freaking out the squares

i went and saw this new thing abt asia or something at the guggenheim this weekend and they had a bunch of stuff by fluxus, kaprow, ono & the like--the 'happenings' and all that shit. and then today tuomas repping hard for the flash mobs reminded me of this.

i have a sort of knee-jerk hate reaction for stuff like this, probably as much b/c i used to be one of those weenies who was all about freaking out the squares and now am horrified by what i used to be.

is it defendable tho? was there a point where this kind of 'art' or whatever wasnt narcissistic, exclusionary & condescending? is exclusionary a word? have squares ever actually been 'freaked out' enough to the point of a life change?

I used to be one of those weenies, too, but I think that's the reason I find these kinds of things endearing. Not awesome, per se, but defs makes me go, 'awwwww, look at those kids doing that thing.'

i spent a year after one summer camp placing every pay phone handset that i could find upside down

you still talk a bunch of shit to get attention.. is your remorse due to the fact that you used to get physically in peoples' faces and now hide behind the internet?

This really depends on whether you're inviting people toward the thing or thrusting it out on them, doesn't it? I really hate the mentality that tends to come with the latter -- it contains a really amazing combination of arrogance and point-missing.

(Also I'm sure I've gone on enough here about not liking the artsy American habit of being in love with "transgression" for its own sake.)

This really depends on whether you're inviting people toward the thing or thrusting it out on them, doesn't it?

i agree with this but im having a hard time coming up w/ examples of the former? and if they existed--i guess they maybe dont count as 'freaking out' the squares which i think sort of requires the FREAK OUT bit

dunno whats up with u finefinemusic but sorry if i offended u

anyway fluxus isn't a person (which is what you imply, saying you saw "art by fluxus, krapow, ono..") but most of the fluxus artists I've encountered attempted to get the viewer to think or re-examine things in new lights (Yoko's Instruction Pieces, for example) and I don't see the connection to turning pay phones upside down?

i spent a year after one summer camp placing every pay phone handset that i could find upside down

― max, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:31 (2 minutes ago) Bookmark

max 1, The Man 0.

i am aware that fluxus is not a person...

nothing personal max, just thought it was funny that you project an image of being this 17 year old dude who wants to get all in peoples' faces (from the posts I have seen) and then start this thread

Fwiw, I don't get that impression from Max.

As a dude who made many, many efforts to freak out the squares in his youth, I'm not a big fan of this kinda stuff now but like Abbott can't help finding it endearing that some people still think it's so significant. It's usually not significant--I doubt it results in a whole lot of life changes--and it's often short-sightedly stupid and dangerous for no reasonn

This kind of stuff isn't going to bring about massive social change, but you might hit some people right between the eyes. For the people who do this kind of stuff that's probably enough.

I don't mind anyone trying to freak me out so long as they retain a semi-civilized atitude about it. Then it becomes just another species of wit.

Max, I was thinking about art pieces, where anyone who's experiencing them is voluntarily walking into your world, whatever that might be. (Though there's a whole other question about a lot of art where people seem to sit together congratulating themselves on how the art is a grand assault on types of people who aren't even there to see it.)

There's also stuff that's yours -- like your personal appearance -- and if you get a kick out of using it to appall other people, well, that could be considered lame or juvenile, but it's not like you're really imposing that reaction on them.

nothing personal max, just thought it was funny that you project an image of being this 17 year old dude who wants to get all in peoples' faces (from the posts I have seen) and then start this thread

u crazy--max doesn't post like he's 17 at all

Can we have some examples of attempted square-freaking other than messing with payphones please?

hey, my impression is my impression. I'm not going to start looking for examples because that is psycho territory

er xpost to Q

YOUNG HOOS aka the attentionseeker: lol high school xxp

When I was 19, I spent most a summer walking around everywhere with a croquet mallet, just to see if I could. (Result: I could.)

lol i would love it if this thread were not about me

when I was 18 I was in Prague with friends and got v drunk then bought all the daily papers from two girls who were selling them on the street. it was rush hour in the morning and we stood there with a huge stack of papers, so masses of people streaming by assumed we were selling them. we gave some people free papers, for others we would just give them a sports section, or tear a paper in two and hand it to them, or just say "no, these are mine". people started to get really annoyed so we stopped after a short while.

hahahahahaha that is awesome

It was during that summer that Dan met and inspired the young man you now know as Fonzworth Bentley

XD

I, along with a few other people, once wore bedsheets to breakfast as "togas" while in Greece. To the hotel restaurant. The staff was pretty nice about it, considering.

Beatboxed extremely ineptly with my friend in central Manchester in the small hours, until we stopped and went home. Luckily we didn't get our heads kicked.

its not very surprising to me that so many posters on ilx have a history of square-freaking-out activities

and i guess looked at through that silly nostalgia lens it can be endearing--but the extreme narcissism of a lot of it still rubs me the wrong way, even when its innocent 17 yr olds.

There was a recent thing where people were reprogramming LED road signs to warn of impending zombie attacks; I thought that was actually pretty hilarious despite the evident potential danger involved.

the other day on the subway these two kids--looking like college frosh prob--were walking thru the cars with a big empty guitar case--one held it out and the other had this schpiel, something to the effect of "my friend here is trying to collect nothing, as much nothing as possible. please help him out by giving him nothing" and they solemnly walked down the car.

haha dan that was hilarious but i thought that was less freaking-out-the-squares and more pranksy lulz

When I was 14 years old, I expressed my disdain for a synagogue youth group "mall scavenger hunt" by using the hunt to instead approach random strangers and ask if they "would be interested in converting to Judaism."

I like to retroactively think of this as some kind of happening or situationist prank. It did sort of have that spirit.

Hurting, pls to turn your situationist lens on my church youth group going to a mall and ACTUALLY asking people if they'd like to convert to Evangelical Christianity. That kind of thing rly needs some fucking with.

I mean, is it so far out there that it's right back here again? Perhaps, perhaps....

teenagers are terrible

Oh, the idea of teenagers doing this stuff is totally natural, and I think most people put it down to just, umm, "kids, jacking around."

What's weird is when people manage to "grow up" without ever moderating this impulse, or -- worse -- actually adopting it as their deep and serious approach to life. And telling you about it. Really intently. I kind of blame the arts for this, because it's one of very few things that can allow people to pretend that mentality is an impressive reaction to life.

my sophomore year at college these kids studying allen kaprow were supposed to do a 'happening' and they made all these flyers saying zack braff was coming to talk at our school--and all these kids showed up to the place where it was supposed to be and it was this tiny little room that they crammed themselves in--and then all was revealed: zack braff wasnt coming and they had just been 'happened' or whatever.

There was this guy in my class freshman year who would regularly get really high and prance around the Store24 in Harvard Square following people trying to get them to dance with him. We called him The Hopper. He stopped doing this after we caught him at a meal in the freshman union and shouted "OMG IT'S THE HOPPER! DANCE, DANCE FOR US!" at him.

Actually I don't think I ever saw him on campus again, I hope he didn't kill himself.

ugh mall roving; I used to run into Victoria's Secret, shout "the thing I hate about this store is that they never have anything in my size!" then run away. God that was terrible.

xp: lololol max

Oh, the idea of teenagers doing this stuff is totally natural, and I think most people put it down to just, umm, "kids, jacking around."

What's weird is when people manage to "grow up" without ever moderating this impulse, or -- worse -- actually adopting it as their deep and serious approach to life. And telling you about it. Really intently. I kind of blame the arts for this, because it's one of very few things that can allow people to pretend that mentality is an impressive reaction to life.

― nabisco, Monday, February 9, 2009 2:55 PM (49 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

yes this is roughly my least favorite personality trait in an adult, the 'hey have i blown your mind yet' attitude

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Third_Wave

(xxxpost) and then the kids that organised it got the shit kicked out of them?

the wave is an awesome movie

not really sure zack braff fans are the ass-kicking type

They might pelt you with Xanax.

yeah this is definitely more "acceptable" for teenagers than adults but that still doesn't make me want to actually be near any teenagers for any period of time

yes this is roughly my least favorite personality trait in an adult, the 'hey have i blown your mind yet' attitude

seems these dudes always end up working for those charity subscription street gangs

I feel kind old now: if I had told people sophomore year of college that Zach Braff was going to be somewhere, they'd have said "is that that one theater major"

yeah i did this shit all the time too. made elaborate plans to do a thing called "safety pals" where 2 of us would wear full on safety construction gear in coffeehouses and have another dude some through like running with scissors or something which we would then interrupt and deliver a short monologue on the inherent safety issues while the other one videotaped, did it once and it didnt work well. other videocamera impromptu interview stuff. realized that Coyle and Sharpe had done everything i could think of better in the 50's so i stopped.

i guess stuff like that is fine when yer in your teens, maybe early 20's. but more like a "its ok kid youll get over it" kind of thing for me than really any nostalgia i guess.

xpost hahahahahahaaaa dan i remember you doing that victorias secret thing. you probably remember some of the dumb awful shit i used to do better than i do o_O.

i read this whole thread so imna say important things

square freaking is all about projecting ones own conventional baggage onto the squares - u just dont get it maaan NO U JUST DONT GET IT MAN - look inside little freak

if its funny its ok

you've really given me a lot to think about, ice cr?m. Thanks.

godspeed lil freak

the one thing I miss about the late 90s were all the fat "misunderstood" kids who wore stretched out versions of that hopskotch on a crumbling cliff scene from that video. those kids weren't misunderstood. they just had to jog a mile a day and lay off the doritos.

I couldn't sleep last night, wondering how bernard snowy rated the rest of this thread.

― Tracer Hand, Tuesday, February 10, 2009 12:42 PM (2 days ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

basically I think that "haha man I used to do _____ when I was a kid, god I was so lame!" is about one step removed from "it's hard for me to watch American Idol because I have perfect pitch"

but it IS hard for me to watch American Idol because I have perfect pitch

once "transgression" became something taught in art school and artists who sought to freak out the squares applied for government grants -- and complained of "censorship" when they didn't get the $-- the very idea of avant-garde art became meaningless. so max flipping phones in booths >>>>>>>>>>>some mfa pissing on the squares at the whitney or whatever.

A good example of this is the work of Heinrich Strawmann.

oh yeah I attended his early performances before you were born ;-)

the one thing I miss about the late 90s were all the fat "misunderstood" kids who wore stretched out versions of that hopskotch on a crumbling cliff scene from that video. those kids weren't misunderstood. they just had to jog a mile a day and lay off the doritos.

― burt_stanton, Thursday, February 12, 2009 4:01 AM (6 days ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

ladies & gents!

A good example of this is the work of Heinrich Strawmann.

― You just got HAPPENED (Hurting 2), Wednesday, February 18, 2009 6:45 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark

this is dumb imo but i lold

a lot of people got really butthurt at the thought that i might be comparing fluxus with my adolescent habit of turning phones upside down

ok wait i take that back

no one got butthurt

REMIX:

a lot of people might be turning phones upside down at the thought that i got really butthurt with my adolescent habit of comparing fluxus

you just freaked me out

wild stuff

what would momus do?

turn a phonebooth upside-down and cum on a japanese girl's face

oh was that a rhetorical question?

no, it's for a report

is this what joaquim phoenix is doing right now, with his life

seems to be the emerging consensus - tho might be more accurately described as "prank movie directed by casey affleck" - i feel bad 4 him that hes gettin found out the internet ruins everything

i spent a year after one summer camp placing every pay phone handset that i could find upside down

― max, Monday, 9 February 2009 19:31 (6 years ago)

lol

http://linguafranca.mirror.theinfo.org/9811/inside.html

ON APRIL 22, 1969, SHORTLY AFTER BEGINNING a lecture in his course on dialectical thought before an audience of nearly one thousand students at the University of Frankfurt, the eminent Frankfurt School sociologist and Marxist cultural critic Theodor W. Adorno found himself in an unusual situation. A student in one of the back rows interrupted him, demanding that he engage in "self-criticism." Another student silently walked up to the blackboard and wrote the following words: "He who only allows dear Adorno to rule will uphold capitalism his entire life." After Adorno told the class that they would have five minutes to decide if his lecture should continue, three female students dressed in leather jackets rushed the podium. They showered him with roses and tulips, exposed their breasts, and tried repeatedly to kiss him. Incensed and humiliated, Adorno stormed out of the lecture hall.

lol (adorno could do with some joeks) but aw, seriously.

The story that these volumes tell ends on a sorry note. Adorno and Horkheimer, the grand old men of the German intellectual left, saw their lectures heckled, their institute occupied, and their own students, notably Adorno’s protégé Hans-Jürgen Krahl, turn against them. In a moment of despair during the student occupation of the institute in January 1969, Adorno called the police. Students were outraged at his betrayal. "Adorno as institution is dead," declared a flyer distributed by a radical group of sociology students in April of that year.

Adorno himself would survive just another few months. He died of a heart attack in Switzerland on August 6, 1969, at the age of sixty-five. Six weeks earlier, he had written to Marcuse of his "extreme depression" and of his revulsion at the fascist overtones he sensed in the tactics and demands of the students.

I sometimes feel not square freakout but square weariness/ exasperation.

Busenaktion ("breast action")

http://johannagel.files.wordpress.com/2014/07/adorno.jpg

freaking out the squares is mostly a question of location; a lot harder to freak out the squares in downtown manhattan than in a kansas shitkicker bar but it's lame to tape that and haw haw funny rubes on the borat tip
it's complicated

plus the internet means that curious people have already watched online beheadings and divine eating shit via netflix all manner of outre wildness before they hit puberty. perhaps all the squares have already been rounded?

do college kids ever do radical things anymore? feel like unless it's a sports scandal you never hear about college kids anymore.

Why did the knight put the phone upside down

To freak out the squires

xxp and racist frats

yeah, racist frats too. they are all the rage.

colleges used to be hotbeds of ferment and unrest. i've seen pictures. the government has them locked down pretty good now though.

is there a thread for college shanty towns? they always look like fun.

http://www1.easternct.edu/pressreleases/files/2014/11/shackathon-2014-best1.jpg

http://onthejourneyofrhetoric.weebly.com/uploads/2/3/3/1/23316502/1803858_orig.jpg

http://www.crescentavalleyweekly.com/wp-content/uploads/cache/13302_NpAdvHover.jpg

http://www.mnsu.edu/media/newsletter/2006-06-07/20060607-03-large.jpg

yeah the beaming scrubbed faces peering out from the refrigerator boxes and tarps seem a bit at odds with whatever message they're trying to send

it's a kicky way to have fun AND help.

God, I loved climbing in large boxes when I was a kid. No idea what the message was, but any excuse to climb in huge boxes.

they are beaming because they are getting duke basketball tickets, no?

climbing in the squares

http://www1.easternct.edu/newsflash/2014/12/22/students-sleep-in-boxes-to-raise-awareness-of-homelessness/
" “It’s pretty windy and cold out, but it’s not that bad in the box,” said math major Emily Cameron, a senior from Terryville and club president of Habitat for Humanity. “And we have the luxury of unlimited duct tape and boxes, which the homeless don’t have.”"

The Unlimited Duct Tape of the Ruling Class. should be a book.

and an album title.