golf course management

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just heard chris woodhead on start the week arguing with paxman about woodhead's new book. predictably enough woodhead was laying into golf course management etc courses at universities, his main argument against them being that there wasn't a canon of accepted knowledge (!). paxman said well yeah but 100 years ago people said that about english lit and you wouldn't scrap that, would you?

so anyway, what do you think about these new-fangled courses in golf course management, madonna studies etc etc? and should everyone go to university anyway? etc etc

― toby, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

i am thinking of changing my major to Film and Media Studies , i cannot justify it yet.

― anthony, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I think that automatically thinking and being pressured into going to university straight from school, especially if you're extremely uninformed, can be a very bad thing. The fact that I rushed into going, not knowing what I was doing or ANYTHING put me in a very bad position, I didn't cope, and makes me very, very sad.

I wuvved media studies at A-Level though, it was GRATE. I'd love to do it at a higher level. Although I do have to say, I worry about the courses in it being somewhat 'mickey mouse'. My a-level course wasn't, but upon seeing the few points most media/film courses want, that worries me.

― Sarah, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I second what Starry said, I had no idea what I wanted to do when I left school so went and did the old catch all of Business studies (aka the degree for people who have no idea what they want to do). It was crap, I didn't try very hard because it didn't inrterest me and so I got a poor quality 2:2. If it had been something I'd been interested in (like now I wish I'd done criminology or urban planning or somesuch) I would have tried so much harder.

― chris, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Golf course management at least sounds like it has a well- defined career path. Though I've never heard of the field, myself.

I've been impressed with the range of liberal arts courses offered overseas, compared to many of the US schools. They seem much more open to media studies there; you can get an undergraduate major in popular music or television studies at some schools in Britain! I had never even heard of that. We had media studies, to be sure, but what we had sounds pretty different from what they've got over there. The boring traditionalist in me wonders about the long-term viability of majoring in rock 'n roll--but I'm really not sure how much degrees matter. I got a degree in neuroscience, but now I work in documentary filmmaking. So anything goes, I guess.

― geeta, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

best course i saw in the UCAS book when i was applying for University was 'Criminology and Scuba Diving'. (i guess it would be suitable people wanting to be police divers, but i just found the name pretty funny)

― michael, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

No problem at all with something like Media Studies, but Golf Course Management sounds much too excessively focussed to provide enough material for a decent three year degree course. Woodhead is a prize prat and paid up member of the Rhodes Boyson tendency so rarely says anything not utterly wrongheaded.

Correlation between points offers and quality/difficulty/mickey mouseness of courses not a simple one, Starry. Frexample, all physics courses (which never seem to be regarded as mickey mouse except by Maths and Philosophy students) apart from Oxbridge required BCC or less (ie 20 points) when I applied. Imperial College's (widely recognized to be equally as good as Cambridge for physics) standard offer in 1993 was just CC (12 points).

― RickyT, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

yes, popular courses courses require much higher grades than unpopular ones. also if they like you you get a lower offer. i got a two E offer from UCL, (which was nice)

― michael, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

'Criminology and Scuba Diving'

Dream course!!!!!

― chris, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Physics = mickey mouse course. They really think they are finding out the truth about the universe. Ha Ha!

― Pete, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

all courses that don't require non-Euclidean geometry are bogus

― mark s, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I sometimes think sticking with art history and film studies would have been a good idea. I should've taken a year out after A-levels. I'd like to do a PHd at Brunel (I probably won't)...they have a good research centre for new technology, and it's cultural impact etc.

― jel --, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

There was a college I knew of that offered a course called "The Physics of Porpoises"...

Can you guys illuminate me on what "points" are? Are they like "credits" in the US (how many hours the class meets per week)? Or does it refer to some strange and arcane course-difficulty- rating-system?

― geeta, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Physics = science, therefore fantastic as it can PROVE things.
Geometry = maths, therefore just plain rubbish.

― DG, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

points are what sit on the end of the sharp sticks your tutors will poke you with when you forget to cite foucault

― mark s, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Should we see physics and maths as some kind of continuum?

Do Americans call physics 'physic'? Or, better still, 'physick'?

― N., Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

haha also this:

THE STATE OF PHYSICS HAD MATHS NEVER BEEN INVENTED:
Cavemen see lightning trike tree => flames, smoke and falling branches
Caveman one: LOOK! *points*
Caveman two: ugh!

― mark s, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

(actually funnier if caveman one says "ugh!" also)

― mark s, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

You cannot prove anything by science => saying proven by science = hahahaha.

― RickyT, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

(stop spoilng my fun)

― DG, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Yeah criminology is a strange one, I remember seeing criminology and music advertised at one university? WTF use would that combination be? Have police started identifing suspects through their record collections?

― Steve.n., Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Geeta, some university courses specify minimum entry requirements in terms of points gained from exams taken in the final years of school. When I were a lad it were all A-levels round here, and most folk took three subjects. An A grade in one A-level subject got you 10 points, a B grade 8 and so on down to an E (the lowest passing grade) which got you 2. So a difficult course to get into might ask for 30 points = AAA, and an easy one 4 = EE (which used to be the legal minimum for matriculation into university). However, things have got more complex of late, with different qualifications coming on the scene and having different points allocated to their grades and the points system for A-levels being changed accordingly.

― RickyT, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I think it may be 100 points for an A now and then descending increments of 20. I nearly had a heart attack the other day when my sister said that she needed 180 points to get into Liverpool.

― chris, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Criminology and Music, well, whatever, but I'm a bit worried about the implication that a course has to be of any direct use in later life to be valuable. Surely the point of most degree courses is education and not direct training for work? Otherwise we'd all take courses in office politics and the impact enginnering of printers rather than general relativity and the 18th century novel.

― RickyT, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

FatNick tells me that Chris is right, they've upped the points values to accomodate A/S levels, apparently.

― DG, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

IIRC, they've also skewed it so an A is only worth 3 Es rather than 5 by making the A-level scale start at 40 and finish at 120 rather than just running it from 20 to 100.

― RickyT, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Criminology and Music, well, whatever, but I'm a bit worried about the implication that a course has to be of any direct use in later life to be valuable.

Well, that's what this thread is about isn't it. I wasn't suggesting that I thought all education has to be vocational, I was just wondering how you'd combine those two courses. I mean what is the common ground there? Why is it always criminology? Some secret government initiative to discover unknown pathways into criminal behaviour? Criminology and cooking. Humm.

― Steve.n., Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I must agree with cabbage and starry about making choices like this at 18, and also with ricky about woodhead being a complete [huge string of expletives deleted]. When I am in charge of education policy (ha, ha) i will make ALL 18 year olds who want to go to university do a year's national/community service type thing (not army stuff, digging ditches and making old people cups of tea type thing). this will be good because:
a. they will get 'real world' experience
b. they can apply *once they know their results* rather than the farce we have now
c. it'l give them a chance to think about stuff, and get all the drinking(well ok, some of the drinking) etc out of the way.

― carsmilesteve, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Yes, the NOT KNOWING RESULTS things lead to me thinking 'dere me I am thick I had best not apply to any places that want more than 12 points' and then bogging off and getting... hmm what did I get... 26 or 28, I can't remember. Gah chiz. Also my parents were big on the DEGREE *IS* specifically for your future career path... cue Me Of Two Years Ago (also me NOW) thinking... "career parf"???

― Sarah, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I am agreeing with the soon to be Londoner Carsmile here - and we have had this conversation before. 18 you are doing too much stuff (merely leaving home can be bad enough). Community service = earns right to fuck about for three/four years too.

Re: Criminology & Music. Well i did a joint course and whilst there is common ground between Maths & Philosophy (in Logic & Phil of Maths) the amount of the joint bit you had to do was pretty minimal. What about people doing Arabic & Politics? They don't do any crossover courses in Arabian Politics. What's wrong with a bit on the side - work/life balance n'all.

Basically though I'm with the physicker up there. Education for educations sake. Hard vocational courses are the response of an educational system which has dismantled traditional forms of on the job learning and apprenticships.

― Pete, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

If I hadn't been so greedy with my gap years I would currently be in Cardiff studying Philosophy. Thank fuck I'm not. I also reckon everyone leaving school should do a year or so of work experience, or something, solely because when I left sixth form I had no idea what I wanted. I thought I did, but I was wrong. Instead I had time to work out what I needed. And then another year to really fuck things up. The knowing your results thing is good too. I applied to really shit places when really I ought to have been applying to mediocre places. I'm also of the opinion that everyone, not just schoolleavers should work for some time in the service industry. Then they wouldn't treat the people who do like they're stupid cretins. Hi, my name is Alix, and this is my chip. It lives on my shoulder.

― alix, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

In agreement with most folks. Me = left school at 17 (could have left at 16, it would have made no difference) went straight to uni, got bored, was too young and shy and stupid to make proper friends, got more bored, stopped going, eventually scraped out with a crappy degree in subjects I'm not even interested in any more and no idea what to do next.

As old Pip Larkin might have said, they fuck you up, your school guidance counsellors.

I'm 23 now and still have no idea what I want to do. But at least I know a little more about life. Man.

― Ally C, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I guess I'm spoilt by having wanted to do Journalism since I was about 9.

― Ronan, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I couldn't go to university, for reasons beyond my control, and I'm probably grateful for that now, though I wouldn't have been until recently. But Woodhead is a CUNT (no pussyfooting around, Steve).

― Robin Carmody, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Chris Woodhead is a CUNT.

Sorry, I just don't believe it can ever be said enough.

― Robin Carmody, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

ROBIN CARMODY VAGINAL OVERLOAD

― ethan, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

that is the name of my band

― mark s, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Gah.. I thought that said OVERLORD for a sec there.

― Kim, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Vaginal Overlord... I'd love to put that on my business card

― electric sound of jim, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

If you knew who Chris Woodhead was you'd know the reason for my vaginal overload, Ethan

Oh and fuck Nick Tate as well

― Robin Carmody, Monday, 11 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

For the attention of 6th formers everywhere. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

― DG, Tuesday, 12 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

That link is bolloXor. All of the universities I dealt took 2 AS's as being identical to one A-Level with absolutley no fuss.

The course I'm in (and university generally) isn't what I was expecting, and I've changed my mind about what I wanted. Luckily what it is like and what I now want seem to coincide (you have to squint a bit). Lucky.

― Graham, Tuesday, 12 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

three years pass...

holy shit, ally c was 23

― c/n (Cozen), Monday, 27 June 2005 21:55 (twenty years ago)

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