Which nation has the most disgusting nationalist culture?

Wow, tough one.

gotta go with the one i know best

williams has gone soft on canada >:(

in terms of amount of horror unleashed on the world, the uk surely wins. but their former colonies are doing better than anyone else's former colonies so eh, maybe not.

Latebloomer, check out some of the anti-Tibet groups on facebook. Disgusting

north korea

UK has a nationalist culture?

may run into trouble explaining imperialism in terms of 'culture'

if you rewind 50+ years perhaps.. or read the the Daily Mail

yeah, only if you read the mail, the telegraph, or the times.

present-tense, though, it's a bit anachronistic to talk about 'uk nationalism'!

happy St Georges day.

Substitute 'England' for 'UK' and you've got a race.

yeh, UK nationalist culture is a little awkward as a concept. i mean, i don't think there are many ways the SNP and the BNP can be lumped together in one catch-all term.

Parochialists?

http://www.strangecosmos.com/images/content/112386.jpg

xpost to self: (and i speak as an english-born SNP voter who -- when he moved to scotland 15 years ago -- was absolutely horrified by the idea of any party branding itself "nationalist" and refused to accept that the SNP could be anything other than a bunch of crypto-fascists. how i've changed. how my understanding has changed. still have a big problem with that word, though. what's wrong with just "the scottish party"?)

Parochialists

nah, that's just the english :) :)

parochialist English? "cough"

I'm going to take a negative approach here. Who can I eliminate? All these countries (and otheres besides) had or have some loathsome nationalists but some have little influence and for others, reagrdless of their influence, the country's global influence is diminished. French and UK nationalists are vile but feckless for the most part and I tend to laugh in their faces more than actually fear them. Korea's and Japan's nationalists are ugly but not likely to do much harm in the foreseeable future, I think, so it comes down to Russia, China and the U.S. I think in scales of evil, Russia's are probably worse, but the U.S nationalists show a really disturbing tendency to think, or at least say, that nuclear mass murder would be a good thing.

since the question is 'has' rather than 'had' i should strike my answer

i'll say china, since it seems eager to jump into the 19th century with both feet

I went with "culture" not politics.

A slippery slope somewhere nearby.

you got the best jpg, that's for sure

merci

Are other nations incapable of disgusting nationalism?

The worst are the Scandinavians.

Maybe the Africans.

Yeah, fuck them.

It's a good poll though. It's like a root, a root, rooting out the truth. Can't wait to take the results into the fucking office.

Korea's and Japan's nationalists are ugly but not likely to do much harm in the foreseeable future

http://www.uruknet.info/uruknet-images/iran-usa-1.gif

its easily a three way race here

not sure who wins it though i easily see china coming out ahead

i'm half-polish, so of course i'm gonna be down w/ talking shit about russia.

yeah China's quite disgusting ATM but I have seen the destruction wrought by Russian nationalists in other independent countries firsthand so I have to go with them. plus Russian nationalism is intrinsically disingenuous/dishonest, since it seems to always boil down to longing for the days when Russia was a superpower lording it over a bunch of other neighboring states with an iron fist

USA "nationalists" have yet to run riot in mexico city over some perceived insult by the local civic leaders, for example- they tend to keep to themselves and only blow up other americans. this would put them in the same minor league as nationalists in the other non-superpowers on the list (and not on the list) AFAIC

Chinese nationalists haven't figured out how to even really get away with espionage much less master doublespeak, the more I think about it the more they strike me as strictly amateur, especially the way they appear to all be on the party line. Russian nationalists and their government always seem to maintain a degree of repudiatability.

Poor Serbia didn't make the cut.

or germany, either ... i guess that's b/c they're pretty tame these days?!?

French and UK nationalists are vile but feckless for the most part and I tend to laugh in their faces more than actually fear them.

true dat -- except for national front cunts in both countries. aside from them, though, both french and british nationalism seem pretty weak to american sensibilities (though i am sure that some african and irish folks would disagree with that assessment).

american beer seems weak to my sensibilities

sorry, I just came over all disgusting and nationalist

ew you hasd war of 1812 in your pants

spoken like a dude from a country where stella artois is the most popular brand

Belgian nationalism FTW? Maybe not.

How about good old Hindu nationalism? Seems pretty disgusting at times.

spain?

Poor Serbia didn't make the cut.

Good call

by the way, americans/UKers voting for the themselves in this can take their arrogant faux shame and fuck themselves with it. i mean, i hate our foreign policy as much as the next internet blowhard, but come on.

oh shut up you stupid american pig

:-D

I thought the question was about nationalism? Other countries probably have worse ongoing human rights abuses and arguably dodgier foreign policies, but you'd have to go some to beat some of the puke-making arrogance of English and Yank nationalists' (and not just the far-Right nutjobs but yr regular everyday Joe/sephine Schmoes) assumptions about their respective countries' places at the centre of the universe.

^

Manifest Destiny was over what, 150 years ago? Might as well judge the UK on the British Empire, too.

http://gullyborg.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/malkin_1.jpg

i think people like to conflate "culture" with power/policy/whatever they feel like

~~BUSH~~<==666==8 USA USA USA 8==666==>~~HITLER~~

USA is satan, we will defeat them. Ertra kneels to pray or to shoot. We don't give up, we sacrifice. I am in USA now. I am going to school and have a good job in USA and help my country by sending a lot of money. I never buy BMW or Lexus. I only eat cheap food and save money to send to Ertra to defeat USA.

http://www.theodoresworld.net/pics/0507/Nahr_al_Bared_Palestinian_terrorist_camp.jpg

wedi shire zeng yerhwo seb beles ayndeli teshekemti ayndeli kab kne ertra kttketatelu twelu nedetatkum abotatna aflutna belwen atum eryrayat ESEYAS dea bun cab shwa begiee cab mekele endamtse bkofkum zeykonen nertra hadas hagaer ertra ertrea abilwa zelo gena dma ERTRAN ERTRAWYAN awald'n wedebna kulu neana kondafat lementi keneat hasadat adetatkum bgusmat zgbera znebera ESEYAS ESEYAS aytbelu keneat bknee natkum bhsdnakum zdehal sebay aykonen kem merahtkum adkum blementn rshatn tebelia kelas ESEYAS entay bele ktblu leahastie nai hagerat merahti koynkum terfkum mesakin.......

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j251/mzing12/antichristossmweb.jpg

by the way, americans/UKers voting for the themselves in this can take their arrogant faux shame and fuck themselves with it. i mean, i hate our foreign policy as much as the next internet blowhard, but come on.

-- John Justen, Friday, April 25, 2008 7:31 AM (1 week ago)

i didnt vote for US but now i wish i had

WELL CONGRATULATIONS TO YOU

YES CIDERPRESS JOIN US. HELP US TO DEFEAT USA. GOD IS IN OUR SIDE. LET US PRAY FOR THE DESTRUCTION OF THE GREAT PIG.

uh

i think that tombot and J0hnd and i are kind of on the same page here

meaning that "yes i get it you have expressed your superior levels of self-loathing but seriously, get over yourselves", at least from my perspective

http://lonewacko.com/images/get-a-brain-morans.jpg

LOL @ outraged Merkins

would one of you 39 pls look up "nationalism" in a dictionary

I voted for Russia, but here's the Random House Unabridged:

1. national spirit or aspirations.
2. devotion and loyalty to one's own nation; patriotism.
3. excessive patriotism; chauvinism.
4. the desire for national advancement or independence.
5. the policy or doctrine of asserting the interests of one's own nation, viewed as separate from the interests of other nations or the common interests of all nations.
6. an idiom or trait peculiar to a nation.
7. a movement, as in the arts, based upon the folk idioms, history, aspirations, etc., of a nation.

Other dictionaries are similar. Some sources argue for a three-pole relationship between "nationalism", "imperialism", and "colonialism", but others don't see that distinction as antipodal (well, as antipodal as you can be in a three-pole system).

So I don't think the (rather sanctimonious) request for "apologies" is all justified, at least in terms of dictionary definitions.

But, y'know, I guess that one's meant for the people who tell their Internet buddies that they're sorry for things they can't and won't feel sorry for.

I'm also amused by the assumption that the "39" people who voted for the U.S. are all 39 of them from the U.S.!

I'm also amused by the assumption that the "39" people who voted for the U.S. are all 39 of them from the U.S.!

I found that assumption very odd

I'm not from there and voted for it, but I've just spent the last half hour trying to explain why and I can't do it in a civilized way, so I give up.

"Manifest Destiny" yeah, that fucker Polk should be impeached.

What a stupid poll.

The irony of this poll, incidentally, is that to some extent, one has to fall back on one's own nationalist culture, however inverted and self-loathing, to judge another's. All these nationalisms and others besides can blow me, fwiw.

I will be damned before I read this entire thread but was it ever actually defined what was meant by "disgusting"?

judging by the results it seems that disgusting has been taken to mean imperialist

though it seems like nationalist has also been taken to mean imperialist

I'm not terribly surprised that the USA won this little unpopularity contest. I mean, you could argue that the average American doesn't have the "my country right or wrong" attitude, or at least they cover it with a veneer of do-gooder talk about promoting democracy and the like. But when you come down to it, can you be surprised that people tend to resent the most powerful, richest country - especially one that tends to meddle continuously in other country's affairs and and does it all with an air of sanctimoniousness. I mean which of the countries on the above list has militarily overthrown not one but two sovereign foreign governments in the past decade?

I forgot to pull the leader for russia.

lever, damnit lever.

Your Freudian slip is showing.

As someone from a country where we only see our flag on the nationaly holiday, on days when one of our top sporters wins something or when some royal either visits the scene of a natural disaster (or squirts out yet another prince or princess the rest of us are going to have to pay for) I just don't understand pride in one's country, let alone the flag-waving "We're Number One"/daily Pledge of Allegiance type thing the US has going on. So I wonder what you're all so proud of, being the only country in the world that has used nuclear power on another and now unashamedly torturing people who only (see? I just can't explain in a civilized way so I'll shut up now)

"I mean, you could argue that the average American doesn't have the "my country right or wrong" attitude"

I assumed that was what the poll was about. It's not about the governments. Most folks in my neck of the woods definitely don't have the "my country right or wrong" attitude

Oh, and Stan M-fuck you

it's complicated...
xpost

Stan, your country almost entirely ceased to exist through apathy this year so I am hardly surprised you don't have much pride in it.

I guess it depends on where you go - when I visit the in-laws in supposedly liberal California, there's still American flags on almost every other porch, which does seem pretty weird to me (actually TBH the last couple of times this seems to have diminished so maybe it was a response to 9/11 or something). NB I didn't vote in this.

and now unashamedly torturing people

This is a fair point. The current US government's wink-wink attitude towards torture, extraordinary rendition, the Geneva conventions, etc. are plenty disgusting. It's hard to argue that the fact we've allowed this to happen doesn't somehow reflect on our culture.

and now unashamedly torturing people

with the acquiescence of many other countries who might like to think themselves above such things

Of course that makes it perfectly acceptable ;)

supposedly liberal California

In what universe is California outside of LA and SF presumed to be liberal?

This one?

At least I was under the impression that was how the state was seen by most of the US.

I am talking about LA anyway.

Stan, your country almost entirely ceased to exist through apathy this year so I am hardly surprised you don't have much pride in it.

Good point - it most certainly influences how we/I look at other countries (I think it's fair to say most Belgians find a lot of other countries almost sickeningly nationalist)

...thunder... lightning...

hahahahahaha if that had been said to a US/UK poster, that would have generated an angry response, but StanM is all "eh, that's true *shrug*"

Lots of good examples for our "all generalizations are wrong" thread, too. (including my posts)

At least I was under the impression that was how the state was seen by most of the US.

This is true. Dan's point is truer, however.

Yeah fair enough, I know just because that's how it's perceived doesn't mean that's how it is (see also "liberal media" etc).

Also my perception of flag-waving is also affected by my own country's disgusting nationalism, so pinch of salt.

NB I didn't vote in this.

Nor did I. Where is Stan M from?

Belgium

I think the citizenry's easy acquiescence to government torture (and other examples of hard-ons for authoritarianism) makes a case for the U.S. though I would have voted Russia.

did people not see the word "culture" in the topic?

Which is worse though, a culture where the worst excesses of nationalism are unashamedly embraced, or a culture where we decry the excesses of nationalism but do nothing to stop them from happening?

USA RIGHT OR WRONG BABY WHOOOO

imo this is the result of some mark ass foreigners jealous of our god-given right to urinate in the parking lot and purchase *world-class* snax from the lobby vending machine

btw why is russia gettin so much hate? i thought they got rid of the commies

i voted for France. because French culture is annoying and stupid.

^^pensée profonde, ça

http://green.yahoo.com/news/afp/20080519/sc_afp/japanenvironmentclimate.html

That's odd, because Tokyo has mandatory garbage separation/recycling, the most heavily used public transit system in the world (I think), and virtually no littering. I'm usually not captain save-a-Japan, and I think they have a profoundly ugly nationalist culture, but I think that article misses the point between "attitude" and "how people are actually behaving."