Prince made out of that? Probably a whole lot.

I have to hope that being a "former CIA officer" was helpful in that regard.

SCOOP: Documents Reveal Erik Prince's $10 Billion Plan to Make Weapons and Create a Private Army in Ukraine https://t.co/mQFxl3BFK3

— Simon Shuster (@shustry) July 7, 2021

"Erik Prince, the American defense contractor, said he is offering people seats on a chartered plane out of Kabul for $6,500 per person." https://t.co/UwMoZqzgpG

— Tommy Vietor (@TVietor08) August 25, 2021

Bout possibly getting sprung in exchange for the basketball player and some supposed spy.

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/3576618-blinken-to-discuss-proposal-to-free-paul-whelan-brittney-griner-with-russian-counterpart/

dang did not expect to see this asshead intersect with an embattled WNBA athlete

Kimberly St. Julian-Varnon - @ksvarnon - has been doing great work on explaining this situation:

http://inkstickmedia.com/why-brittney-griner-is-trapped-in-russia/

From espn:

Bill Richardson, the former U.S. ambassador to the United Nations and a frequent emissary in hostage negotiations who has worked to secure the releases of WNBA star Brittney Griner and another jailed American, Paul Whelan, visited Moscow this week and held meetings with Russian leaders, according to multiple reports.

The visit came as American officials have continued to press Russia to release Griner, who was sentenced last month to nine years in prison in a drug possession case, and [Paul] Whelan, a Michigan corporate security executive serving a 16-year sentence on espionage-related charges. The U.S. government regards both as wrongfully detained.

Secretary of State Antony Blinken announced in July that the U.S. had made a "substantial proposal" to Russia to facilitate a swap. Though he did not detail the terms, a person familiar the matter told The Associated Press that the U.S. had offered to release convicted Russian arms dealer Viktor Bout.

Flash:

The Triple Canopy.

Why is Blackwater blocking Congress from entering federal property? pic.twitter.com/56EEivrIz6

— James F. Love IV (@JamesFLoveIV) February 9, 2025