IRA: C/D

the real ira

the quasi ira

the friendly ira (sein fein i believe)

to be honest they sound like a gang of delusional schizophrenics - i dont like them or there work so def a dud

LETS JUST BE FRIENDS

Or do you?

I think we'll have to wait for the 20th century dust to settle before any meaningful C/D inquiry can be conducted.

I have to say, tho, I don't love them. Not at all. Wrong board, Mr Pinefox.

It may also help if you clarify whether you're asking us to weigh up their entire history, or assess them at a given point in time, e.g. right now. (Put another way, at the time of the Birmingham pub bombings, would anyone here have answered "classic" to this qn?)

ETA (this week): classic or dud? Dud obv.

Also they do have a series of different images - 1) the freedom fighters who confer with the ANC; 2) the bloody murderers who blow up pensioners (or Tories); 3) the local gangsters who do xyz re. drug wars, kneecapping etc.

? Um, call me a little befuddled all around...

Dud.

however, I hate the IRA. they are anti-democratic, hypocritical, and typical of the whiny discourse of "we're much more oppressed than you" that dominates Northern Ireland politics.

one of the good things about the peace process is that paramilitary groups like the IRA are becoming steadily less and less relevant. Which is a good thing.

That said, no love here for the IRA. They seem no better than the Mafia, and in some respects even worse -- at least the Mafia tries not to target innocent people. Can't say I have much tolerance for people who talk up the "liberation" of their people at one moment, while peddling smack and randomly terrorizing those they purport to represent at the other moment. And I have even less tolerance for certain very stupid Americans who give such common thugs money, in support of a cause they don't understand for a "homeland" they have not lived in for well over 100 years and support of which is contrary to America's best interests. (I also feel the same way about certain loudmouths in the Cuban-American and Jewish-American communities, lest anyone wrongly think that my feelings stem from anti-Irish animus).

I am slightly surprised at the Vicar's comment re. violence vs oppression - perhaps as (as others have pointed out) the definition of 'oppression' might itself always be debatable. eg: were Derry Catholics in the 60s/70s oppressed enough to justify violence?

It's complicated. I guess the geezer Miller's comments are very ethical.

Also - as far as I know, the Mafia are scum: I fear that overrated TV programmes have lessened people's outrage at gangsters.

I don't think the Catholic people up north were suffering that level of oppression.

Yes it is.

currently d/ling the highly-regarded Provos, Loyalists and Brits documentary series, is this a good explanation of the whole situation?

also what's a good film equivalent? hunger from 2008 covers the bobby sands incident but do any good films take a broader look of the troubles?

interest piqued after reading this http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2294241/SPECIAL-INVESTIGATION-The-lynch-mob-man-God-truth-atrocity-seared-Britains-psyche.html (apologies for DM link)

the devils own

thanks d. not so highly-rated on imdb - http://www.imdb.co.uk/title/tt0118972/ - would you say it's one of the best though?

i think darragh might be winding you up there. movie below is a my fave movie on the troubles

http://youtu.be/KyRL73HIvqg

oh, is devil's own widely known as dogshit? never heard of it.

seen elephant many years back, great film but looking for something with more detail (and dialogue)

lol darragh

also getting The Year London Blew Up. docu-drama from 2005. the blurb on box.bz sounds interesting:

Ever since the atrocity of 9/11 and 7 th July, London has lived daily with the lurking threat of terrorist attack. It seems unimaginable but it has happened before - thirty years ago. In 1975 the capital endured 12 months of the most sustained bombing since the Blitz from the most ruthless underground cell the Provisional IRA ever assembled.

It really was THE YEAR LONDON BLEW UP. Fifty explosions rocked the capital at a rate of one per week, leaving 35 people dead and scores more maimed for life. They assassinated the TV personality Ross McWhirter after he announced a £50,000 bounty for their capture. They bombed the flat of former Prime Minister Ted Heath. They bombed Selfridge's and Harrods. They killed innocent bystanders like Professor Gordon Hamilton-Fairley, the country's leading cancer specialist. They even set off bombs in pillar boxes, patenting the 'come-on' booby trap to target bomb disposal officers. They were also responsible for the pub bombings for which the Guildford Four were wrongly and notoriously convicted.

Based on unique accounts from the IRA bombers, THE YEAR LONDON BLEW UP is a major two-hour drama-documentary made by Blast! Films for Channel 4. Sir Peter Imbert, the chief police negotiator with the IRA, gives his first interview about how the police trapped the gang and how he talked them out of Balcombe Street at the hair-raising climax.

Eye-witnesses and victims - from the bus conductor who was kidnapped in the boot of a car to Rosemary McWhirter who answered the doorbell to see her husband shot dead in front of her - testify to their first hand experience of the terror. So do members of the Matthews family from Balcombe Street . Channel 4 News anchor Jon Snow recalls covering the siege as a radio reporter. Combined with remarkable archive footage and intense dramatisation the experience of Londoners living through the onslaught is vividly recreated.

As for the Balcombe Street Gang - Joseph O'Connell, Eddie Butler, Harry Duggan and Hugh Doherty - they were sentenced to life imprisonment many times over. All four survived to be released under the Good Friday agreement and were hailed by Sinn Fein leader Gerry Adams as 'our Nelson Mandelas'.

The Long Good Friday is not really about the IRA, but worth watching (again)

It seems unimaginable but it has happened before

What a strange sentence. There were bombs going off in London for decades.

is the above DM article biased or warped or untrue in anyway? doesn't read like it is but, y'know, it's the DM so i have to ask

good shout on LGF, loved it first time round

Sorry, couldnt resist.

has darragh ever answered op's q?

Local thugs find use in idealism, idealists find use for local thugs, idk maybe it started out differently (tbf from even a sparse study of eg occupied derry pre 70 would suggest a violent uprising was on the cards) but idk, idk. There's fuck all of them as was 'involved' that i ever knew that wouldnt have found some excuse to wreck lives besides if it'd come to that.

top bants, d, top bants

Pipe bants for the day that's in it

the year london blew up takes a one-sided dim view of the IRA, and doesn't really address their motivations, but is fairly well-made and watchable despite that. hoping the PL&B doc series goes into more (even-handed) depth

provos, loyalists & brits documentary series is excellent. everything i wanted, although an update on the past 15 years would be good.