Naively Cynical

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Yesterday debate raged about commentators, eg. Trevor Steven, saying that certain nations' defending was 'naive'.

Today, commentating on Senegal 1-1 Denmark, Joe Royle took the Garibaldi. He said that a Senegalese tackle had been "cynical", then added: "maybe you can put that down to naiveté". Or 'naivety', if you prefer.

Is the first time that these two, seemingly mutually exclusive clichés have ever been used together, to full incoherent effect?

― the pinefox, Thursday, 6 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Perhaps he meant: "That tackle was very Senegal".

― the pinefox, Thursday, 6 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

(PS / what is it with these Everton veterans?)

― the pinefox, Thursday, 6 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Perhaps the tackler was cynical about the action but naive about the likely result?

― Tom, Thursday, 6 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Is it because they is black?

Always worth asking when Everton are involved. [Ducks]

― Nathan Barley, Thursday, 6 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Is it because they is black? Always worth asking when Everton are involved...

― Nathan Barley, Thursday, 6 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Non-sporting answer: "naively cynical" describes like 90% of the youth of America.

― nabisco%%, Thursday, 6 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

is he not saying that this African player has perhaps progressed from naivety to cynicism?

― DV, Thursday, 6 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

A commentator describing an African defender as "naive"? Whatever next? They'll be saying "Their fans bring a lot of colour to the tournament", or something.

― Dom Passantino, Thursday, 6 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

It is a well known fact among commentators that African defenders are naive and German teams are all very disciplined, and all that. They know that without looking at the way they play, and are generally unwilling to let these 'facts' be modified by what actually happens on the pitch, often to an extraordinary degree.

― Martin Skidmore, Thursday, 6 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Nothing naive about Senegal's defending so far in the tournament - well, the flatness in the first half against Denmark - but besides that. The performance of Cisse is kinda like that of Mutiu Adepoju for Nigeria vs Spain last world cup - nothing short of 10/10.

― david h, Thursday, 6 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

What's yer prediction for today everyone? I reckon England 1-0 (Beckham). Scholes will be sent off, and Arg will miss a pen.

― Dr. C, Friday, 7 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

England 1 (Owen) Argentina 3 (Batistuta, Veron, Crespo)

― stevo, Friday, 7 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

As a lifelong Evertonian who couldn't quite understand why we pulled out of signing Viv Anderson in the early 80s, I'd be interested if someone shone some light into this murky corner of Goodison. I mean, EFC's 'policy', in so far as there was one, was clearly very dubious but I'm not sure what was at the bottom of it. Moores? The fans? Gordon Lee?

We might've had a lousy league season but we're having a great World Cup (uninspired and stiff Steven apart) - Linderoth, Alexandersson, Carsley, Moore, Gravesen. Better than the Red Filth anyway.

― Michael Jones, Friday, 7 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I reckon England 1-0 (Beckham).

You're right so far! Still 18 minutes to go...

― Ned Raggett, Friday, 7 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I hope you've made yourself some money there, Dr C.

― Michael Jones, Friday, 7 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

"England 1 (Owen) Argentina 3 (Batistuta, Veron, Crespo) "

You can shut up now, if you like.

― DavidM, Friday, 7 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

£80!!

What a match. We can win it now. WE CAN WIN IT!!!

Forget Aimar, Veron, Crespo et al - all that talk on ILE of *fearing* them. Ha! We could/should have won 3-0. They were as dodgy at the back as in 98.

Butt, Scholes, Beckham, Cole, Rio, Owen, Sol - all magnificent. Even bloody Sinclair and Mills were immense.

My one fear is that we HAVE to take chances when they come. Owen missed two that he should have scored, and Beckham should have done better when he cut in from the left-hand side.

― Dr. C, Friday, 7 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

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