We're thinking of doing this with Bob. here's an online article about it...
http://www.karawynn.net/mishacat/toilet.html
http://www.karawynn.net/mishacat/photos/mtoiletfront.jpg
There have been more books and articles about toilet-training your cat than you'd think. In the summer of 1989, when Misha was a small kitten with big ears and enough meow for five cats, I searched out and read a half-dozen of them. And then tried it myself, and discovered there were a couple of things they all failed to mention ...
Some of the advice in those books turned out to be impractical. Some of it was unnecessary. Some of it was quite sensible and worked like a charm. A lot of what works and what doesn't work depends on the individual cat — on her personality and smarts. Here's what worked for me and Misha.
The central idea is that the transition from litter box to toilet be accomplished in a series of stages. You make a small change and then give your cat time to adjust before you make another small change. If at any time Felix gives the whole thing up and pees on the rug instead, you're pushing him too far too fast; back up a stage or two and try again, more slowly.
In the following instructions, I've used the word "rest" to mean: do nothing for a period of between a day and a week, depending on how flappable your cat is. (Misha caught on fast and was completely trained in under two weeks, far in advance of what the books led me to expect.)
Ready? First start by training yourself ... The very most important thing to remember is: Lid Up, Seat Down. Post a note on the back of the door or the lid of the toilet if you think you (or your housemates or guests) might forget. (Nowadays, if I have a guest who leaves the lid down, Misha will usually come and ask me to fix it, but you can't expect every cat to go to this much trouble. Besides, he's been using the toilet for more than six years now; when the whole idea was new to him he'd just as soon pee in the bathtub instead.) And if you are accustomed to closing the bathroom door when it's empty, you'll have to break that habit too.
Begin by moving the cat's current litter box from wherever it is to one side of the toilet. Make sure he knows where it is and uses it. Rest. Next put something — a stack of newspapers, a phone book, a cardboard box — under the litter box to raise it, say, about an inch. (Magazines are too slick; you don't want the litter box sliding around and making Felix feel insecure. Tape the litter box down if you need to.) Rest. Get another box or phone book and raise it a little higher. Rest. Continue this process until the bottom of the litter box is level with the top of the toilet seat. (For Misha I raised it about two inches per day.)
At the beginning of this process, your cat could just step into the box; later he began jumping up into it, until at some point he probably started jumping up onto the toilet seat first and stepping into the box from there. You've been diligently keeping the lid up and the seat down, of course, so by now your cat is thoroughly familiar with tromping around on the open toilet.
Lift the seat on your toilet and measure the inside diameter of the top of the bowl at its widest point. Venture forth and buy a metal mixing bowl of that diameter. Do not (I discovered this the hard way) substitute a plastic bowl. A plastic bowl will not support the cat's weight and will bend, dropping into the toilet bowl and spilling litter everywhere, not to mention startling hell out of the cat.
Now you move the litter box over so that it's sitting directly over the toilet seat. (If your cat has shown reluctance over previous changes, you might want to split this into two stages, moving it halfway onto the seat and then fully over.) Take away the stack of phone books or whatever. Rest.
Here's the cool part. Take away the litter box entirely. (Ta da!) Nestle the metal mixing bowl inside the toilet bowl and lower the seat. Fill the bowl with about two inches of litter (all of this is much easier if you have the tiny granules of litter that can be scooped out and flushed).
Naturally, any humans using the toilet at this point will want to remove the metal bowl prior to their own use and replace it afterward. The next week or two the whole process is likely to be something of an annoyance; if you begin to think it's not worth it, just remember that you will never have to clean a litter box again.
Misha's first attempt without the box. He scored two out of a possible four. Watch your cat using the bathroom in the metal bowl. Count the number of feet he gets up on the toilet seat (as opposed to down in the bowl of litter). The higher the number, the luckier you are and the easier your job is going to be ...
...because next you have to teach him proper squatting posture. Catch him beginning to use the toilet as much of the time as possible and show him where his feet are supposed to go. Just lift them right out of the bowl and place them on the seat (front legs in the middle, hind legs on the outside). If he starts out with three or, heaven forbid, all four feet in the bowl, just get the front two feet out first. Praise him all over the place every time he completes the activity in this position.
(Misha is very doglike in that he craves approval and praise. If your cat is indifferent to this sort of thing, you can also reward him with small food treats and wean him from them later when the toilet behavior has 'set.' Just keep the treats as small and infrequent as possible — half a Pounce or similar treat per occasion should be plenty.)
When he is regularly using the toilet with his front feet out (and some cats naturally start from this position), begin lifting a hind foot out and placing it on the seat outside the front paws. Felix will probably find this awkward at first and try to replace the foot in the litter. Be persistent. Move that foot four times in a row if you have to, until it stays there. Praise and/or treat.
Misha demonstrates proper squatting posture. Note the look of firm concentration. Repeat with the other hind foot, until your cat learns to balance in that squat. (There will actually be two different squats, a low one for urine elimination and a high one for bowel movements.) Once he's getting all four feet regularly on the seat, it's all downhill from here.
Which is fortunate, because the last bit is also the most unpleasant. I suggest that you postpone this stage until you have at least a weekend, and preferably several days, when you (or another responsible party) will be at home most of the time. I skipped through this part in about two days; I only hope that your cat allows you to move along that fast.
Begin reducing the litter in the bowl. Go as fast as he'll feel comfortable with, because as the litter decreases, the odor increases. You'll want to be home at this point so that you can praise him and dump out the contents of the bowl immediately after he's finished, to minimize both the smell and the possibility that your cat, in a confused attempt to minimize the smell on his own, tries to cover it up with litter that no longer exists and ends up tracking unpleasantness into the rest of the house.
By the time you're down to a token teaspoonful of litter in the bottom of the bowl, your next-door neighbors will probably be aware of the precise instant your cat has used the toilet. This is as bad as it gets. The next time you rinse out the metal bowl, put a little bit of water in the bottom. Increase the water level each time, just as you decreased the litter level. Remember — if at any point Felix looks nervous enough about the change to give the whole thing up and take his business to the corner behind the door, back up a step or two and try the thing again more slowly.
Once the water in the mixing bowl is a couple of inches deep and your cat is comfortable with the whole thing, you get to perform the last bit of magic. Take the mixing bowl away, leaving the bare toilet. (Lid Up, Seat Down.)
Voila! Your cat is now toilet-trained.
― Scik Mouthy, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:30 (seventeen years ago)
Have any of you ever heard of / tried / succeeded at this?
― Scik Mouthy, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:31 (seventeen years ago)
You can buy custom fittings that you put in/over the toilet for the cat to shit in / through, as well.
― Scik Mouthy, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:34 (seventeen years ago)
This looks like Charles Mingus' method - you're in good company Nick.
http://www.mingusmingusmingus.com/Mingus/cat_training.html
― Anna, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:36 (seventeen years ago)
Please please don't do this. is distrubing as fuck.
― Upt0eleven, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:37 (seventeen years ago)
liveblog pls
― czn, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:38 (seventeen years ago)
Is that Mingus thing REAL? Fuck.
Upt0eleven; why's it so disturbing? I think it's cool as fuck.
― Scik Mouthy, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:44 (seventeen years ago)
http://m.assetbar.com/uua3xKdWZ.gif [before anyone else does]
― stevie, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:46 (seventeen years ago)
I thought that was one of the three things everyone knew about mingus
1) plays bass 2) he was a grumpy bugger 3) could teach cats to use a flush toilet
― Ed, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:47 (seventeen years ago)
OK my ability to discern reality from ribbing has now collapsed utterly.
― Scik Mouthy, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:52 (seventeen years ago)
I'm not sure why i find it disturbing. Something about the scene in Meet the Parents that gives me the willies. Mind you, it could just be the film.
I can understand from a practical pov *why* one might want to do this - especially since you live in London right? - but its just one of those things, like dressing animals up in clothes and those old pictures of goosestepping cats, that errs too close to the unnatural.
― Upt0eleven, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:53 (seventeen years ago)
Exeter, not London - but our flat is 2nd & 3rd floor, so Bob stays inside.
― Scik Mouthy, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:55 (seventeen years ago)
i think it's weird as fuck too tho i guess if i owned a cat i'd probably get sick of cleaning up after it too
― J0rdan S., Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:56 (seventeen years ago)
Unsurprisingly I'm too late to mention Charles Mingus! It sounds a whole lot slower and more complicated than he made it sound though. If I had an indoor cat I might be tempted but the training stage sounds awkward and unpleasant for both humans and cats.
Doesn't it smell pretty terrible if you arrive at the bathroom to find the cat used it 7 hours ago and it isn't flushed? I don't think I'd want to train the cat to flush after seeing that youtube video of delighted cat flushing toilet again and again for hours.
― a passing spacecadet, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:58 (seventeen years ago)
i've heard of this technique, yeh. i don't have a cat, but if i did then fuck yeh, i'd go for it. TS: litter trays or, umm, no litter trays? that's a no-brainer.
it's fairly straightforward operant conditioning: as long as you keep shaping the behaviour gently -- ie, like the article says, don't rush it -- and make sure bob is rewarded at every new stage, you should be fine. (i'm tempted to start on successive approximations and so on, but i don't think there's any need for that. in fairness, i have a psychology exam tomorrow -- although learning isn't actually a part of it.)
babykitten steps, basically.
― grimly fiendish, Thursday, 8 May 2008 09:59 (seventeen years ago)
but its just one of those things, like dressing animals up in clothes and those old pictures of goosestepping cats, that errs too close to the unnatural
umm: it's not too big a leap to say that keeping a cat in a second-floor flat/using a litter tray is "unnatural". yet very few people have a problem with that. in which case: why not go the whole hog and teach it to use the bog?
but yeh, liveblog too.
― grimly fiendish, Thursday, 8 May 2008 10:01 (seventeen years ago)
I'd consider this if my cat wasnt already 10 and set in her damn ways. Stinky goddamn litter tray. Plus our loo is in its own little room, so there's not really anywhere the tray would fit meantime during training. And I'm not home enough.
― Trayce, Thursday, 8 May 2008 10:13 (seventeen years ago)
I don't think cats should be kept solely indoors anyway. Poor kitties ;_;
― emil.y, Thursday, 8 May 2008 11:36 (seventeen years ago)
Or should that be ^;_;^
No, that looks like some strange bat. Okay then.
― emil.y, Thursday, 8 May 2008 11:37 (seventeen years ago)
more like
^ ^ >;_;<
― Ed, Thursday, 8 May 2008 11:38 (seventeen years ago)
damned line spacing
― Ed, Thursday, 8 May 2008 11:39 (seventeen years ago)
i used to think that, my cats were allowed outside all the time, but in my current place they're not allowed outside and seem to suffer a lot less anxiety and zero injuries from cat fights. it does help the house is huge.
xposts
― electricsound, Thursday, 8 May 2008 11:44 (seventeen years ago)
Bob's a pedigree ragdoll; he'd get run over and beaten up and stolen if he got let outside, cos they have pretty much no survival instinct. He's a happy cat indoors.
― Scik Mouthy, Thursday, 8 May 2008 11:45 (seventeen years ago)
i don't wanna say it.... aw fuck it... Bob's a pussy.
sorry.
Bob rulez.
― Upt0eleven, Thursday, 8 May 2008 11:47 (seventeen years ago)
A few houses ago, my roommates and I tried this. Instead of a mixing bowl, we used disposable pie tins. It was going pretty well, but then they moved out and took the cat with them before we got to the final stage, so I don't know how it all turned out.
Of course, you don't want to teach them how to flush.
― kingkongvsgodzilla, Thursday, 8 May 2008 11:54 (seventeen years ago)
That's awesome.
― Scik Mouthy, Thursday, 8 May 2008 11:57 (seventeen years ago)
Be careful! My friend has a cat who had chronic bladder infections and she taught the cat to pee in a bucket in order to collect the pee for the vet to test. My friend says that she got the cat to do it through "creative visualization" or something. Anyway, the cat now pees in the umbrella stand fairly frequently and also in decorative urns and other such items, and no amount of creative visualization will get her to stop doing it.
― saudade, Thursday, 8 May 2008 13:33 (seventeen years ago)
"creative pissualisation"
― Scik Mouthy, Thursday, 8 May 2008 13:35 (seventeen years ago)
He posts, after saying "How the fuck is 29 supposed to feel?" on the "How old do you feel" thread. Very mature.
― Scik Mouthy, Thursday, 8 May 2008 13:36 (seventeen years ago)
My friend says that she got the cat to do it through "creative visualization" or something
uh-huh :/
― grimly fiendish, Thursday, 8 May 2008 13:48 (seventeen years ago)
(seriously: i am intrigued as to what method your friend used, and what form of successive approximation -- because ultimately IT'S A CAT and, y'know, basic conditioning is gonna be the only way. whatever: it sounds like there was a fatal flaw somewhere along the line!)
― grimly fiendish, Thursday, 8 May 2008 13:50 (seventeen years ago)
I live in a loft with a single bathroom and there's no way I'm sharing the toilet with these 2 cats. Also, they think it is a drinking fountain, and aren't terribly clever. But I do have a friend whose cat Portia started using the toilet on her own! Mind, she would also use any container left out on kitchen counters, preferring ceramic casseroles. So she was pre-disposed. She has not taught the other 3 cats that live there this useful skill.
One of our cats is diabetic, and so pees excessively at times. He was burning through the litter, so I made a draining box from a perforated steamer pan inside a deep steamer pan (from a commercial restaurant supply store). I used sunflower seed for the litter, which were just slightly larger than the perforations. It worked well, but was a bit too narrow and they started going over the edge. Now they have a Smart Cat Box, which is the same idea, but plastic and has sidewalls.
― Jaq, Thursday, 8 May 2008 14:19 (seventeen years ago)
Creative visualization is when you see something in your mind's eye and it becomes reality. My friend said that she would visualize her cat peeing in a bucket and soon after that the cat started peeing in bucket-like objects. She really strongly believed that this was the best way to communicate with cats, and I can sort of see how this might actually work. Sometimes I think "snuggles" at my cat and imagine her sitting on me and then she comes over and sits on me. I also see how this could all be coincidental.
― saudade, Thursday, 8 May 2008 15:49 (seventeen years ago)
I can sort of see how this might actually work
o_O
i can offer a few other explanations, all of which would work around faulty (and probably subconscious) conditioning of the cats (cf clever hans the horse, etc).
then again: cats are full of surprises.
women too.
― grimly fiendish, Thursday, 8 May 2008 15:52 (seventeen years ago)