It's long puzzled me why transliterations of cyrillic into the Roman spelling sometimes fail to reflect the way words and names are pronounced.
Take the /h/ and /g/ problem for example. The surname of Belarussian footballer Alexandr Hleb is spelt with a /g/ in cyrillic.
And what about the fact that we write Gorbachev but say Gorbachov? Surely if the latter is the correct pronunciation, there's no reason to spell it with an 'e' before the 'v'?
Cyrillic is lovely, by the way.
― Daniel Giraffe, Thursday, 7 February 2008 12:59 (seventeen years ago)
I'd like somebody to explain the Gorbachev one
― Tom D., Thursday, 7 February 2008 13:04 (seventeen years ago)
this seems to be a general problem in transliteration - eg feng shui pronounced fung shway or shee or shoi or whatever.
― ledge, Thursday, 7 February 2008 13:06 (seventeen years ago)
There are plenty of -ovs around, why are some -evs?
― Tom D., Thursday, 7 February 2008 13:09 (seventeen years ago)
this sheds some light:
By the way, this problem is encountered in Russian as well, albeit on a smaller scale. The Russian letter Ё is usually typeset as “Е”, because Ё is missing from some keyboards. In Russian, this is a completely appropriate solution. Transliterations should not, however, be made from a stripped down spelling. Because of that practice, certain established transliterations, like “Gorbachev”, “Khrushchev”, “Potemkin”, and “Rublev”, are erroneous, and they should be corrected: Gorbachov (Горбачёв), Khrushchov (Хрущёв), Potyomkin (Потёмкин), and Rublyov (Рублёв). Actually some modern encyclopædias do carry these. http://www.elisanet.fi/mlang/strip.html
― ledge, Thursday, 7 February 2008 13:26 (seventeen years ago)
same problem different solution:
There's also the distinction between e and ë: these are actually two distinct Cyrillic letters with different sounds (written the same way in both alphabets), but just to make life interesting for us the Russians often omit the umlaut, thus causing it to be omitted in the transliteration as well. This is why familiar names like Gorbachev and Khrushchev sound like they have different vowels in their last syllables than they appear to: in fact they should be spelled Gorbachëv and Khrushchëv. http://www.pronunciationguide.org/Russian.html
― ledge, Thursday, 7 February 2008 13:27 (seventeen years ago)
ah that's interesting, ledge. So e + umlaut is pronounced /yo/?
― Daniel Giraffe, Thursday, 7 February 2008 13:34 (seventeen years ago)
The h and g one still baffles me. When I was an English teacher, I had a Russian student who referred to Prince Harry as Prince Gary, and said Harry Lineker instead of Gary Lineker. On the other side of the coin, Harry Potter is known as Gary Potter over there.
I'm also keen to know why Russian names ending in -enko are not spelt -enka to reflect the way they're actually pronounced.
― Daniel Giraffe, Thursday, 7 February 2008 13:35 (seventeen years ago)
Isn't -enko Ukranian?
― Tom D., Thursday, 7 February 2008 13:43 (seventeen years ago)
I can think of Russian -enkos, e.g. Chernenko.
― Daniel Giraffe, Thursday, 7 February 2008 13:47 (seventeen years ago)
Let's not forget the Tragedy of Gamlet.
― James Redd and the Blecchs, Thursday, 7 February 2008 15:02 (seventeen years ago)
Turned into a musical comedy in the Russian version of Gilligan's Island.
― James Redd and the Blecchs, Wednesday, 13 February 2008 17:44 (seventeen years ago)
Or should that be Hilligan?
I have a Russian customer named Gary, maybe I should start calling him Harry.
― tokyo rosemary, Wednesday, 13 February 2008 17:51 (seventeen years ago)
Just like the Russian Spongebob's pet snail!
― James Redd and the Blecchs, Wednesday, 13 February 2008 17:55 (seventeen years ago)
names ending in -enko are ukrainian in origin.
russian has no 'h' sound, whereas ukrainian does. the same cyrillic letter represents 'g' in russian and 'h' in ukrainian (and belarusian).
ukrainian does have a (relatively rare) 'g' sound to, but uses a different letter to represent it.
― cb, Thursday, 14 February 2008 15:20 (seventeen years ago)
Thanks cb. That clears up quite a bit
― Daniel Giraffe, Thursday, 14 February 2008 15:45 (seventeen years ago)