College Girls

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why are college girls such an object of pervertalist fascination to Americans? I went to a College, and while some of the girls were pretty foxy many of them were no great shakes - kind of like an average cross-section of society. Yet jazz mags are always bringing out College Girl supplements. Why?

― DV (dirtyvicar), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 19:01 (twenty-three years ago)

Of course, I did not go to an American college.

― DV (dirtyvicar), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 19:01 (twenty-three years ago)

b/c college is widely fetishized as the place where girls do their most drinking, partying, 'experimenting' and wanton sexing obv

― mark p (Mark P), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 19:04 (twenty-three years ago)

I went to a small Jesuit college where all the girls were named Mary. On weekends I would often visit friends in larger state universities and what I saw astounded me. Young fresh faced nubiles hoisting beer bongs winking provocatively in my direction, charity car washes in denim cutoffs, nude backgammon etc.

― lawrence kansas, Wednesday, 11 September 2002 19:42 (twenty-three years ago)

well the mag supplements are there to gobble up college girls' newfound Lines of Credit presumably (20.99% APR); but otherwise America's fascination with Youth Culture seems to have taken a turn for the outright pedo. Examples abound, but I remember in the early days of the internet all the porno sites/spam emails were just your usual XXX Hardcore Porn, now they are 99% Barely Legal Teens! or College Coed Sluts!... Blame Mtv?

― Aaron A., Wednesday, 11 September 2002 19:48 (twenty-three years ago)

Aaron nailed it; it's as close to legalised pedophilia as the law will allow. Blame Pfizer / Boomer aging.

― James Blount, Wednesday, 11 September 2002 19:52 (twenty-three years ago)

Blame Mtv

or perhaps the fashion industry

over the past 20 years, the trajectory of the idealized female form has gotten slighter, smoother, straighter (ie less voluptuous), skinnier -----> children

― mark p (Mark P), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 19:54 (twenty-three years ago)

boomer aging yes but there are also built-in benefits to idealizing and worshipping a body type that many once had but subsequently matured out of

mega psychological impact!

― mark p (Mark P), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 19:55 (twenty-three years ago)

If you trust statistics, the more education an American woman has, the more sexually experimental she is and the more likely she is to be open to casual sex, blowjobs, and group sex. (There are reasons so many professors are married to their former graduate students).

What more needs to be said?

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 20:19 (twenty-three years ago)

When did "Pedo" start meaning 18-22 yr. old women? God almighty. Isn't lots of the target youth audience for magazines etc. in the same age-demographic anyway?

I suspect it has more to do with the "girl next door you went to school with" type thang which in my understanding is an old American phenom.

Also, how can we blame MTV when the MTV demographic isn't even old enough for college?

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 20:37 (twenty-three years ago)

Haha -- the "culture of pedo" is that MTV markets images of 18-22 yr olds to 11-16 yr olds!

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 20:37 (twenty-three years ago)

it is snaring them into the evil belief that older foax are sexy oh wait...

― mark s (mark s), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 20:40 (twenty-three years ago)

When did "Pedo" start meaning 18-22 yr. old women?

When the men saying it hit 27 and realized that some of the girls they were perving on were still in elementary school when they graduated from high school.

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 20:42 (twenty-three years ago)

We're talking about porn that uses the models' nearly-illegal youth as it's selling point. It did occur to me after posting that almost-all porn models are 'barely legal' (ie. 18-22), only a few mags fetishsize it by dressing them like little girls.

― James Blount, Wednesday, 11 September 2002 20:56 (twenty-three years ago)

I like the whole notion of "barely legal" like the law turns into sliding-scale moral standards instead of just, y'know, it is or it isn't.

What else besides people can be "barely legal"?

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 20:58 (twenty-three years ago)

Napster

― mark s (mark s), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 21:02 (twenty-three years ago)

haha dan, does it count for the reverse, such as when i was dating a 28 yr old at 21?

― jess (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 21:07 (twenty-three years ago)

for for that matter: when nancy is 22, i'll be 27. am i a pedo, or merely in love?

― jess (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 21:08 (twenty-three years ago)

What else besides people can be "barely legal"?

Sammy Hagar

― James Blount, Wednesday, 11 September 2002 21:10 (twenty-three years ago)

sterling why does the "barely" part so confound you when it is obviously the selling point? while the hypersexualization of these 18 yr old "women" isn't pedophilia per se, it's as close as the media are allowed to get.

― Aaron A., Wednesday, 11 September 2002 21:10 (twenty-three years ago)

and video game emulators.

(was there ever a sammy hagar video game?)

― jess (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 21:11 (twenty-three years ago)

jess = Steve Garvey?

― James Blount, Wednesday, 11 September 2002 21:11 (twenty-three years ago)

(haha, for the record i'm 24, so everything is kosher.)

― jess (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 21:16 (twenty-three years ago)

Nothing much to do with pedo fantasies I think. More:

i) girl-next-door (girl-next-dorm)

ii) Even though these women have got all uppity and educated they still like a good hard fuck.

I agree with DV though - it's odd that this form of pervertalism hasn't caught on in the UK/Ireland. Even allowing for different age of consents, "Sixth Form Sluts" are conspicuous by their top-shelf absence.

― Tom (Groke), Wednesday, 11 September 2002 22:56 (twenty-three years ago)

two words: school disco

― mark p (Mark P), Thursday, 12 September 2002 00:34 (twenty-three years ago)

agreed wholeheartedly. 'barely' is the key.

"this is absolutely as close as you can get to the pedo you secretly desire and still be on the right side of the law"

― mark p (Mark P), Thursday, 12 September 2002 00:36 (twenty-three years ago)

for for that matter: when nancy is 22, i'll be 27. am i a pedo, or merely in love?

in love obv

what does this have to do with anything?

― mark p (Mark P), Thursday, 12 September 2002 00:37 (twenty-three years ago)

I don't want to sound perverted, but YOUTHFUL looks are what every man craves (well, me anyway). It's good to find a girl that has the look of a teenager, but is older than her appearance suggests. My conscience is clear, but my sordid desires are still satisfied! Everyone's a winner!

― weasel diesel (K1l14n), Thursday, 12 September 2002 01:01 (twenty-three years ago)

I'm sorry--which jazz magazines are endorsing this college girl = godess viewpoint? I wish when I was in college someone thought my demograhic was lust-worthy... In Japan it is the high school girl who is almighty--though this may be morphing into the junior high school girl as we speak...

― Mary (Mary), Thursday, 12 September 2002 01:02 (twenty-three years ago)

mark: "what does this have to do with anything?"

dan: "When did "Pedo" start meaning 18-22 yr. old women?
When the men saying it hit 27 and realized that some of the girls they were perving on were still in elementary school when they graduated from high school."

― jess (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 12 September 2002 01:21 (twenty-three years ago)

jess i think we both know you're in the clear

unless you secretly regard nancy as a "barely legal college chixor"

― mark p (Mark P), Thursday, 12 September 2002 01:43 (twenty-three years ago)

"top shelf"?

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 12 September 2002 04:04 (twenty-three years ago)

mark, i didn't take umbrage with dan's statement because i secretly fear that i'm a pedophile!

i'm sensetive about the "age thing" because i've been on both sides of it. it wasn't fun being looked at as immature man-boy meat anymore than it's fun being called a cradle robber (even in jest.) dan's statement was vague enough that although i knew he wasn't talking about "true wuv" in this context rather pervert mentalists oozing for underage coozing, it was still a little uncomfortable an assumption.

tracer i'm assuming "top shelf" in this instance means "all her teeth."

― jess (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 12 September 2002 04:09 (twenty-three years ago)

Mary - high school girl is the ideal here also (see: Spears, Britney), but these girls are clearly, legally-madated, college-age (and also, pretty clearly, not college students). I haven't seen any porn that plays the "College Girl" angle much (well, besides Playboy). I haven't seen any print-porn rather; I've seen plenty of "Girls Dorm Web-cam" pornsites, but I think these play more on voyeur tendacies than half-hearted pedophilia.

― James Blount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 September 2002 04:25 (twenty-three years ago)

"I've seen plenty of "Girls Dorm Web-cam" pornsites" should read "I've, um, read about plenty of "Girls Dorm Web-cam pornsites". There was an article about it in the Times. Or something."

― James Blount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 September 2002 04:27 (twenty-three years ago)

mmm hmm.

― jess (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 12 September 2002 04:44 (twenty-three years ago)

I thought this was going to be about the St Hilda's documentary.

― Sam (chirombo), Thursday, 12 September 2002 08:09 (twenty-three years ago)

Same here. New thread methinks.

― RickyT (RickyT), Thursday, 12 September 2002 08:16 (twenty-three years ago)

two words: school disco

saucy schoolgirls have long been a staple of Brit smut. But the college girl thing - nah.

could it be that more people over here go to College, and hence College girls are less of a mystery.

― DV (dirtyvicar), Thursday, 12 September 2002 08:23 (twenty-three years ago)

Vicar: I don't know what 'jazz mags' are. But the kind of girlz you and others ae describing sound tasty to me. I don't think I see the mystery.

― the pinefox, Thursday, 12 September 2002 08:31 (twenty-three years ago)

School Disco is nothing to do with it b/c the girls are 20somethings playing at being 'at school' i.e. reliving their own teenage sexual experiences with a knowing wink.

Tracer/Jess - "top shelf" is boringly literal: in newsagents in the UK the naughty mags go on the top shelf so the kids can't reach them.

― Tom (Groke), Thursday, 12 September 2002 08:36 (twenty-three years ago)

Jazz mags - Downbeat, The Wire (parts of it anyway), etc...

― James Blount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 September 2002 08:44 (twenty-three years ago)

The reality of college hardly needs to match the fantasy to sell the fantasy, just look at the popularity of "women in prison" movie like Caged Heat. I have a sneaking suspicion that many prison officers do not look like Brigitte Nielson or whoever it was.

― tigerclawskank, Thursday, 12 September 2002 08:51 (twenty-three years ago)

Naked backgammon sounds like the greatest thing ever.

I clearly went to the wrong college.

― tigerclawskank, Thursday, 12 September 2002 08:51 (twenty-three years ago)

School Disco is nothing to do with it b/c the girls are 20somethings playing at being 'at school' i.e. reliving their own teenage sexual experiences with a knowing wink.

reliving my own teenage sexual experiences would be rather depressing, knowing wink or otherwise.

― DV (dirtyvicar), Thursday, 12 September 2002 10:16 (twenty-three years ago)

My observation of the different cultures indicates that American College Girls have similar morality to British Backpacker Girls - hence the fascination.

― toraneko (toraneko), Thursday, 12 September 2002 10:28 (twenty-three years ago)

Jess: I was thinking more about the 27-year-old perving at the 18-year-old and then thinking, "Oh, when I graduated from high school, she was NINE. How saucy!"

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 12 September 2002 10:44 (twenty-three years ago)

over the past 20 years, the trajectory of the idealized female form has gotten slighter, smoother, straighter (ie less voluptuous), skinnier -----> children

I think that should be -----> boy, actually.

When did "Pedo" start meaning 18-22 yr. old women? God almighty.

I think we should start a thread about paedophilia (we meaning not me though, I don't want anyone to misinterpret my interest in the word).

I think it is fascinating that paedophilia is used to describe sex that involves people who have gone through puberty but not yet reached the age of consent.

I also think it is weird that the word paedophile is used to describe people who abuse children. Paedophile meants child lover, why use it for people who, judging by their actions, are child haters?

Why is there no differentiation between people who terrorise and torture children (sexually or otherwise) and people who are sexually attracted to pre-pubescent children? (Of course this is based on the idea that it is not possible to carry out sexual relations with a child with out causing the child harm - but is this necessarily true?)

― toraneko (toraneko), Thursday, 12 September 2002 10:46 (twenty-three years ago)

The presumption of that neccessary harm is what age of consent laws are based on. The future harm of the child isn't legally the point though, it's that the act is by definition non-consensual (in that a child is not competent to consent). Now you might argue that having an age of consent is a bad idea - and actually ILX had a pretty bruising argument on this a few months ago - but I'd disagree. The concept of not being mature enough to take a decision on something is one I agree with.

― Tom (Groke), Thursday, 12 September 2002 10:51 (twenty-three years ago)

Age of consent/majority is a strange concept insofar as it assumes that people mature at the same rate.

Logically puberty would seem to be a better indicator of whether someone should be allowed to have sex.

For drinking, driving, voting etc. maybe there should be a "mature enough to make own decisions" test. I know a fair few > 30yr old people who would probably fail!

― toraneko (toraneko), Thursday, 12 September 2002 11:01 (twenty-three years ago)

An arbitrary age ensures that there are the same rules for everyone though, i.e. is 'fairer'. A system in which individuals were certified 'ready' when they hit puberty would have to be regulated i.e. licenses or puberty certificates would be required. That would be a) very expensive, b) very open to abuse.

― Tom (Groke), Thursday, 12 September 2002 11:05 (twenty-three years ago)

Yes, the age of consent battles were fought on the R. Kelly thread. Of course the age is arbitray, so are speed limits, so are the blood alcohol limits for DUIs.

― James Blount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 September 2002 11:16 (twenty-three years ago)

>>> British Backpacker Girls

who are they and where can I find one?

― the pinefox, Thursday, 12 September 2002 11:36 (twenty-three years ago)

Come backpacking in Australia and you'll find many of them. I'm not sure if they're really into Brit guys though - perhaps Australian Backpacker Girls are the equivalent in Britain? I dunno, they all make me tremble (or should that be quiver?) with horror. Backpacking = leave brain, manners and morals at home.

― toraneko (toraneko), Thursday, 12 September 2002 11:56 (twenty-three years ago)

I think backpackers are generally regarded as easy. A friend of mine had a sister who was apparntly at it all summer when travelling and the opposite during college term.

― tigerclawskank, Thursday, 12 September 2002 13:18 (twenty-three years ago)

I can't imagine the 27 year old who imagines his 18-year-old girlfriend as a 9 year old actually exists - he's interested in the 18 year old, for heaven's sake!

As ever, it all comes back to ego. From a male perspective (generalisation, I know), there is an appeal in being maybe a girl's first lover, or being able to teach and nurture them sexually. Conversely, whether we/they like it or not, girls who've been around the block a bit are frowned upon by some, and thereby lose some of their sexual appeal. Innocence is really little more than ignorance - the less a girl knows, the more we feel we can imprint ourselves, our values etc. on her. So we feel big and powerful precisely because she's small and naive.

But it remains a fantasy for most people. Men who are grown up enough to have and appreciate a reasonably mature, adult relationship (i.e. most but by no means all 27 year olds) will, by and large, want to have that relationship with someone with whome they can communicate on similar levels. So whereas the base desire to have sex with or look at naked pictures of, younger women/girls remains strong, in reality it stays an occasional saucy thought for well-balanced individuals.

On other subjects, I think Toraneko's otm about many things. I look forward to reading the dedicated thread.

― Mark C (Mark C), Thursday, 12 September 2002 14:35 (twenty-three years ago)

I can't imagine the 27 year old who imagines his 18-year-old girlfriend as a 9 year old actually exists - he's interested in the 18 year old, for heaven's sake!

You must have a much less neurotic circle of friends than I do, Mark.

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 12 September 2002 14:37 (twenty-three years ago)

Mark C: your first point is obviously spot-on. But I think you are getting distracted by 'psychological' factors (re. 'experience', 'innocence' etc): and I think the appeal of young gorgeous people is 'physical' (re. ... bodies). But as you know, I don't know much about this stuff.

― the pinefox, Thursday, 12 September 2002 15:28 (twenty-three years ago)

Ugh, why would anyone want to be someone's first lover? What an awful experience.

But yes, I think the appeal of College Chicks is that they are notorious sluts.

Now that I've graduated, I've cleaned up my act.

― Mandee, Thursday, 12 September 2002 15:55 (twenty-three years ago)

who wants to be my first lover? i nominate the pinefox, for making me feel omnicapable!!

― mark s (mark s), Thursday, 12 September 2002 15:59 (twenty-three years ago)

Being someones first lover = good value as you get to train them just how you like it.

It is a bit of a responsibility too though as there is going to be some sort of psychological importance to the whole thing.

― toraneko (toraneko), Thursday, 12 September 2002 16:13 (twenty-three years ago)

I think it is fascinating that paedophilia is used to describe sex that involves people who have gone through puberty but not yet reached the age of consent.

Some of the less-sensationalist articles on sexual abuse by priests used the term "ephebophilia" to refer to attraction to adolescent males. What would be the counterpart in reference to adolescent females -- "nymphetophilia"? "Lolitamania"?

― j.lu (j.lu), Thursday, 12 September 2002 16:46 (twenty-three years ago)

Good clean fun!

― James Blount (James Blount), Friday, 13 September 2002 02:53 (twenty-three years ago)

eight years pass...

jazz?

― jodeci & oracle (kkvgz), Thursday, 30 December 2010 13:59 (fourteen years ago)

who wants to be my first lover? i nominate the pinefox, for making me feel omnicapable!!
― mark s (mark s), Thursday, 12 September 2002

― the pinefox, Thursday, 30 December 2010 14:33 (fourteen years ago)

jazz mags & jazz cigarettes.

― not everything is a campfire (ian), Thursday, 30 December 2010 17:08 (fourteen years ago)

jazzballs

― but it could have happened when i was playing tesla (chrisv2010), Thursday, 30 December 2010 17:13 (fourteen years ago)

is that like jazz hands?

― ENBB, Thursday, 30 December 2010 17:15 (fourteen years ago)

but with yr balls

― kanellos (gbx), Thursday, 30 December 2010 17:16 (fourteen years ago)

jazzersize

― ice cr?m, Thursday, 30 December 2010 17:17 (fourteen years ago)

college girls like to jazz up their bush into neat little heart shapes and hitler staches.

― but it could have happened when i was playing tesla (chrisv2010), Thursday, 30 December 2010 17:31 (fourteen years ago)

in my days college girls had bushes like 40 year old serbians.

― but it could have happened when i was playing tesla (chrisv2010), Thursday, 30 December 2010 17:33 (fourteen years ago)

wait what's that from? That was in I watched recently.

― ENBB, Thursday, 30 December 2010 17:45 (fourteen years ago)

i love you man.

― but it could have happened when i was playing tesla (chrisv2010), Thursday, 30 December 2010 17:50 (fourteen years ago)

Haha yes! That was it. JK Simmons about Paul Rudd or maybe his brother, I don't remember.

― ENBB, Thursday, 30 December 2010 18:01 (fourteen years ago)

yep.

― but it could have happened when i was playing tesla (chrisv2010), Thursday, 30 December 2010 18:05 (fourteen years ago)

who wants to be my first lover? i nominate the pinefox, for making me feel omnicapable!!

― mark s (mark s), Thursday, 12 September 2002

― the pinefox, Thursday, 30 December 2010 14:33 (4 hours ago) Bookmark

how did this go?

― Rockcrit from the Tuoms (nakhchivan), Thursday, 30 December 2010 19:10 (fourteen years ago)

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