A thread about the gold standard

ha..?

It is so good to hear the sound of merriment!

You know that the Spanish conquest of the new world was essentially fueled by the Chinese silver standard

Must be some kind of crazy, Silk Road trade-related shit, huh?

glold standard

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/84/Longtermdowgoldlogtr1800.png

*Log Format

Bizarre nostalgia caused by fear of fiat money (which can be abused, but is still better).

It is as bad or worse than a hyperinflation

Correct. Remaining on the gold standard gave no room to manouevre during the depression. Which is why every single crisis afterwards has tended towards hyperinflation end of things not deflation (i think japan 1990 was kind of a trick where the inflation was exported and the domestic market sacrificed to deflation).

While it may make sense for individuals to have some gold in order to protect value of their savings during moneyfloods, that isn't the same as wanting the gold standard

Gold is fucking useless it has no practical worth, little practical value. Its value, like that of paper money, rests on people's belief in it having value, much like paper or bank balances.

the bretton woods system and its collapse, which is what killed the US currency peg to gold dead. though gold-buggery has deeper roots than that.

i mean, basically as long as a country can meet its obligations somehow (e.g., through taxation or sale of national assets) then it's really silly to peg the currency to gold -- or any other commodity -- esp. if such a peg artificially deflates the currency and impedes economic growth.

another drawback to the gold standard: what if some country (say, malawi or albania) all of a sudden discovers a big-ass deposit of gold in its territory and decides to flood the market? or if some scientists found a way to manufacture it cheaply and plentifully (which was from a "twilight zone" episode if i remember correctly).

long way of saying that there's nothing inherently superior to pegging a currency to gold as opposed to a floating exchange system (which is what we've had since the collapse of bretton woods).

also, i am sure that britisher ILXors are well-aware that none other than winston churchill royally fucked up the british economy during the 1920s when he put the UK back onto the gold standard!

He also fucked up the US economy in the same way! Sterling was pegged so high he had to go (with other Europ countries) to the US begging for easy money rates. They obliged, and the cheap cash it generated stateside helped fuel the stock boom.

You know who was in the viewing gallery of the stock exchange on the Friday after Black Tuesday? W. Churchill.

Still, $4.86 to the £1 would be nice for a bit.

Gold is fucking useless it has no practical worth, little practical value.

someone should have told fdr in 1933

First, it is pretty useless. Unlike iron, steel, or even copper, gold is a soft metal with few practical uses. Before the widespread use of electricity, it had even fewer uses than it does today....
Second, it is doesn't corrode or oxidize or get eaten by bugs. As an element it's about as durable as a thing can get. I mean, you can sink it into the sea for 2000 years and it comes up shiny and good as new. That's a what you call a feature.
Third, it is hard to counterfeit. Sure, you can try. Gold-plating a lead slug is not very hard. Passing it off as money is a lot harder.

HAHAHAHA these are all given as reasons for why the writers of the book of mormon used golden plates! No kidding!

By Mromons of course.

according to walter karp in "the politics of war" the gold standard stuff was just a boring safe fringe issue that the democrats used to distract people from the actual concrete reforms the populists were asking for - busting up monopolies, etc.

i think it's kind of a shame we haven't had a good GOLD RUSH in a while.

Will it break $1000 this year?

The dollar is weak and due to get weaker, with the certain prospect of stagflation in 2008. Gold will probably reach $1000/oz. sometime in the next couple of years, just as a measure of people fleeing dollars, not because gold is an especially good investment.

In fact, if gold gets up some momentum and starts to return more than the rate of interest on dollar-denominated debt, it could be the next big bubble, with speculators borrowing dollars to buy gold, then flipping it to the next speculator for a profit. Whoopee! Bubbles and more bubbles!

i think we'll see $1000 this year, unless things go deflationary, but i can't see how that can happen right now

a measure of people fleeing dollars, not because gold is an especially good investment.

of course, thats what gold is, a haven when currencies get debased. but thats what shares are for too, under normal circumstances, but shares look...not so good. question is, are people really fleeing the dollar (or pound or euro) in anything like significant numbers yet?

it could be the next big bubble

almost certainly will be! but i think thats some way off, seen very little ramping of it so far, and the poor economic conditions are only at the very beginning. if the western countries are going to continue increasing money supply* at this rate, it should be a long time before gold comes back down, esp in what is looking to be a biflationary environment? price will probably drop pretty sharply once economic conditions look good again, which means if this is a bull market for gold, we're at the beginning of a long path

*doesn't this really mean that where its a bubble or not, is going to depend on what currency you are using to buy it in? or to put it another way, not so much the price of gold, but the price of money, and thats got different outlooks in different countries!

Thank you for coming home
I'm sorry that the chairs are all worn
I left them here I could have sworn
These are my salad days
Slowly being eaten away
Just another play for today
Oh, but I'm proud of you, but I'm proud of you
Nothing left to make me feel small
Luck has left me standing so tall

Chorus:

Gold (gold)
Always believe in your soul
You've got the power to know
You're indestructible
Always believe in, that you are
Gold (gold)
Glad that you're bound to return
There's something I could have learned
You're indestructible, always believe in...

After the rush has gone
I hope you find a little more time
Remember we were partners in crime
It's only two years ago
The man with the suit and the face
You knew that he was there on the case
Now he's in love with you, he's in love with you
And love is like a high prison wall
But you could leave me standing so tall

(Chorus)

(Instrumental break)

And love is like a high prison wall
But you could leave me standing so tall

Gold (gold)
Always believe in your soul
You've got the power to know
You're indestructible
Always believe in, 'cause you are
Gold (gold)
I'm glad that you're bound to return
Something I could have learned
You're indestructible, always believe in...
(Gold)

FLASHINGBANNERAD.gif

As a jeweller I can only say: "FUCK."

The price has risen so much, it's scary. People are selling their gold (scrap gold mostly) in droves.

1. With Chinese inflation at record levels and their own stock market a little ropey, are they likely to look for safe haven?

2. Oil is high and getting higher, yet bought in gold it isn't going up at all!

Gold gone past $970 today. $1000 gold coming to the front cover of a newspaper near you soon?

and now past $980.

have you heard about the campaign to make Spandau Ballet's "Gold" the new UK national anthem? There is a petition on this at the Downing Street website.

Here we go again, motherfucker

Come on down, and see the idiot right here
Too fucked to beg and not afraid to care
Whats the matter with calamity anyway?
Right? get the fuck outta my face
Understand that I cant feel anything
It isnt like I wanna sift through the decay
I feel like a wound, like I got a fuckin
Gun against my head, you live when Im dead

One more time, mother fucker

Everybody hates me now, so fuck it
Bloods on my face and my hands, and i
Dont know why, Im not afraid to cry
But thats none of your business
Whose life is it? get it? see it? feel it? eat it?
Spin it around so I can spit in its face
I wanna leave without a trace
Cuz I dont wanna die in this place

People = shit
People = shit (whatcha gonna do? )
People = shit (cuz I am not afraid of you)
People = shit (Im everything youll never be)
People = shit

It never stops - you cant be everything to everyone
Contagion - Im sittin at the side of satan
What do you want from me?
They never told me the failure I was meant to be
Overdo it - dont tell me you blew it
Stop your bitchin and fight your way through it
Im - not - like - you - I - just - fuck - up

Cmon mother fucker, everybody has to die

People = shit
People = shit (whatcha gonna do? )
People = shit (cuz I am not afraid of you)
People = shit (Im everything youll never be)
People = shit

Sold your gold too early, Noodle?

one thing that is great about the Gold Standard is that most people reckon that anyone advocating a return to it must be some kind of mentalist. And people do this without any understanding of what the likely effects of such a return would be, because most people have a don't know don't care relationship to economics.

Thus the Gold Standard serves a useful function.

past $990

2. Oil is high and getting higher, yet bought in gold it isn't going up at all!

-- laxalt, Friday, February 22, 2008 8:27 AM (1 week ago) Bookmark Link

That would imply that gold's entire surge is due to the dropping dollar. Not that that makes it any worse/better an investment.

wait sorry, that's not true. nevermind

996..

$1000 gold coming to the front cover of a newspaper near you soon?

-- laxalt, Friday, 29 February 2008 10:28 (2 weeks ago)

front page of The Times today (even though it didn't actually hit the $1000 mark)

laxalt is hoping to sell his solid gold house

not with another 0.75% cut coming next week

In fact, if gold gets up some momentum and starts to return more than the rate of interest on dollar-denominated debt, it could be the next big bubble, with speculators borrowing dollars to buy gold, then flipping it to the next speculator for a profit. Whoopee! Bubbles and more bubbles!

OTM

one thing that is great about the Gold Standard is that most people reckon that anyone advocating a return to it must be some kind of mentalist. And people do this without any understanding of what the likely effects of such a return would be, because most people have a don't know don't care relationship to economics.

also OTM.

i mean, all that money that bernanke has been shitting out has to go SOMEWHERE ... not just to prop up bear stearns.

Im sure gold will become a bubble, but right now? you would call this a mature bubble...already? It isn't even really going up yet in some currencies!

As the dollar plummets, gold rises, obviously, and one day the dollar will rally, any of you see that day anytime soon?

and borrowing to buy gold? who is going to lend you money to buy gold? more leveraging?

I'm sure gold will come back down this year, prob 700s or 800s, but right now, for me, its more about when it hits $1200.

I'd want to get out of gold the minute everything starts looking peachy again sure, you see that happening this year, or next, or in 2010?

prolly worth looking at price changes in rupees, CHF, remnimbi, yen as well, still rising, but much less meteoric

dropped to $925 today

they predicted this in 2006. we've been buying (scrap) going by the kilo lately. it's INSANE. pple bringing in a lot of their old jewellery. but yeah it's dropped a bit. we've got to be careful.

i mean scrap gold.

Yes its interesting right now! good drop before easter as 0.75% cut was somehow spun as non-inflationary because it wasn't actually 1%??

so why you think its dropped? IMF sales? profit taking? pre-easter sell off?

lot of debate over the last 6-9 months over wether coming collapse is deflationary or inflationary? gold should be a good yardstick for that? i still think its too early in game to tell, regardless of what gold does right now - ie i don't think this is the jumpoff point OR the blowoff point, more a rearranging and reshuffling. think the inflation vs deflation argument won't be resolved this year;)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7335749.stm

plenty IMF sales coming our way! should keep the price down for a little while

So then, Bretton Woods 2 anyone?

http://www.economist.com/node/17414511

Given the lack of cooperation from the Chinese gov, the currency valuation mess will no doubt get worse before it gets better.

Costco is selling gold bars and they are selling out within a few hours
https://www.cnbc.com/2023/09/27/costco-is-selling-gold-bars-and-they-are-selling-out-within-a-few-hours.html

Costco is well-known as a place to get bargain prices on any variety of items, from food to luggage to appliances to gold bars.

Wait, gold bars?

Yes, the retail warehousing giant is your one-stop shop for 1 ounce gold PAMP Suisse Lady Fortuna Veriscan bars, handsomely detailed and ready for purchase.

They’re available for the bargain price of … well, you have to be a member to know that, but apparently they were selling for a little shy of $1,900 recently, according to chatter on Reddit. Spot gold
most recently was going for $1,876.56 an ounce as of Wednesday afternoon.

Regardless of the price, gold is selling like hotcakes, judging by comments Tuesday from Costco
Chief Financial Officer Richard Galanti. Speaking on the company’s quarterly earnings call, Galanti said the bars are in hot demand and don’t last long when in stock.

“I’ve gotten a couple of calls that people have seen online that we’ve been selling 1 ounce gold bars,” he said. “Yes, but when we load them on the site, they’re typically gone within a few hours, and we limit two per member.”

how big is a 1 oz gold bar, like a keychain?