Guilty Pleasures: American Wrestling

Message Bookmarked
Bookmark Removed
I'm not even going to bother with a C or D attempt - we all know it's duddest of the duds. And I remember the Max Von Sydow character in Hannah And Her Sisters saying "Can you imagine the mentality of someone who watches professional wrestling?" I'm a kind of minor league intellectual, a bit. I've read Proust and I go to art galleries and all that stuff. So why do I love the WWF? It's not sport (they've even given up pretending that!), and it's obviously not top-class drama. Help!

Martin Skidmore, Saturday, 6 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Kris Srinivasan to thread -- again!

Ned Raggett, Saturday, 6 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

The closest parallel with anything else I like is probably superhero comics - but I'm choosy about these. If it's not written by Grant Morrison or drawn by Kirby or Ditko, or something like that, I don't bother. These critical standards vanish with the WWF.

Martin Skidmore, Saturday, 6 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Wrestling is classic!...I don't see why you can't read Proust, go to art galleries and smell what the Rock is cooking. One should not have to worry about conflicting tastes. It's entertainment, at a basic level, you know what's gonna happen, you'll laugh at what they say even though you know they are gonna say it, you know exactly who will interrupt the match. So, don't treat it as a guilty pleasure, if someone raises an eyebrow, or thinks liking wrestling is strange or out-of-character, well, that's just too bad!

jel --, Saturday, 6 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I noticed on television today that the WWF soundtrack LP is called "Forceable Entry".

Graham, Saturday, 6 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Obviously I do indeed do all of these things, Jel, and will continure to do so. As for "if someone raises an eyebrow", well we're back to the Rock, who does the best eyebrow-raising ever.

As for the soundtrack, why is it that all the WWF stars have such dreadful signature tunes? Nu-metal is the dominant force there. Though I do remember quite enjoying Motorhead giving us a live rendition of the theme of my favourite, Hunter Hearst Helmsley/Triple H/The Game, at one event.

Martin Skidmore, Saturday, 6 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

The superhero comparison is a good one. It's the combination of that with the best elements of a great soap-opera which making it an often winning formula. Sometimes I think the matches themselves are the most boring part of the whole spectacle.

Ally C, Saturday, 6 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Yeah, well when the Rock's involved it's guaranteed tedium.

Tracer Hand, Saturday, 6 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Tracer is INSANE.

Dan Perry, Saturday, 6 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Martin have you read"The Last Ever Wrestling piece" (think it's called) by my great hero Richard Meltzer? I think it's on the innernet somewhere, i'll try to find it & link it.

duane, Saturday, 6 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

C'mon Dan his matches are NOT EXCITING. His act is PLAYED OUT. I am waiting for Rob Van Dam to kick his ASS. (NB I do not watch wrestling)

Tracer Hand, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Vince and Trish Stratus versus a catatonic, powerless Linda McMahon seething below the surface...shades of Medea?

Joe, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

one idea is that wwf ---> "masculine melodrama" ---> "sports that function as an authorized space for male emotions" etc.

geeta, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

No, Duane, I've not read that Meltzer piece, and I would like to. I did read a great book on the old British pro wrestling scene called Thew Wrestling. Can't remember the author's name.

Martin Skidmore, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Benoit is nearly back, and this excites me, great technical wrestler!

chris, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Chris Benoit is indeed a superb technical wrestler - but he's also a bit of a bore. What we ideally want is someone with the charisma, the acting power for the backstage nonsense, the size and impressive body AND unbeatable technical ability. Fortunately, we have Triple H. Given how good his acting is, I wonder if any Hollywood types have shown any interest - I can see him in roles that might have gone to Arnie or Sly in the past.

Martin Skidmore, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

It's never been as good since the days of Vince and Austins feud, and "The Greater Power". It was completely plot driven back then, and there was less of the boring fights.

Also didn't they RUIN the Undertaker as a character? Biker indeed.

Ronan, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

There are plenty of plots these days - trouble is, they're mostly dull as hell. And while a big biker is a perfectly good wrestling persona, it has little to do with the previous Undertaker/Dead Man Walking persona - but they still keep talking as if the two gel seamlessly!

Martin Skidmore, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Kane is my personal favourite wrestler, especially after he did impressions of both the Rock and Hulk Hogan.

anyone seen the Scorpion King yet?

jel --, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

um....

i suppose the only valid comment to this is:

When it comes crashin' down and it hurts inside Ya gotta take a stand, it don't help to hide If you hurt my friends, then you hurt my pride I gotta be a man, I can't let it slide

I am a Real American Fight for the rights of every man I am a Real American Fight for what's right Fight for your life

I'm feelin' strong about right and wrong And I don't take trouble for very long I got somethin' deep inside of me Courage is the thing that keeps us free

I am a Real American Fight for the rights of every man I am a Real American Fight for what's right Fight for your life

rip Hulk Hogan --- wha? he's not dead?

Lee, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

wrestling R0XXXXXX

and that's the bottom line ___________________

Queen G, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Not only is he not dead, he's back wrestling! He seemed pretty old when I first became aware of his existence, and that was 15 years ago! Nonetheless, he is scheduled to compete with Triple H for the world title at the next big pay-per-view. Not likely to be an even match - if it was 1980s Hogan against 2002 Triple H, that could be close, but they'll have to work hard to make this one a convincing tight match.

By the way Jel, I love Kane too, but the really great impressionist in the WWF is the Big Show. He came out dressed as Hulk Hogan once, and had all of the gimmicks, all the body language, the voice, the mannerisms, the phrasing, everything absolutely perfect (except the fact that he's much bigger, of course). He went on to fight the match in a perfect imitation of Hogan's style. It was one of the best impersonations I've ever seen.

Martin Skidmore, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

oh i am so sick of hulk hogan. when he came out thursday night in the red and yellow boas and the tie-dyed pants ... ugh.

rob van dam is my fave, and i'm really warming to chris jericho, esp when he gets all worked up & indignant. i am sorta bummed i missed that kane segment - i heard it was absolutely classic.

maura, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Martin yeah i've seen that bk "The Wrestling", my friend saskia has that, that sorta old school wrassling stuff is such a whole nother different world to the stadium false-metal manowar world of modern wrestling. ummm havent found the meltz article yet.
maura the hlk "came out"? bout time!

duane, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Rob Van Dam's cute (and he does look a lot like Jean Claude), and wonderfully athletic, but he is a bit of a dullard otherwise. I'm with you on Jericho - he was kind of bland and irritating as a good guy, but he's a funny bad guy. Still not as funny as Kurt Angle, though.

We haven't said a single thing about the insanely sexist approach to women wrestlers, especially since Chyna vanished. Is it so wildly, insanely, BennyHill-ly sexist that it doesn't bother any of us, in some PoMo-irony way? Or are we sitting around drooling over Trish and the rest wrestling in their underwear? For me, this is the stuff that always makes me consider weaning myself off the WWF.

Martin Skidmore, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

("manowar" - © kodanshi)

duane, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Hey, Duane, when you're wearing "red and yellow boas and the tie-dyed pants", as Maura accurately summarised, how much coming out is necessary?

Actually, they have a comedy gay couple tag team now. See my comments re sexism...

Martin Skidmore, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

well there is jazz, the current champion of the 'other half' of the wwf - her whole schtick is anti-bikini, which has unfortunately made her something of a heel ... she's apparently doing tag matches with molly holly, though.

maura, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I'd have thought her persona was violent maniac, rather than specifically anti-bikini. There is sometimes a tendency to make any woman who doesn't look fabulous in a bikini into a heel. If I had to bet, if there was any specific anti-bikini agenda in Jazz's character, it would be eventually revealed to be rooted in jealousy. At least Jazz looks as if she has the first idea how to wrestle, which is more than you can say of most of the long-legged, big- breasted blondes. I mean, Trish was world champ not long ago!

Martin Skidmore, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Molly was cool when she was Mighty Molly hanging out with the Hurricane, who seems to have been seriously under-utilised. Lita is okay, she has good technical ability.

jel --, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

What we need to relieve the boredom is another super-human-impervious- to-pain scary person, like ZEUS! (remember him?) or the early Undertaker. And for him to REALLY have it in for someone big.

Ally C, Sunday, 7 April 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

six months pass...
Was Brock Lesnar even around when that last message was posted?

Nate Patrin, Wednesday, 23 October 2002 15:04 (twenty-two years ago) link

1 april 02:

"Hardyz vs. Perfect/Bossman. We spend most of this match explaining to Ms. Klein just how much fat chicks love the Hardyz. King Fuzu tries to get me with the “Homo says what” bit but I’m just far too clever for that. Hardyz win and OH MY GOD BROCK LESNAR BROCK LESNAR BROCK LESNAR. WHAT IS THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN BROCK LESNAR AND PAUL HEYMAN? WHAT IS THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THAT GUNDAM GLUE ON TEW’S PILLOW AND KING FUZU’S oh never mind. What’s the point? We’re all just going to die eventually anyway. * or whatever."

maura (maura), Wednesday, 23 October 2002 15:09 (twenty-two years ago) link

is brock popular? I can't stand him.

jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 23 October 2002 16:01 (twenty-two years ago) link

he is loved and hated. the crowd at summerslam turned against the rock towards him, but he is generally seen as a heel.

i hope all you UK types enter this.

maura (maura), Thursday, 24 October 2002 03:10 (twenty-two years ago) link

Against the Rock! But now I think of it, that was happening in the big match with the antique Hunk Hogan too. Are people bored with the Rock?

Can someone tell me who holds all the titles now? I've lost touch since ITV Digital crashed.

Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Thursday, 24 October 2002 10:29 (twenty-two years ago) link

WWE Champ - Brock Lesnar

World Champ (raw) - HHH

WWE Tag Champs (smackdown) - Kurt Angle/Chris Benoit

WWE Tag Champs (raw) - Chris Jericho/Christian

Cruiserweight Champ (smackdown) - Jamie Noble

WWE Womens Champ (raw) - Trish Stratus

The intercontinental/euro and hardcore titles were scrapped and merged somewhat to become the raw championship, that is held by HHH.

kinski (kinski), Thursday, 24 October 2002 10:47 (twenty-two years ago) link

Bring back Bob Backlund

Dave B (daveb), Thursday, 24 October 2002 10:54 (twenty-two years ago) link

What really pisses me off is that people automatically assume wrestling =WWE/F. Ring of Honor DVDs are available from certain tape traders nowadays, and these are guys that actually appreciate the artistry of the sport. WWE on the other hand has lost 30% of its audience in the past year, and just received a record amount of complaints for running a necrophilia angle.

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Thursday, 24 October 2002 10:55 (twenty-two years ago) link

I lost interest once Rowdy Roddy Piper and Randy "Macho Man" Savage were out the game.

Nicole (Nicole), Thursday, 24 October 2002 11:12 (twenty-two years ago) link

Dom, please! It's IMPLIED necrophilia! There's a big, BIG difference! (i.e. it's slightly less completely fucking retarded.)

I have only seen one ROH match. It was that Low-Ki/Christopher Daniels/American Dragon match, though, and MAN OH MAN THAT RULED ALL.

Nate Patrin, Thursday, 24 October 2002 13:10 (twenty-two years ago) link

Ricky The Dragon Steamboat!!!! Bring him back! Tito Santana too!

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 24 October 2002 15:27 (twenty-two years ago) link

Sorry, let me say what the angle was:

A humourous false rape of a false corpse by a false Kane.

According to the WWE press office, it was a "sketch in the vein of the popular TV series Six Feet Under and the X-Files". Yeah, that Scully dressing up as Mulder and having sex with a mannequin whilst pulling its brains out bit was always my favourite X-Files moment.

Ring of Honour does own all, though. If only Kid Kash was signed there rather than NWA:TNA...

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Thursday, 24 October 2002 16:57 (twenty-two years ago) link

one year passes...
Is The Rock rockist?

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 18:03 (twenty years ago) link

He tried to mock Steve Austin once by accusing him of listening to the Backstreet Boys, if that helps.

nate detritus (natedetritus), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 18:08 (twenty years ago) link

It would help more if he posted his thoughts on "Justified" or contributed to the "Hip Hop Taken To New Levels" thread.

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 18:10 (twenty years ago) link

Barthes to thread!

Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 18:19 (twenty years ago) link

Booker T always listens to a 2Pac album before wrestling.

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 19:05 (twenty years ago) link

So..who is the most "indie"/"emo" wrestler?

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 19:06 (twenty years ago) link

Good question. CM Punk does a straight-edge gimmick, which isn't really what we're looking for here.

For emo- "Cry Baby" Eric Embry was always in touch with his feelings, whilst The Genius was a dab hand with a poetry notebook.

Indie? I'll have to think about that.

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 19:16 (twenty years ago) link

EDGE was the ultimate goth when he first came in.

Chris B. Sure (Chris V), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 19:17 (twenty years ago) link

He was blonde.

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 19:18 (twenty years ago) link

Spanky seems kind of indie rock. There was a segment on TV where he was sitting around backstage in a Kool-Aid t-shirt, which seems pretty hipsterish.

nate detritus (natedetritus), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 19:25 (twenty years ago) link

Yeah... Spike Dudley is very emo, now I think about it (bullied, glasses,failed relationship with cutesy girl who turned into an absolute bitch).

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 19:30 (twenty years ago) link

But what about Raven?

Leee Majors (Leee), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 21:38 (twenty years ago) link

jeff hardy was pretty indie - in a i-have-a-dirtbike-course-in-my-frontyard kinda way. I want to hear that album he's working on.

bill stevens (bscrubbins), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 21:40 (twenty years ago) link

No, trust me, you don't.

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 21:42 (twenty years ago) link

i bet its awfulicious

bill stevens (bscrubbins), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 21:45 (twenty years ago) link

The Show for this Friday, November 21st has been canceled due to circumstances beyond our control.

Because of scheduling issues The Madison Theater has canceled the Burnside6 / Peroxwhy?gen show and Jeff Hardy signing scheduled for this coming Friday. The cancellation of a national act at The Madison Theater on the 14th caused a double booking when that show was re-scheduled for Friday the 21st. The bands will continue to look for a future date and venue to re-schedule the BS6/PWG show for.

Jeff, Jr., Scott and Chris deeply regret having to announce not being able to play this show that promised to be such an awesome event. We are sorry for any inconveniences this has caused since we know many have made plans for weeks around this show.

The band understands the anticipation that had been built up around this show, as they were looking forward to finally taking the stage together for the first time. They hope to continue counting on the fans' support after such a disappointing set back.

November 2, 2003

After all this time Peroxwhy?gen is finally gearing up for it's first official live show. Following Burnside6's set on November 21st at The Madison Theater in Covington, Ky, Peroxwhy?gen will take the stage for a 3 - 5 song "mini-set". Jeff will be on hand before the music starts to sign autographs and take photos. More details will be posted once plans get finalized. Stop back for cover charge, set times and full band line up. Hope to see you all there.

April 22, 2003

Welcome to the new, and hopefully you'll agree, improved Peroxwhygen.com

The lyrics now have their own section, and the store will be up and running once designs for the merchandise has been finalized.

November 10, 2002

First off we would like to thank everyone for the amazing response to the September Day lyrics we posted.

Now on to what everyone has been asking for, updates to the site!

Click over to the photos page for some new pictures of Jr. catching up with Shannon and Jeff on the road. There's even a couple of shots of Matt Hardy and Justin Credible hagging with the guys.

But that’s not all…

If you were wondering what the new splash page on the site was all about We also have a new set of Jeff’s lyrics, Burnt Page.


Burnt Page

LATE FOR MY FUNERAL-
LATE LABELS ME NOW.
LATER - I'LL BE BORN AGAIN....
FOR NOW I'LL TURN THIS OUT!......AND!

WE DON'T TURN- WE'LL BURN THE PAGE-
RIPPIN' SHIT UP ON ANOTHER STAGE.
WE WON'T TURN- WE'LL BURN THE PAGE-
MOVE IN ON TO AN OLDER AGE-

WALK ALL THE WAY TO MEXICO-
STOP TO ASK PEOPLE WHAT THEY KNOW?
CRUISE ON IN TO SAN ANTON'-
UNAWARE OF WHAT WE'RE ON.

-WE DON'T TURN!-
WE DON'T TURN- WE'LL BURN THE PAGE!!
-WE WILL BURN!-
MOVE ON TO AN OLDER AGE!!
-WE WON'T TURN!-

WE WON'T TURN- WE'LL BURN THE PAGE-
RIPPIN' SHIT UP IN ANOTHER PHAZE.
WE WON'T DIE- UNDONE WE LIVE-
WE DON'T TAKE- WE FUCKING GIVE!

POWER FROM OUR HEART AND SOUL-
KNOWLEDGE OF ALL THIN AND BOLD.
TUNED TO OPEN UNCONTROLLED-
UNAWARE OF WHAT WE'RE ON.

-WE DON'T TURN!-
WE DON'T TURN- WE'LL BURN THE PAGE-
STEP UP ON A HIGHER STAGE- YEAH!
WE DON'T TURN- WE'LL BURN THE PAGE-
MOVE ON TO AN OLDER AGE- AHHHH-

LATE FOR MY FUNERAL-
LATER- I'LL BE BORN AGAIN!....AND!

STILL DON'T TURN- WE'LL BURN THE PAGE-
RIPPIN' SHIT UP IN AN AGELESS AGE.
SOME JUST TURN- NEVER BURN THE PAGE-
ALWAYS AWARE OF WHAT THEY'RE NOT!

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 21:51 (twenty years ago) link

Actually, just check the site out yourselves. I nearly wet myself laughing.

http://www.peroxwhygen.com

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 19 November 2003 21:53 (twenty years ago) link

three months pass...
There's an MP3 on the site. It sounds like a Shaggs cover.

stephen morris, Friday, 5 March 2004 02:13 (twenty years ago) link

one month passes...
I was watching Beyond The Mat again last night. What a fascinating and sad figure Jake Roberts is.

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Friday, 9 April 2004 15:28 (twenty years ago) link

wait...is that grammar correct?

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Friday, 9 April 2004 15:31 (twenty years ago) link

http://www.mediaman.com.au/interviews/roberts.jpg

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Friday, 9 April 2004 15:32 (twenty years ago) link

i have to say it:

cocaine is a hell of a drug.

bill stevens (bscrubbins), Friday, 9 April 2004 15:58 (twenty years ago) link

and crack moreso.

Kingfish Balzac (Kingfish), Friday, 9 April 2004 16:07 (twenty years ago) link

four years pass...

ECW - Heatwave '98
Tanaka vs Mike Awesome

pt 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SpQtfFK_Us

pt 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAzOA9-zh2w

Tracer Hand, Friday, 25 July 2008 16:09 (sixteen years ago) link

Although for the purposes of this thread that's more Japanese I guess. These two were in Japan before they brought maybe the best rivalry in wrestling to ECW. Mike Awesome's dead now. He died last year. I saw them at the Elk's Lodge in Queens in like 1998. It was absolute mayhem. The Dudley Boys were there. The Sandman was there. Sabu. The Blue Meanie. Taz ("Survive If I Let You") and his "FTW" title belt, which he had made himself and stood for "Fuck the World", and which had no bearing on even the highly fictional league table that ECW maintained for itself.

Tracer Hand, Friday, 25 July 2008 16:32 (sixteen years ago) link

i saw some bootleg tape of ECW stuff in like 94 or 95, totally mindblowing stuff. the champ, whoever he was, strolled in with a cigarette and a pbr. i think his girlfriend got piledrived (piledriven?) by someone later on. in another bit, on christmas, santa came into the ring after throwing out some tshirts. a villain character starts whipping the shit out of santa and i think dropped him through a table. one of the good guys takes THAT guy down, and suddenly there's a ref to count him out. the crowd looked good.

goole, Friday, 25 July 2008 16:37 (sixteen years ago) link

the champ, whoever he was, strolled in with a cigarette and a pbr.

That was the Sandman! He would smash the empty cans against his own head. Steve Austin kind of stole his schtick for awhile. Sadly the Sandman was arrested five days ago for throwing pint glasses at policemen (!)

Tracer Hand, Friday, 25 July 2008 22:24 (sixteen years ago) link

i will concur that mid 90s ECW was fantastic, and some genuine counter-culture (as in counter to conventional pro wrestling culture)

the sir weeze, Friday, 25 July 2008 22:35 (sixteen years ago) link

all vince mcmahon-endorsed/wwe shit post-mid eighties matches need to be taken out back and shot

go watch some late-seventies/early eighties regional shit (hallo, virtually anything south of the mason-dixon line) and then report back to me. thanks, bye.

dell, Friday, 25 July 2008 22:35 (sixteen years ago) link

ECW was regional (Philly) and a true independent promotion until it fell on hard times and got scooped up by Vince et al around the year 2000. I would love to see the weird leagues you're talking about though.

Tracer Hand, Friday, 25 July 2008 22:45 (sixteen years ago) link

there is a lot of rad shit on youtube, (barring the shit that vince has not clamped his unholy balls down upon)

dell, Friday, 25 July 2008 23:06 (sixteen years ago) link

all american comicbook super-hero movies need to be taken out back and shot

go watch some late-seventies films based on gu long/jin yong novels and then report back to me. thanks, bye.

-- dell, Friday, 25 July 2008 22:32 (57 minutes ago) Link

macro?

rockapads, Friday, 25 July 2008 23:30 (sixteen years ago) link

does macro like wuxia films??

i like seventies/early eighties pro-wrestling and seventies/early eighties wuxia crap

but like, a lot.

dell, Friday, 25 July 2008 23:33 (sixteen years ago) link


You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.